Funny Story: You've heard of "Fight like you Train" but...

[Feanor]

... I've carried that one ridiculous step further to "Train like you Train"

What the heck is that you might say? Well, as a little background:

During drill at our Salle, as probably everyone here has experienced, the line of fencers moves up and down the floor executing movement and attacks as called out by the coach...

Of course, the straight thrust with lunge is one of the fundamental parts of this drill... But over time I started to notice that along with being able to practice good form for the attack, the "pause" that followed the command started to get ingrained in my "motion memory" That is, the momentary delay between the command for "extend-LUNGE!" and the next command almost became part of the execution.

I was discovering during practice bouts that I would execute straight thrust with lunge, and then hold there for just a moment like a statue, just like in drill, which was of course ample time for my opponent to parry-riposte into me like I was a practice dummy It became part of my fencing "thinking" that the attack was always SUPPOSED to land successfully, thus halting the action

In an effort to remove this vulnerability, I began drilling always following the straight thrust instantly with the arm recovery, and then later with parry-4... So now, its difficult to execute that particulary attack seperately... the recovery or the parry is allmost part of the same move...

During one practice, the coach called me up to help demonstrate a particular move... He went on "My opponent now executes straight thrust with lunge..." he signalled me to start, the coach parried four and immediately began the riposte (which is what he was endeavoring to demonstrate to everyone) The problem was that I sort of unconsciously followed with parry-4!

The best part is that my coach (even though expecting only the lunge... Coupe'd over my 4 and landed the riposte in one fluid unaffected manner... He then reached over and put his hand on my shoulder and said quietly "Just the straight thrust with lunge"

I was of course embarassed, but no less in awe of my coach I still stumble all the time even when I know EXACTLY what to expect! *laughing*

Anyone else have potentially embarassing moments during class "demonstrations"?

[jBirch]

Feanor,

Try being the coach that isn't paying attention to the practice dummy and gets hit on the counter-riposte like an idiot. Or, even worse, being the one that demonstrates parry riposte, only to miss the parry.

[Dan H]

You might not want to train that parry-4 as an automatic follower to a direct attack that gets parried. A smart opponent will just feint the riposte there and hit you on the disengage (or coupe) as long as he's getting points that way.

[Almightynoitall]

Yeah... walking into a beginner class (but not knowing it, it was also most of their FIRST TIMES even entering the salle) and being asked to start everyone warming up on footwork drills while the instructor went in the back to anwer the phone... imagine his surprise at coming back to find twenty beginners doing a stationary hop, an advance, two retreat steps, and then a bolestra held and repeated from the top... at least the students thought it was fun...

[Artisan]

Originally posted by Dan H
You might not want to train that parry-4 as an automatic follower to a direct attack that gets parried. A smart opponent will just feint the riposte there and hit you on the disengage (or coupe) as long as he's getting points that way.

Thats why I'm not even "allowed" to make parry 4 as automatic response. Coach insists that 6 or counter 6 is tactically better, especially at foil. Yielding 4 is permissible if action calls for it, but that is less common.

[Peach]

I was doing a line lesson (sabre) with a visiting coach, a foreign-born gentleman who had taken off his mask to speak to the group. He was talking about parries, and made a cut to my four to demonstrate because he knew I would show a good parry.

Unfortunately I am too well-trained, and immediately riposted to his (unmasked, bald, shiny) head with a nice clean sabre cut.

He paused a moment, and then went on with his lesson.

My least favorite moment with a coach was at Coaches College, when Ed Richards, on the first day, got frustrated with the distance I was taking while he was demonstrating a lesson, and he hit me so hard on the head he broke his blade off on me.

He turned my ability to pay attention right off at that moment, and I never was able to listen to anything he said without that crash and ringing sound of the flying blade coming back to me.

[Feanor]

Originally posted by Dan H
You might not want to train that parry-4 as an automatic follower to a direct attack that gets parried. A smart opponent will just feint the riposte there and hit you on the disengage (or coupe) as long as he's getting points that way.

I can see how that ould be very problematic Actually, I'm just in a sort of 4 or En garde followup to the Extension right now, but I am drilling on my own to followup with all the parries just to make certain I do SOMETHING after the lunge

At the moment part of my drill routine is lunge parry4 recover lunge Parry6 recover lunge parry7 recover etc etc...

I know how vulnerable and predictable I would become with the same followup or an easy followup to the attack, but hopefully just the readiness to make some action seems to be helping (as opposed to being frozen for a moment after the Lunge)

Have a good one!

[Catlady]

Yeah, that's why I understand coaches have trouble fencing. As my instructor told us, in preparation for drills where one student plays "coach" one plays student, the coach's job is to get hit (as well as to correct the student, etc.). So, that's how they set up actions. It's great when you're teaching someone what to do, but when it's a real bout, you get in trouble. I can see the problem. I usually joined in with the beginning classes at my club just for the extra practice, and, mind I"m not that great anyway, I'd have the worst time bouting with my other buddies afterward, even if I'd been bouting more or less with the beginners. Granted, you bout everyone the same way, and if you don't try your best you're not doing them a favor, and I don't mean that I wasn't doing my best, but when I bout beginners, I limit what moves I try, and I also try to be more obvious is setting up actions to help them learn to react plus you can bout more slowly with beginners since it takes them longer to see and react to an action. So, I'd be with people who had fenced as long as I have, or longer and still be bouting like I was with the beginners and get beaten even worse than usual because my pace was slower.