11-03-2003, 06:01 PM
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#1 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden
Posts: 2,996
| What to do in mismatched team bout
Hi!
I have come up against this guy in 3 ind. bouts, and I have the feeling that I will meet him in the MET Sw. championships, coming up in a month.
He is 3 times running Sw. ME champ, has several good placements in World Cups, one final-16 in the WC, one MET bronze in WC 2003. We have met in 3 bouts so far, I have managed one hit total - (a lucky shot on the inside of his weapon hand, where the index finger meets the palm).
In a big meet in Sourthen Sweden this summer he had a bout against an american. This guy placed top-50 in div 1-A and is an A. The swede won 5-0 after 45 seconds, the american A was not close to score a consolation point. Afterwards the american told me that this guy would easily make top-8 in div I, if not take the cake.
So, a bout against us will be lopsided, to say the least. *If* we meet in a team bout, what shall I do in order not to let my team down more than necessary? Go for as close to 180 seconds as possible, or throw all caution aside in order to get a point? Can the bout be used as a learning experience, and if so, how?
Have a nice time!
Peter Gustafsson | 
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11-03-2003, 07:20 PM
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#2 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Middle O' Nowhere USA (Reno, NV)
Posts: 250
| 1. distance yourself... keeping out of his reach (even if it's further than your own) will keep you on the strip longer.
2. last ditch efforts (when I'm losing beyond the point of hope anymore) Fleche fleche fleche
3. Always stand en guarde in a 6 parry. it feels awkward, but forces attacks to go inside for an easier 4 parry. Even if he is that much better than you, you may score a fair number of ripostes.
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"The greatest thing you'll ever learn
Is to parry, and riposte in return."
~me
Mitch AKA 'Gumby', 'The UTSWB', 'Hey You', The 'Godfather', 'MacGuyver', 'Batman', and 'Chief'
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11-03-2003, 07:36 PM
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#3 | | Curmudgeon-in-Chief
Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Somewhere in your nightmares!
Posts: 22,912
| Get in touch with Air France and see if they can arrange to keep him from showing up...  | |
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11-03-2003, 08:58 PM
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#4 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: NJ, USA
Posts: 1,171
| Maintain distance and don't engage him if at all possible.
If he is that much better than you, make it a goal to minimize the number of points he gets, not maximize the number you get.
This is especially true if your team happens to be ahead at the start of the encounter. Kill as much time as possible and make him work for the points.
Attacking in épée is risky enough (you know this, of course). Don't help him by attacking. Make him attack, but work the distance: you may get some doubles.
Good luck!
Paolo
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"He is a man of splendid abilities but utterly corrupt. He shines and stinks like rotten mackerel by moonlight." "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats."
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11-04-2003, 12:32 AM
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#5 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Richmond VA
Posts: 114
| In terms of team strategy, I have had great success on several occasions when overmatched by putting our strongest fencer in the 2nd-to-last spot, hoping to get a bit of a lead before the last encounter. Often a fencer who knows he's in over his head will do wonderful things with a bit of a lead. Of course sometimes they do terrible things. But the exhileration of having that anchor spot can do great things for a fencer, so even if they don't hold the lead they feel good at the end.
Generally speaking, it helps to keep the score low throughout the match, even more so if you know you have a favorable matchup in the 2nd-to-last bout. If you feel the situation is right in that bout, you can use the extra points to run up an even bigger lead.
I'm curious to know who the fencer is you're talking about. I've fenced on the US team against the Swedish team, but I can't descipher enough Swedish to figure out who's #1 in the country right now. Not Vanky? | |
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11-05-2003, 12:43 PM
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#6 | | Fencing Expert
Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Virginia
Posts: 1,412
| Jeff's strategy is on the right track. It is always best to "contain" the strong fencer and dominate the weak fencers on the opposing team. This puts the strong fencer on the opposing team having to make up large point gaps at the end (assuming they will "anchor" with the strong fencer), which suggests a strategy of putting the most mobile and defensive fencer from your team to oppose him.
Of course, if the opposing team has great depth. . . you have your work cut out for you!
Allen Evans | |
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11-06-2003, 04:19 PM
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#7 | | Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Salle Duffy, Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 130
| Quote: Originally posted by Inquartata
Get in touch with Air France and see if they can arrange to keep him from showing up... | agree - sounds like you're screwed | |
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12-06-2003, 04:44 PM
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#8 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden
Posts: 2,996
| Hi!
Yes, we met his team in our 2st team bout. I got the anchor bout against him, the points going into the game 9-40 in their favor. Quote: Originally posted by Allen Evans
Of course, if the opposing team has great depth. . . you have your work cut out for you!
Allen Evans | Their #4 is our trainer, none of us have so far beat him. their #2 and #3 are a bit better than that.
Anyway, our goal was to get at least 10 against them, and my to not be nulled by any of them. Had two 1-5 losses going into the last game, and Malmgren was leading 44-9 with a little more than a minute to go. He attacked, I found his blade and did some really ugly-looking counter-tierce to nail him in the shoulder. All will, no technique.
Then I let my team down in the next bout, but that is another story. Know reason though - lots of computer sitting and meetings at work, with company-served snacks on the side. Once one lets one´s body get out of shape, everything becomes a uphill battle. Scary how fast that can go. | |
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03-16-2004, 10:56 AM
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#9 | | Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Salle Duffy, Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 130
| delaying tactics are good for epee - but doesn't work for sabre
I like the "best fencer in at 2nd to last" idea
any others? | |
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03-16-2004, 11:04 AM
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#10 | | Fencing Expert
Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: CA area
Posts: 6,049
| Quote: |
Originally Posted by PeterGustafsson Hi!
[...]
We have met in 3 bouts so far, I have managed one hit total - (a lucky shot on the inside of his weapon hand, where the index finger meets the palm).
[...]
Have a nice time!
Peter Gustafsson | I'd suggest working on hitting something easier.
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03-16-2004, 11:25 AM
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#11 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: London
Posts: 1,216
| If your "good" fencers find it impossible to hit him, then carry along a beginner as your alternate, and stick them in for the last bout against the guy.
Nothing like a wild and unpredictable fencer to score a few hits where the experienced guys could get none. | |
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