Travel to Europe Just Got more Bureaucratic

Discussion in 'Fencing Discussion' started by jjefferies, Mar 10, 2019.

  1. jjefferies

    jjefferies Podium

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    Taken from the New York Times: As part of an enhanced security process, citizens traveling to the majority of the European Union nations after January 2021 will have to register online and pay a small fee (USD $8.).

    A link: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/09/...html?action=click&module=News&pgtype=Homepage

    In brief we will have to have a passport, go online and register and pay the $8.00 (7 euro) fee. So a credit card is a necessity. Then they will have 3 different forms of identification to prove who you are. The whole thing sounds rather like our TSA security theater. Where if you pay a small fee you get to keep your shoes on when going through their line. Also known as TSA Pre.
     
  2. dberke

    dberke Podium

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    Yes, this is going to be a real burden to all those people who still buy plane tickets to Europe with cash or a check in-person at the airport.

    :eyeroll:

    Dan
     
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  3. bbower

    bbower DE Bracket

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    Thanks for volunteering to pay everyone's $8 fee since it's no big deal.
     
  4. jjefferies

    jjefferies Podium

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    Hey Dan, make all the eye rolls you want. But from my perspective it's another made up bit of security theater with a price tag. They already have your credit card info, and your passport and now they want to charge you for their using them. I think they took a look at what TSA's collecting to allow you to bypass the security wall that TSA created and decided they could make some money too. Basically a tax on people's freedom of travel.
     
  5. neevel

    neevel Armorer

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  6. Strytllr

    Strytllr DE Bracket

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    also sounds like you only have to pay the $8 once for three years worth of travel.
     
  7. teacup

    teacup Podium

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    Explaining the new requirement, the European Union cited the desire “to improve their security level to avoid any further problems with illegal migration and terrorism.” However, the creation of the ETIAS visa comes after the United States has failed to allow similar travel freedom for all EU members.
    According to CNN, the United States currently requires citizens from Bulgaria, Croatia, Poland, Romania, and Cyprus to obtain similar pre-authorization to enter the country. These are the only EU members that have a screening requirement for US travel. The US and the EU quarreled over this policy in recent years, with the European Commission releasing a report in 2016 requesting that the US grant visa-free travel to these five countries per EU equal-treatment requirements.
     
  8. ReadyFence

    ReadyFence Podium

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    Yep. This is a clap back for a ridiculous US policy.
     
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  9. wwittman

    wwittman Made the Cut

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    Yes, anyone complaining should have a look at his own country's entry requirements first
     
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  10. Inquartata

    Inquartata Podium

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    It may be a tit-for-tat, but it's also a money grab.

    Or maybe it's a way to keep Trump away. "Nope, you don't meet our security criteria. No pass for you!"
     
  11. dberke

    dberke Podium

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    If you can afford a $1000+ ticket to Europe, then yes, an additional $8 is no big deal.

    Dan
     
  12. dberke

    dberke Podium

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    Your comparison with TSA Precheck doesn't really make sense. Precheck is 100% voluntary (and is well worth it, if you travel a lot) while the ETIA not.

    And, when it comes to international travel, there is no such thing as "freedom of travel" - you have to have permission to enter any country that you travel to. We are just lucky that for the most part, US passport holders get that permission for free at the border (in the form of a 90-day visa as a passport stamp.) The EU is now going to charge for that, which is what most countries do.

    When I went to China last year, I had to pay well over $200 to get a Chinese visa (each time) to allow me to enter. So $8 is a relative bargain.

    Dan
     
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  13. Inquartata

    Inquartata Podium

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    So send me $8, Dan. It's no big deal for you; a relative bargain. :)
     
  14. downunder

    downunder is a Verified Fencing Expertdownunder Podium

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    You guys invented the concept - costs me $14 for an ESTA every 2 years if I want to come to the US.
     
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  15. jjefferies

    jjefferies Podium

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    And I think it's a total rip-off. You guys don't seem to be catching my drift here. All of these charges are for theatrical performances in which we are forced to participate. Speaking only from an (US) American perspective I have yet to hear of or even rumors of TSA actually stopping any acts of state terrorism. And I'm even willing to suspend my disbelief and allow that they "MAY" have stopped some unstable individuals from boarding aircraft with weapons. Though looking at the number of youtube postings about crazies and meltdowns on aircraft it's obvious they haven't stopped the crazies from boarding.
    If curious you might care to look through
    https://www.schneier.com/crypto-gram/

    We need to move beyond security measures that look good on television to those that actually work, argues Bruce Schneier. Security theater refers to security measures that make people feel more secure without doing anything to actually improve their security. An example: the photo ID checks that have sprung up in office buildings.
    Unfortunately, looking at the TSA and Homeland and comparing to Judicial system, we can clearly see that the long-term trend will be pay-to-play. If as individual, you want any measure of security you will need to pay. If unable to pay the system would default to theater. Right now security always defaults to theater.
     
  16. mfp

    mfp Podium

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    Your drift / rant confuses the role and processes of the TSA with that of countries' border entry officials, comes off as kooky, and is prompting people to look for an old man shouts at clouds gif.
     
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  17. wwittman

    wwittman Made the Cut

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    Exactly. Unless you are in favour of completely open borders everywhere countries will and do set entry policies.
     
  18. jjefferies

    jjefferies Podium

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    Up yours Mike. Though the thread is diverging.
    Uh, Yes. I still remember moving to Canada with everything I owned in a trailer pulled by my VW bug. This was at the height of drug running. They peered under the cover, looked at my paltry documents and waved me on. Returning a couple of years later to the US was just as easy. Our fears of Al Qaeda and Trump's capitalizing on those fears have robbed us of a lot. We fund our intelligence agencies well. And for the most part I think they do a good job. But this Security Theater is just irritating.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
  19. wwittman

    wwittman Made the Cut

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    I agree as far as it goes. But visa and entry fees aren’t related to security theatre. They’re immigration issues.

    But I tour all over the world.
    The only country whose immigration or customs has ever made it unpleasant is the US.
     
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  20. rudd

    rudd Podium

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    On it's way, as soon as you run a country I want to enter. :)
     

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