Ibti and US customs...this is NOT ok

Discussion in 'Water Cooler' started by Purple Fencer, Feb 8, 2017.

  1. Purple Fencer

    Purple Fencer Podium

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    Last edited: Feb 8, 2017
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  2. ReadyFence

    ReadyFence Podium

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    Not okay but 100% believable
     
  3. piste off

    piste off Podium

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    Whoa!

    First they came for people from New Jersey...

    What the flying f***?
     
  4. Purple Fencer

    Purple Fencer Podium

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    Trump's Amerika...certainly not mine.
     
  5. prototoast

    prototoast Podium

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    I want to know more information before passing judgment.
     
  6. ReadyFence

    ReadyFence Podium

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    Here's the basics- she's an American citizen from New Jersey, traveling on a US passport.

    Oh, and she's black, rocks a hijab and has a funny-sounding terrorist name.

    Which of those two fact sets do you think might cause her to be detained?
     
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  7. Inquartata

    Inquartata Podium

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    I have to admit that I was expecting this to happen sooner or later. It's...deplorable.
     
  8. mfp

    mfp Podium

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    Some articles (such as the one linked in the OP) have run with headlines stating "Olympian Ibtihaj Muhammad says she was held by US Customs after Trump travel ban". Yet it's curious and odd that the articles don't quote her as saying that ... specifically the "after Trump travel ban" part. They mention she said she was detained by U.S. customs "a few weeks ago". More information people (including those of us completely against the ban) could be curious about might include: Was her detention actually after the travel ban? Was it after Trump's inauguration? Could it have even been during the last administration? [The most recent out of US event result the FIE lists for her was Cancun in Dec.]

    Without more information, blaming that detention on the travel ban or "Trump's Amerika...certainly not mine" could be premature.
     
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  9. Steve Khinoy

    Steve Khinoy DE Bracket

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    Let me be out of line here. I deplore the execution of the travel ban. But Ibti's story, as reported, lacks specifics: time, place, details.
    I've been questioned at customs, am a citizen, am not Muslim, was not carrying narcotics, etc., etc. But it happens.
    I'd really like to believe that Ibti's problems were the result of Trump, whom I really dislike (to simplify). But can we be sure?
     
  10. Inquartata

    Inquartata Podium

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    Yeah, the ban went into effect on, what, January 27th? That's like two weeks ago. The article quoting Ibti is dated Feb 8th. It's possible that she conflated 2 weeks with "a few weeks".

    But even if it was before the ban, it's not OK if the detention was because she fit some profile despite being an American citizen by birth.

    It is possible that the detention was for something else. People who are neither Muslim nor black nor female do get detained, too, one supposes, for various reasons. But it does look suspicious.
     
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  11. damianip

    damianip Podium

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    I'd like to hear US Customs version, although I suspect someone over there is busily crafting a statement.

    None of this should come as a surprise, given the xenophobic enabling rhetoric from the new regime.

    Sad... very sad. :)
     
  12. Steve Khinoy

    Steve Khinoy DE Bracket

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    OK, let me get deeper into trouble. Is any type of profiling OK?
     
  13. Inquartata

    Inquartata Podium

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  14. twisterfencing

    twisterfencing Podium

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    I was born in Texas (US Passport holder). Parents are from Sicilia. I am on the US Federal pre-screened list, from both FBI and TSA.
    I have been "detained" in the following countries:
    1. Turkey
    2. China
    3. Israel
    4. USA - New York Kennedy Airport
    5. Bahrain

    Turkey and USA detainment's both resulted in full strip searches. Down to my socks.

    Anyone going to try and "blame" Trump over this? Not me! It happens!

    Its a price "we" should expect to pay to have a secure border.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2017
  15. Mihail

    Mihail DE Bracket

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    Sorry you got strip-searched. Also, please forgive me if I'm ignorant on the subject, but what does that have to do with a secure border? I am missing the connection.
     
  16. David Sierra

    David Sierra DE Bracket

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    If we had actual REAL security instead of "security theatre" that would be different. Instead though, we have pretend wannabe security that makes a big show.

    Harassing people based upon their religious background for the purposes of security theatre is not ok.
     
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  17. twisterfencing

    twisterfencing Podium

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    The basis of this thread is that a fencer of "our family" was detained because she wears a hijab and was detained at an airport.
    They are wanting to try and tie this to the Travel Band of the 7 countries recently. See post #4, post #7, post #8
    My point is: Its not something new. This happens all the time, I know, lived through it many times from my posts.
    The very process of detaining someone is to vett them to insure no problems are coming into this country, aka: secure border.

     
  18. twisterfencing

    twisterfencing Podium

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    David,
    You are correct, glad it changing though.
    You and I have been in enough countries that do have a true REAL security, like it or not, this is what this country is going to be moving towards.
    I agree with you on your religious background statement. It's just unfortunate that "most" not all, terrorist activity comes from the Middle East area and that is what "most" countries are on the look out for. It's not a good thing, it is just what it is.

     
  19. Mihail

    Mihail DE Bracket

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    In that case, I have to take exception to your point(s). There is no evidence that these detentions of people make our border more secure. If you post and claim that they do, the onus is on you to present evidence.

    Secondly, your anecdote, while an interesting personal story, is irrelevant. Yes, lots of people get detained all over the world. But when evaluating and deciding on policy decisions, patterns are more important. There is no pattern of Texas-born people of Sicilian descent being regularly detained. There *is* a pattern of people with Arabic names or from Arabic backgrounds being detained for no reason. If Ibti's case was an isolated incident, that would be one thing. It's not. It happens a lot more frequently to brown people named Muhammad than it does to others.

    Thirdly, while of course the issue is related to the Travel Ban in sentiment, the event in the article took place well before that. That doesn't change the fact that the event is part of a pattern as mentioned previously.

    (And a minor fourth point, quotation marks are used to make a word's meaning "ironic," not *emphasized.* :) )
     
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  20. Inquartata

    Inquartata Podium

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    Mmm. That you and I have not been shown evidence does not mean that none exists. This is what security clearances are all about.

    As an example, I have never seen evidence of the identities of undercover law enforcement officers or intelligence operatives. Nor should I. Does this mean that there are no such persons?
     

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