swordmaster series a success!!!

[wari]

Originally posted by DanInMI
No big surprise that the person that started this thread "just joined."

All fencers Knows that starting an event or a fencing club is difficult and need guts and devotion. I do not think that a Joker (DanInMI) like you got that.
I believe that event was sucess because it was done and the promise was fulfilled ($1000 reward). I'm sure that the next time many will compete in the swordmaster series in the future.
See you there Joker!!!!!

Wari.

[CarlKnoch]

I have to say that although I know that I'm no epee fencer, I would love to get in on the next event in this series now that the results of the first are heard. I think that it would be a great idea for several people to go to this next event and fence... you know the people that wouldn't normally do this kind of thing. I'm sure I could never be in the prize money, but I do see now that this Swordmaster series can only be as successful as we make it as fencers. If we don't go and fence in this thing, it will never become anything worthwhile.

I for one will be chatting with my wife to see if there is anything on our schedule that would stop me from going to the next one, to see it for myself, as well as participate. Hearing that there were only 12 people is disheartening. Maybe the next event will be better in tha area. I'll try to do my part and show up to be meat for the grinders that are the top epeeists there.

Kudos to all the fencers who showed up and fenced at this event, and thanks for getting it started. Now that the initial bad vibe and fear of what it could have been is over, I hope that they get 40 participants for the next one!

[JEC]

DanInMI,
I recall reading when I was at Greenville for Summer Nationals that Wari had won twice the national tournament of Algiers, which as a former French colony also got their sports.
Some fencers turn-into full time coaches do not fence tournaments every month, but coach most of the time. My own coach, at one time was an "A" in the three weapons and at his age, he still routinely beats B's and some times A's, but his current classification is D or so (obtained fencing one tournament every other year). So, I'm not sure about your argument.

[afc fencer]

I think the reason there was only 12 people was because many people werenot so sure that the money would be paid so they decided to wait till the next one. With the news that the money was given to the fencer that won and that top 8 will get money, more people will come.

[DanInMI]

I don't understand all the visciousness, Wari.
I never called YOU any names. My pointing out that you had only just joined was due to the fact that often, when people want to blow thier own horn without appearing to do so, they will create a new identity on here. You have NO info in your profile.....AND you are new here, so how the hell are we supposed to know who you are, Or that you have ever run any kind of event? I don't expect you to know me.

I also pointed out that the event coordinators made much of the fact that they were putting this series together with the goal of promoting the sport by getting television exposure. To this end they were very unsuccessful.

They also claimed to have more than 20 pre-registered competitors.... as Picojeff pointed out, many names must have been fabricated. It would appear that they were being less than honest.

It does not seem to me that getting together 12 fencers and holding a tournament that would not even get the winner a rating if it was a usfa event should qualify as a "success" just because the organizers made good on the promise of a mere 1000 dollar cash prize. Especially since the promoters had boasted so much more.

[achilleus]

Duel in the Desert is a six weapon event with a $1000 prize to the winner. The men's epee field has anywhere from 80-105 fencers, with a spectacular evening event. It took time to build that event into what it is.

The Swordmaster Master Series hardly seems like a success given their goals. A beginning maybe (an attempt at a lot of hype surely), but definitely not a success.

[MyrddinsPrecint]

another way to say it...

it desperately failed by the expectations of the organizers

it was an incredible success, exceding expectations of the skeptics.

the moderates?

it turned out fairly well, and may turn out better with additional time.

[wflaschka]

MyrddinsPrecint sure talks purty. I vote we call her the m-bomb.

From the way people were talking earlier, it sounded like they were afraid that fencers at the tournament would return home to see their houses burglarized.

There was a lot of typing going on, for a tournament where the registration was a few $20s and the cost of a marked-up jacket.

It looks like all that energy was for naught. I for one am glad the tournament didn't implode. (It didn't necessarily explode either.) The vigilant shall stay vigilant. I hope that this effort grows into something big and good for fencing.

[wari]

Originally posted by DanInMI
I don't understand all the visciousness, Wari.
I never called YOU any names. My pointing out that you had only just joined was due to the fact that often, when people want to blow thier own horn without appearing to do so, they will create a new identity on here. You have NO info in your profile.....AND you are new here, so how the hell are we supposed to know who you are, Or that you have ever run any kind of event? I don't expect you to know me.

I also pointed out that the event coordinators made much of the fact that they were putting this series together with the goal of promoting the sport by getting television exposure. To this end they were very unsuccessful.

They also claimed to have more than 20 pre-registered competitors.... as Picojeff pointed out, many names must have been fabricated. It would appear that they were being less than honest.

It does not seem to me that getting together 12 fencers and holding a tournament that would not even get the winner a rating if it was a usfa event should qualify as a "success" just because the organizers made good on the promise of a mere 1000 dollar cash prize. Especially since the promoters had boasted so much more.

Calling the event a joke was not nice because warzone invest time and money in this event. I agree with you on some point like not getting television exposure as promised, that will need more coordination from warzone but for the attendance is something that we can not control especially for a new event, I'm certain that there will be more next time.
In the end the event was held and others are scheduled, now warzone need to fulfill all the promises they promised by getting the television and I'm sure they will.

[noodle]

Originally posted by DanInMI

Bruce Juengst, Rating= C03
Steve Kemke =

not that its a big deal or anything
but juengst should be a B03, he top 16'd in div1a ME
and kemke i believe is a D but i'm not sure the year

[fencergal33]

Correct ratings (your research needs work):

Bruce Juengst: B03
Steve Kamke: C01 (I think)
Tristan Hendrix: D02
Wari: In this country, U......in Europe A

What a shame that our country doesn't accept ratings in non-USFA events.....I watched the same thing happen when a B I know from England moved here.

Anyway, I understand the reality of the fact that not everyone will ever be supportive of this event. All I can do, as one of the organizers and sponsors involved, is tell you that by our standards, the event went well. There is room for improvement in most things I've ever witnessed in my life, most definitely including fencing events. There were some circumstances in the 2 weeks prior to the event that led to things going wrong (ie no TV cameras), but the best we can do is promise them for next time. Being that after some restructuring, the whole thing is being run by 3 people (myself included), I think we did okay. We talked extensively with fencers as well as spectators about what would make it better, and those things are being taken into consideration, and done if they are at all possible.

The next event is in November. Registration is open now, and we already have people registered. If you want to get your shot at the money, by all means please sign up. If you think we are a joke, please don't. If you forget about prize money for one minute, it's just like any other tournament.

Thanks all!
-K

[picojeff]

If we're posting correct ratings, both Arne and I are A03. Near as I can tell, the list posted earlier didn't contain a single correct rating.

I know there used to be a clause in the rules for seeding that allowed you to put a "fencer of international standing" ahead of where his USFA rating would put him. I think Wari sheepishly admitted later that perhaps he wasn't a U... he had thought the ratings dropped down faster than one letter every 4 years.

[fence1848]

I think it may actually be a good thing that the turnout was low. Being the first year they do this, it is important to maintain control of the event. If they had too many people show up, too much time and effort would be consumed with running the bout committee table and not enough on promotion of the event, which was kind of the goal here.

Next time they hold it, they'll know more about the venue, the timing, the spectator turnout, etc. and would better be able to handle things if the numbers are big.

In Virginia, we've had the Kickoff Open for several years and it has always had a large turnout. Last year, we decided to step it up and make it a part of the Mid-Atlantic Regional Circuit. We stepped up entry fees and looked for a larger venue in a very central location. We expected a large turnout, and boy did we get it.

We had 96 fencers in foil, 75 in epee, and 36 in saber. We had 8 strips and we had to be out by 8 p.m. For those of us running the tournament, it was frantic to say the least.

Sometimes a small, really well-run tournament is much more fun than a logistics fiasco.

[noodle]

well if we're trying to be specific here, wari is a D03, i beat him in the SC divisionals semifinals. i'm 100% sure.
(hi wari)

[wari]

Originally posted by noodle
well if we're trying to be specific here, wari is a D03, i beat him in the SC divisionals semifinals. i'm 100% sure.
(hi wari)

I believe you are right , I think I did have earn a D for this competition in SC divisional. But any way that's not the subject what rating I have. The swordmaster series was challenging with another aspect than the level of the fencers who fenced, as we know Epee bout are maybe the longest bout than any other weapons that because it take longer time to prepare a precise hit and on this event we had 2minute 1minute than 2 minute in my opinion that was also challenging;because with the time running out so fast it was very difficult to catch up if the other fencer who is taking the lead .

I like to thank Jeff and Arne (an A fencers) who drove for hours to compete, I believe there were a good asset for the swordmaster series.

Wari.

[DanInMI]

sorry if the ratings were inaccurate....it was just what i was able to find with google.

my point was not that the ratings of the fencers were low or high .... I think any event with a couple B's and a couple A's is great. Notice that I did not comment on the skill level of the fencers at the turnout....I just put a questionmark there.

The real point is that the claim was made that there were strong competitors, but no info about them was given.

I didn't recognize any of the names....I can name the top fencers in my division...and the top US fencers. But do you expect us to know these guys?

[darius]

I didn't recognize any of the names....I can name the top fencers in my division...and the top US fencers. But do you expect us to know these guys?

In all honesty, just from reading this thread and not knowing you, you came across as a jerk.

And if you don't know Jeff Snider (picojeff here, who's already given us his thoughts on the thing --- more accurate than your speculations, since HE WAS THERE), perhaps you might want to study your Modern US Fencing History 101 a little harder, seeing as he was on the 2002 World Champs team.

So, oops, there were strong competitors. If you're going to be a skeptic about the whole thing (I am), that's fine, but please make yourself informed before you rant.

darius

[CvilleFencer]

Originally posted by DanInMI
I didn't recognize any of the names....I can name the top fencers in my division...and the top US fencers. But do you expect us to know these guys?

Just FYI Jeff Snider is currently ranked 22 in the country in his division. That coupled with the fact that he fenced on the international circuit for the US a few years ago (2002 team?) makes him a pretty well known guy.

Also, while I do not know if he actually fenced, Justin Mehaan was listed on the roster, and he is a fairly well known fencer on the East Coast. He also is one of the owners of Bladerunners Fencing Supply.

While not a rated fencer in the US Wari has won at least one National Championship if I am recalling correctly. Bruce Juengst... well, you get the idea. Just because you have never heard of them in MI does not mean it was an event for unknowns.

As to those that registered but did not show up, there was so much rumor and speculation flying around that I am not surprised some people backed out.

I for one have a newfound respect for the organizers of the event. While many things went wrong, and they could have cancelled easily with somewhat legitimate reasons (no TV crew for example) they carried on the event, paid the winner his hard won money (congrats to the victor by the way) and preserved honor by doing the right thing in the face of adversity.

I expect the next one to be a bigger success, as they seem to be learning from the past mistakes. Sorry for doubting you guys! I hope the next one goes off without a hitch.

***Edit*** Sorry to say basically the same thing as Darius. He beat me to the send key by about a minute!

[fencergal33]

Thanks for the support and back-up CVille and darius........

Being one of the said "organizers" myself, I have to tell you that all of the concerns of the previous 2 weeks or so did make us consider bagging the whole thing. However, we felt that our responsiblity was to the fencers who had actually registered for the darn thing, and adopt a "show must go on attitude." So we pulled it off.......some people think successfully, and some people don't.

Of course we have room for improvement....so many things in the world do.........but we're listening, and I especially welcome comments, concerns, and constructive criticism. Please don't get on here and tell me that you think we suck, or that Al Blakeborough is satan.... I want to know what I can do to get more fencers, or make the event run better, or to get more publicity, or anything else helpful. I inherited the position of answering questions, responding to e-mail, and taking care of registration functions at the actual event. I want your input as fencers, and in some cases, tournament organizers.

Thanks again for hearing me out.
-K

[DanInMI]

Quote...."So, oops, there were strong competitors. If you're going to be a skeptic about the whole thing (I am), that's fine, but please make yourself informed before you rant."

ummmm you guys need to learn how to read. I DID NOT question the level of the competitors. I said I didn't know anything about them. I did not say that since I don't know tham all that they must be unknowns. I pointed out that here in MI we may not know who they all are. Period.

Also Please note: Jeff Snider is one of the fencers that I DID get the rating correct for. (At least I knew that he is an A) I never suggested that he is not a very competent epeeist.

Also, PLEASE NOTE, It was JEFF that first suggested that the organizers LIED when they said that they had 20 pre-registered fencers.

My perspective on the relative success and failure of the event is based on the fact that the event organizers came on here and made quite an argumentabout how the event was going to be run and what the goals were going to be. They seemed very reluctant to answer the concerns of the fencing.net community in those threads.

The major goal of the event was to have been promoting fencing through television exposure. Now they like to say that the mission was a success even though they had only 12 fencers and no camera crew. (It sounds alot like Bush stating that weapons of mass destruction was not the reason that we went to war....)
If you consider it a RANT because I pointed out that 12 fencers fencing in a mall for a 1000 prize does not constitute a success in light of what the promoters led us to expect, then so be it.

Quite frankly, in the earlier thread I questioned the organizers seeming obsession with getting television coverage of fencing. I don't see the point. I don't think that television coverage is the nescessary ingredient to make our sport grow.