[CFML] (CFML) Extending/Extended Arm Controversy - Fencing.Net Discussion
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Old 09-15-2003, 08:00 AM   #1
Warren and Jackie Cabral
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[CFML] (CFML) Extending/Extended Arm Controversy

Hello to All--

Since this thing is getting a lot of attention, I thought I'd toss my "2-cents" worth in. I definitely side with the time-proven, time-honored approach that designates only the already extended arm as the threat, or as having ROW. The names of Fencing Masters over the years, people who had to use the sword as 'sharps', overwhelmingly bears this out. I won't bore anyone with a list of their names, as I'm sure that has been done in the past, but we could take virtually everyone from 'Castello' to 'Vince' and beyond, and they are in perfect agreement that the fully extended arm IS the threat (not extending...not moving forward...not thinking about extension)... only the already extended arm, period.
While we all agree that foil was established as the practice weapon, this principle of 'legitimate threat' applies equally to a serious encounter...foil practice nicely provides description to the theory of ROW and lays out the reasoning for the actions taken during a particular phase. Foil, then, is the way fencing 'should' be fenced, while epee is what 'could' happen in, let's say, a grassy meadow at dawn without the theory, but with the instinct. In either case, they do have one thing in common--"hit without being hit".

This brings us to the problem at hand. If Fencer 'A' is extending the arm, he/she COULD be in the process of attacking...then again, Fencer 'A' could also be in the process of a feint, a decision to immediately withdraw the action, a move to scratch his ...er..elbow,or virtually anything else one wishes to assume by this motion. So far, all we've determined is some sort of preparatory action is taking place, NOT a real threat. (It IS a pretty open-ended action, isn't it?) There have been lots of pros and cons on what the response could be, so I'm going to toss one in.

What I had in mind was an action right out of the honored Italian School tradition...What about a full extension by Fencer 'B' against this 'extending arm' deal; going for a Time Thrust (perhaps using an action such as the Glide (filo) on the way in with that full extension (the Real threat!). This action would (a) pick up the opposing steel, moving it out-of-line (remember, Fencer 'A' still has that relatively weak bent-arm position), and (b) simultaneously allow Fencer 'B' to drive home his time thrust. Two points here...if Fencer 'B' by full extension had ROW in the classic way of looking at it, he/she wins. On the other hand, if under the ever-changing interpretations of ROW now being promulgated, Fencer 'B' did NOT have ROW (against that extending action by Fencer'A'), he/she certainly WOULD have it after the simultaneous parry/riposte Time action. Of course, this contribution of mine is only based on the scenario we have been provided with;that is, without other extenuating
factors... Just playing this thing out, here, but it looks like a neat possiblility.

Regards,
Warren Cabral


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