Advice needed about coach

[2Sirius]

I've got a bit of a problem with my coach and I need some advice.

For the last few classes, the classes have started 10 minutes late or so because the coach and one of the students are playing video games. The first couple of times, I said, "OK, they're having fun, so lighten up". However, tonight (and I'm writing this while I'm still upset, so I'll probably regret it tomorrow), the class started 15 minutes late. Classes are scheduled for 1 hour. We finished the structured part of class and had 15 minutes left - time usually reserved for free fencing with other students so the coach can watch and evaluate. Well, no one wanted to fence except me...so class over, back to the video games.

Now, I realize that I'm not a big competitor. I haven't competed much in tournaments, and I'm the oldest guy there, so the coach probably doesn't take me too seriously, I don't know. I mean, from his point of view, why should he spend time and effort on someone who will probably give little return in terms of school wins, etc?

Additionally, I work right up to the time classes are scheduled to start, so I'm often 5 minutes or so late getting there myself, and this may irritate the coach, although he's never said anything to me about it. I realize that by arriving late, I'm probably signalling to him that I don't take class all that seriously. That's not the case, but he probably doesn't know that.

Also, I like my coach personally. He's a good guy, so I don't want to annoy him by sounding demanding about lessons when I'm not a heavy competitor. None of the other students seem to have a problem with it. But I absolutely love to fence, and I want to spend class time learning how to be better, and practicing with other students.

So here's my question. Do I find some way to diplomatically say "I would like to spend my class time learning to fence" or just keep my mouth shut and take what time I can get?

[Mo]

That is a hard question because if this is the only place in town to fence, you are kind of stuck.
You could use humor and make fun of the fact that people can fence and they would rather do video games or something.
It is very bad when someone really wants to work and learn and everyone else just wants to play.
I think clubs should have a "serious fencer class." Anyone can be in it but they really have to want to fence. I see kids held back in fencing so the other kids don't feel bad and all kinds of things happening to fencers who want it bad but the others around them do not.
Can you just tell him you are there to fence and improve and not mess around with games? If it is one fourth of your class time the right to COMPLAIN should be an option.

[broncofencer]

From a coaching perspective you do have every right to complain about his late arrival however since you yourself are late this is somewhat compromised since it would be unfair to expect him to be on time if you will be late. That being said if no one else wants to free fence then he really can't do much about it. You can't force people to do these things. talk to your coach about your concerns both for your own improvement and that of the club. He may have his reasons for being late as well. I for one am sometimes late to lessons due to my work schedule as well. but I expect everyone to take that time to warm up and stretch which they do not need me there to do. that way when i get there we can start right away and do 30 minutes of lessons and 15-30 mins. of free fencing. Make sure to use your time well and talk to him he shouldn't mind if you are nice about it

[swordsen]

If you are paying for lessons you have every right to complain. If not, it wi still a valid thing to do although maybe you could ask for his assistance at the end to get the last 15 minutes.

[Rolls]

I believe I know the coach that you are referring to.

I suggest you simpy talk to him politely. Once he is aware that you would like to start on time, I'm sure he will be more prompt. Also, if he has not started by the time you are ready. Just ask him if there are any warm-up drills you can perform.

Finally, as far as free fencing goes, try asking everyone there if they want to fence. Some people get distracted but once you ask them they are all for it. If no one still wants to fence, ask your coach. Explain to him that no one else wants to fence. He will most likely fence you or find someone for you to fence.

I think the biggest problem is that since the majority of fencers seem to want to play video games (quite a luxurious school it must be to have a place to relax and play games), the coach believes there is a lack of enthusiasm for the lesson or the general consensus is that you have done enough already. Make your opinion known, but do so politely.

Rolls.

[Craig]

You have video games in a fencing club? I'll put your club down as an "easy win" for pool bouts if that's the kind of discipline instilled. If they want to have fun, break out wacky wackers or the glove game or a bit of team handball/basketball.

If I were paying for lessons for myself of a youngster, I wouldn't put up with it and would have a conference with the coach over it.

Also, if this coach is marketing to younger fencers and the parents learn of this, then the club will have a harder time marketing to parents since one of the big selling points of fencing (and any martial art/sport) is that it instills discipline and focus - and the fact that parents that pay for these lessons/classes want their children playing sports instead of video games.

Craig

[Rolls]

Let me clear up a few things. I'm not sure we're even talking about the same school, but I believe we are.

If so, there is a video game system in the waiting area of the fencing school. It's just there for people who are waiting for someone there to finish with a class or for in between lessons.

But let emphasize that this is one of the nicest fencing school I have ever been to, with more focus on fencing than any other school I have been to. And plenty of discipline. The video game system is just an added amenity that makes the place more "approachable".

Anyway, if there is a problem, it's because the coach is NOT aware of it. Tell him about and I'm sure he will fix it.

I hav seen a lot of fencers scared away from fencing because they didn't feel comfortable in the learning atmosphere (especially younger fencers). Having a place for them to relax after class and feel comfortable is not a bad thing.

Rolls.

[2Sirius]

I agree with Rolls. The video game area is usually for people who are waiting for students, or a place for others to hang out and talk with each other. When classes are going, you're in class. My only gripe was the starting late and ending early.

And see, I knew I would regret the post the next day. I guess my main problem was not communicating with my coach. Thanks for the advice, everyone.

[Craig]

Thanks for the clarification. The description made it sound like it wasn't in a separate area.

Craig

[2Sirius]

Because I started this, let me clear up a few other things. My complaint was not about the school or the ability of the coach to teach. My coach came into an area where people still call the salle asking about chain link vs. wooden privacy fencing -- in other words, fencing was pretty much unknown. He started with a bunch of people whose knowledge of fencing consisted of "the pointy end goes in the other man". Nevertheless, his students routinely win medals, etc. at just about all tournaments they attend, even though most have been fencing for less than a year. The man can coach! I'm proud of my school.

So Craig -- mark our students down for any easy pool bout if you wish. Big mistake.

Also, the classes I am attending are general classes. The coach has separate competition classes for each weapon. I simply can't attend those classes due to scheduling, though I would love to come.

Finally, I have never been to another fencing school, so I have nothing to compare. However, the facilities at my school are excellent, and the camaraderie among the students is great. I don't come to any of the other weapons classes, but just from seeing the end of some, and from my own, I can say that we don't have any goof offs or troublesome students. It's a great place!

My only complaint was about starting and ending of my class. Period. And from reading through the responses to my post, it appears the problem was at least partially, if not totally mine for not communicating my thoughts to the coach.

(I knew I was going to regret posting this!)

[pkt]

2,

I think you've provided the bud of answer yourself:
"Also, I like my coach personally. He's a good guy, so I don't want to annoy him..."

As a friend you may want to talk to him first. Talk to him nicely, non-confrontationally. It sounds like you're older than he is, so, perhaps he may value your opinion.

As a paying customer, you have every right to expect the class to start on time, it's called professionalism.

As a student, it'd look better if you start arriving on time too. That business about people living in glass houses and throwing stones...

When and if all else fails you may want to organise ALL the students to send the coach a signal by showing up late half an hour and demand that the class run over half an hour, etc.

Use your imagination re the moves you may want to employ.

PK

[2Sirius]

Originally posted by pkt
As a student, it'd look better if you start arriving on time too. That business about people living in glass houses and throwing stones...

Yeah, I've actually been feeling pretty bad about that. I'm just going to have to get my watch fixed or set an alarm or something...

Well, I knew I'd get some good advice. I guess I'll actually have to talk to my coach if the problem continues. That's certainly a novel approach for me... daring...audacious even...I'll give it a go.

Thanks again for the input.

[MikeHarm]

If you're paying for an hour class at a university that you get credit for and he's shorting you by 15 minutes every day to play video games while you wait there for the class to start I'd complain to his boss. In a club atmosphere I think it would be ok if it was more relaxed, for a college credit class I think its unprofessional.

[morael]

"Now, I realize that I'm not a big competitor. I haven't competed much in tournaments, and I'm the oldest guy there, so the coach probably doesn't take me too seriously, I don't know. I mean, from his point of view, why should he spend time and effort on someone who will probably give little return in terms of school wins, etc?"

Now, that's a problem. You don't have to be a star to make a contribution to your class. If your coach is any good, he respects all his students and can get plenty of "return" from students at all levels.

P.S. "Oldest guy" eh? Well, there's wheelchair fencing, but sorry, guy, no rocking chair fencing! Get over it!

[arcon]

If you find a tactful way to let this coach know that you want to
spend every minute available at this venue either taking lessons
or fencing how could he possibly get upset. If you explain to him
you really hate it when you are forced to be late he should understand that you are truly dedicated and find a way to accomadate you. There are age brackets for fencers and if a coach is giving lessons to all ages he should be well aware of dedication in a person no matter what their age. I know this may not always be the case. If he needs a gentle reminder of this then again find a way to make your point and do it with respect.
He may even have more RESPECT for you for speaking up.
This is my opinion. This is what id do. Think carefully about what
(you) are comfortable doing before you do it.

arcon

[OCTAVIA]

allow me to tiptoe back into the forum. I have to add my two cents:

I had a coach who did similar things, I never found it distracting, it was an informal class, we had plenty of opportunity to do something else, but most importantely, even though he was a pain, we all loved our teacher [the one with the aqua shorts], what can I say. I think it was the little roll of baby-fat around his tummy buckle that we all felt akin to. He has the makings of a maestro in temperment, someone very talented, yet oddly out of touch with certain things; but if you can get into that then you won't mind the video games; our guy used to bring movies; most of them were good, they were all about fencing, and he would play them in the background while we ran around the gym, only one movie was not good, the one with the two ladies grappling outside wearing black leather thongs, and the one with the lady in the chair with the blindfold. sort of like a martial arts flashdance.

'I wanna live forever, tada-da-da-da-da-daaaaaaa"