Chuck vs. Bruce

[homerdjs]

I read that there is a video of Steven Segal sparring Chuck Norris on a movie set in the 70's. I would kill to see that. If anyone knows how I can get my hands on that or ANY OTHER sparring videos from tv shows or anything featuring famous martial artists sparring I would love to know. Please E-mail me at homerdjs@yahoo.com if you have any information.

[ram-z]

any body who knows anything about martial arts will know that mma rules, if not held back by the limitations of competition rules mma fighters are unparalelled.

earlier on in the thread some one mentioned that bruce lee incorperated many styles into his own, this is not correct, JKD (The way of intercepting fist) is actually based upon it not having any style, this is what makes JKD what it is.

Personnaly I am a shoot fighter so I am used to fighting against different types of martail arts, by far the best stand up work is thai boxing, these guys can pack a hell of a kick and there deffense is excellent.

[whtouche]

Originally posted by ram-z

earlier on in the thread some one mentioned that bruce lee incorperated many styles into his own, this is not correct, JKD (The way of intercepting fist) is actually based upon it not having any style, this is what makes JKD what it is.

You seem confused. The two things you stated were not by any means mutually exclusive. His philosophy was not to be bound by any one style, IE not just use throws if you practice judo. From that he incorporated many different aspects of different styles, including striking from muay thai, among others.

[ram-z]

Originally posted by whtouche
You seem confused. The two things you stated were not by any means mutually exclusive. His philosophy was not to be bound by any one style, IE not just use throws if you practice judo. From that he incorporated many different aspects of different styles, including striking from muay thai, among others.

so in essence we are both right, by incorporating many different aspects of multiple martial arts the style of jkd is no specific style or in other terms "no style" how ever there are styles incorperated into that (if that makes sense), have you ever read the tao of jeet kun do? its some intersting reading. you sound like you know martial arts, do you do anything your self?

[whtouche]

Indeed it seems we're both on the right track, and the disagreement exists only in the interpretation of words. His philosophy, while it can be described as a lack of any specific style, would more accurately, I think, be said to not be bound by any style, thus freeing yourself to incorporate aspects of other styles. I feel like I just used the word style way too much and will now stop

I have infact read the tao of jkd, as well as "jeet kune do: bruce lee's commentaries on the martial way" - I believe I got the title correct...it's been a while. As well as at least one more of Bruce Lee's books. As much as I would absolutely love to be able to, I do not currently practice any martial arts. In an ideal world I would be very skilled in several martial arts, speak 5 different languages, etc etc. But as things currently stand, if I had any more time or money, it would probably all be spent fencing
Having recently bought myself a drum set and began attempting to teach myself how to play I'm running up an ever increasing free time debt

[ram-z]

so we are in agreement then.

You should take up a martial art, its good for both body and mind, since i've started (about a year ago) i feel stronger and quicker, plus its a good way to let out all that frustration after a hard days work.

So far I've studied kempo karate, judo, kick boxing, and now shoot fighting, although i study thai boxing as my stand up martil art whislt training at shoot i intend to start seperate thai boxing class's in order to improve, bjj would also be good to help my ground work, basically i want to learn martial arts but bring them all together as a shoot fighter, being from the states you have got more oppertunity to do the things i want to do, here in the uk there isn't many places to train.

[Black Jeebus]

So you started a year ago and have managed to learn all those styles. No offense but you are a guppy in the ways of martial arts. You really aren't in a position to say what style owns another. If you have been at it a year now and studying the way you must be if you study all those forms you can't possibly be very far advanced in any of those forms. Unless you have devoted your life to the pursuit and study greater than 8 hours a day. I have taken some form of martial art for most of life (granted that is only 20 years) and I still wouldnt presume to say what style of martial art is preferable to another. And as far as incorporating all those arts together that is like someone teaching you to walk and sit down at the same time. If someone is in fact teaching you all those styles at one time I would question them as to their reasoning. Classical martial arts have basic beginnings for a reason. Just as an example: to deliver an effective kick (of the highly stylized version such as a Muy Thai, or TaeKwonDo version) you literally have to learn to stand and move. You shouldn't (in my opinion) being learning all that at the same time. Even Bruce Lee didn't learn a bunch of different styles at one time. He learned one then moved on to another.

[ram-z]

Originally posted by Black Jeebus
So you started a year ago and have managed to learn all those styles. No offense but you are a guppy in the ways of martial arts. You really aren't in a position to say what style owns another. If you have been at it a year now and studying the way you must be if you study all those forms you can't possibly be very far advanced in any of those forms. Unless you have devoted your life to the pursuit and study greater than 8 hours a day. I have taken some form of martial art for most of life (granted that is only 20 years) and I still wouldnt presume to say what style of martial art is preferable to another. And as far as incorporating all those arts together that is like someone teaching you to walk and sit down at the same time. If someone is in fact teaching you all those styles at one time I would question them as to their reasoning. Classical martial arts have basic beginnings for a reason. Just as an example: to deliver an effective kick (of the highly stylized version such as a Muy Thai, or TaeKwonDo version) you literally have to learn to stand and move. You shouldn't (in my opinion) being learning all that at the same time. Even Bruce Lee didn't learn a bunch of different styles at one time. He learned one then moved on to another.

In stating that I had only been at it for a year I was reffering to shoot fighting, I have studied martial arts from the age of 5 and i'm 21 now (22 next month), no offence but only being 20 i beleive the "guppy" comment you made could infact be reffered back to your self (that was meant without malice), I moved on from various styles such as Kempo and Kick boxing as I wanted to better myself as a real fighter not what i would refer to as "a style fighter", by this I mean that karate and such martial arts are to bound by their individual ways were as shoot fighting gives me the oppertunity to use my full potential, granted it does have a specific style but this style is more suited to my body type and MY fighting style.

I totally agree with you regarding learning how the body moves and such like, I was once a begginer to, even now after a year of shoot fighting I still like to constantly go over the basics as you will never truly master the greater techniques if you cannot handle the basics.

drop me a reply, its nice to talk to people that know of the arts

[Black Jeebus]

I totally agree with rounding yourself out as a fighter however intially I had misunderstood your comment to mean that you had studied all those styles in the space of a year. I do believe that if you are going to try to pick something up from a certain style you need to start from the very beginning as if you don't know anything about martial arts (very hard to do sometimes) because for the most parts while each style might have similar basics they each have a uniqueness to them that you might miss if you just take some bit of footwork or a certain technique from them. Unfortunately to really get inside and see the basics all come together into a complete style requires a time commitment most people who want to pick and choose from styles can't (aren't willing) to make. So you often see those people who want to be total fighters never really incorporating what they learn effectively because they don't understand the real value of whatever they have taken from disparate styles. People often say just look at the success of Bruce Lee, but what you really have to remember is that Bruce Lee is not the average person by any means. Saying "Bruce Lee was able to do it well" is like saying "Einstein figured it out relativity why can't I."

[ram-z]

you have hit the nail on the head, to many people these days want to be good at a certain style but they are not willing to put in the effort into getting there , if people really wanted to be good at their respective styles they would not hesitate in putting in the hard work and dedication it takes to be good.

at the moment i'm training at shoot four times a week, thats between going to the gym and cardio work outs, i'm always covered in bruises from shoot and I've even had to have time off of due to injuries, now i know this might sound strange but after a while you get addicted to the pain , when you wake up and you aching all over it gives you a sense of acheivment (but that might just be me).

So what do you actually do? you havn't mentioned anything yet?

[Black Jeebus]

I started in ****o Ryu but didn't really get anywhere with that before my family could no longer afford it. A few years later I started Taekwondo and Hapkido and stuck with that throughout most of my highschool days until I had a falling out with my instructor who was a good teacher but kind of an unethical businessman. I had to lay off the Martial Arts for a while there but am happy to be doing something competitive again. Truthfully I enjoy fencing much more than anything else I've tried, I like the social atmosphere of fencing. Everything else it was just go to class then go home, but with fencing (at least for my club) you go to fencing then everyone gose out and gets something to eat and has drinks together. While admitedly even if the other martial arts clubs went out for drinks/food after class I wouldn't have been able to go there's still the fact that they didn't. They didn't seem interested in being that kind of organization.

edit: I know exactly what you mean about waking up sore. I've never seen a group go cold quite as quickly as a Taekwondo class. One minute we would all be doing these impressive Taekwondo kicks and spinning and being generally flashy then we'd sit for a bit and everyone would start to hobble when they got up cause they went cold.