No mask

[wnymaverick]

I am very new to fencing but I have a concern with my instructor, he doesn't believe in using masks, says it makes you even more determined to win and if your serious about fencing you won't use a mask, I feel "I need my eyes dude" but as far as I can tell he's the only one in town. Any advice

[mtarascio]

The first thing to do is to stop fencing with him and his club. He is not a fencing coach.

[wflaschka]

LOL. He won't cause you this conundrum for long. He'll be killed with something through the eye or mouth. Or, he'll receive a light tap on the brainpan and will require home nursing by his family for the rest of his days. At the very least, a cut causing nerve damage to his face will give him a permanent expression like a slipknot.

I'd recommend not following his example. If there are other clubs around, fence at those. If there aren't other clubs around, you should stop fencing until this person is dead or otherwise indisposed. If you're physically present when he goes down, you can be held culpable -- they will find a way. Thus, these people are always expensive to others as well as themselves.

This person's risk-taking seems deeply suspicious, doesn't it? Its almost like he doesn't know what he's doing. Archery coaches don't hold the target in front of their bodies when students are shooting. NASCAR coaches don't tie themselves to the bumper and get dragged around the track. Or -- this coach is a "good driver" so he doesn't need to wear a seat belt (never mind the other drivers on the road).

Sport fencing is actually quite different from what this person is representing. It's great fun, and quite intense and fast. That doesn't mean you have to wear your nuts outside your fly.

[wnymaverick]

I know what I should have done from the word go, I'm only 2 lessons in and I hve found another person to teach and she is horrified by his actions and she assured me that if you don't have a mask you don't fence which I breathed a sigh over. also she asked which balde I wanted to study and I always thought you had to start with foil then go on to what you wanted, I must say I am interested in sabre. Any thoughts?

[wflaschka]

That's good to hear about the new coach!! Starting with foil vs sabre -- this always makes a big argument. The way I see it...

If you want to learn fencing and be able to switch weapons at a later date, start with foil. If you will never ever switch weapons, start with Sabre.

Since you don't usually know if you're going to switch, it seems indicated to start with foil. Also, this is how the framers of fencing intended it when they 'designed' the weapons. But overall, I'd say, follow your bliss. Factor in the coach's advice.

[swordsen]

Good move. (the coach, not saber...)

[Feanor]

Is this a joke?!

It is almost too ridiculous to be believed! But I'm assuming you're giving an accurate account of it.

This sounds almost like its borderline negligence, and if the instructor is running a licensed legitimate school I'm wondering how he keeps operating...

I'm thinking that the opposite of his assessment for no mask fencing would be true... That you would instead churn out fencers who were overly timid and passive because that was there overriding emotion during training...

Wild...

[swordsen]

Someone licenses fencing clubs???

[Craig]

Originally posted by wnymaverick
I am very new to fencing but I have a concern with my instructor, he doesn't believe in using masks, says it makes you even more determined to win and if your serious about fencing you won't use a mask, I feel "I need my eyes dude" but as far as I can tell he's the only one in town. Any advice

Who is this coach and how did you find his "club"? If it's listed in any of my link lists I want to know so I can investigate and take it off.

Craig

[Feanor]

I'm assuming that anytime you have a "school of instruction" of any type where you invite people in to congregate that there has to be some sort of licensing for the purpose of insurance, liability, etc...

Not really a "Fencing License" per se, but more an operating license that allows you to teach in a class type setting. This separate from something like a Business License which anyone can get...

[JEC]

Should we move this thread to the Idiot's Corner?

[Dan H]

Well, it's good to know that apparently none of us on this board are serious fencers....

[lochinvar]

Your "coach" is a moron. Dump him, and urge everyone else in his class to dump him, too.

His "teaching" is completely antithetical to anything I've ever heard from any of the legitimate coaches/instructors I've met, and I've met a lot of them. Safety always comes first; never point a weapon at anyone--including the instructor--unless he/she is wearing a mask.

Something tells me he is merely a poser and doesn't really know much about fencing at all--that, or he's just a fool.

Either way, you're wise to be rid of him.

[Wizardly]

I once met a guy who refused to wear a jacket. He still wore a mask though. Hell, he wore a freaking metal collar to protect his neck. He was a classical fencer.

Ummmmmm, yeah...I'd hate to see this guy get his face 12K punch tested.

Do you call this guy "old one-eye?"

Why does the phrase "Darwin Awards" run through my head?

How often does this guy get hit in the head and neck? Why does it sound like this guy is a few whacks to the head away from making his students fence wtih actual sharps?

CHANGE COACHES!

[Inquartata]

LOL

I suppose the next step for this loon will be to insist that you all sharpen points onto your weapons. After all, how can you possibly learn anything without a real threat to motivate you to parry and keep distance, right?

Somehow an awful lot of astonishingly skilled fencers have managed it. Using masks and all. Who can explain it?

Just to keep the views balanced, I say skip the foil if you want to do sabre---whether it's going to be your ultimate weapon or not. It's no more difficult to transition from sabre to foil ( though why anyone would want to do that is beyond me---once you try sabre no one goes back! ) than from foil to sabre. The difficulties are just in different areas.

Foil was invented---yes, that's right, concocted out of whole cloth, er, steel---as a practice tool. And it can hardly have been intended as a practice tool for learning sabre, since it predates even the Radaellian sabre. These days you can learn the basics of footwork, bladework and distance just as well with a sabre in your hand as with a foil...in fact, you can learn two out of the three without a weapon in hand at all. The insistence on hammering pegs of every shape into the square hole of foil to begin is just a hoary tradition perpetuated by equally hoary coaches ( and their younger disciples )... It has no real utility. Sounds like the new coach you have found understands that.

[Wizardly]

Inq, you mean to tell me that the modern saber only differs from its lethal counterpart simply because it lacks a cutting edge and a sharp point???

[40Saberthieves]

RoW is also slightly different.

If a guy cuts to my head, and I cut his arm off instead of parrying, the same effect is achieved. (well, in one im better off). In RoW, parrying is better.

[whtouche]

I'd also be interested in knowing the name of this "coach" and what club he teaches at.

Clearly he shouldn't be running a fencing club, and I wonder if there are any kind of charges that can be brought against him..
At the least the USFA should be informed.

[Feanor]

Originally posted by Inquartata
The insistence on hammering pegs of every shape into the square hole of foil to begin is just a hoary tradition perpetuated by equally hoary coaches ( and their younger disciples )... It has no real utility. Sounds like the new coach you have found understands that.

I must admit, when I began fencing not too long ago, I was also bombarded by the opinion that if you were just starting, you needed to begin with foil because that was just "the way things were done"

I suppose I might be one of the minority who lucked out in this situation as my ultimate goal is to remain fencing foil and MAYBE move to Epee much later on...

I'm not certain what it is that draws me to foil over the other two disciplines, but perhaps it is a combination of RoW and characteristics peculiar to point thrusting rather than cutting weapons.

At any rate, though the sport may have been concocted out of a need to practice a real world skill, it is still a competitive endeavor in much the same way that Judo, the Triple jump or pole vault is a measure of athleticism and skill only loosely based on practical application

In the end, its just a hell of alot of fun! But please, with the mask on

[Victor]

Troll.