what features should a fencing website have

[rukovsoft]

after consulting probably 90% of the website dedicated to fencing in europe and america, i came with a few ideas and comments
- make the website visually attractive (use of pictures and rich media)
- make it up to date
- providing the users with tools to update it by themselves (ie:results)
I m currently developping this one
www.bostonfencingclub.org

do you have any suggestion concerning this site or fencing websites in general? what features should they have?

thx for your feedback

[Sarah]

I really like it! It is very interesting!!!!

[three_hundred_fifty_five]

It was fancy. I really don't care for the whole screen option. I like to have the toolbar visible so I can switch between web surfing and work. Ha.

[Peach]

Try holding down the Alt-key and the Tab-key to cycle between windows.

But no, I don't like the full-screen option. That's nice for graphics displays and showing off, but not so good for using.

Also, for those of us who keep our Favorites open while browsing with Internet Explorer, the text on the right side is cut off.

It's attractive, but remember a very important principle of web site design: just because you can do it, that doesn't mean you should do it.

[jeff]

Keep it simple so it loads fast. Not everybody is on DSL or cable modem or web surfing from work. That means graphics as well as plug-ins.

Don't make Flash mandatory. I just loaded the home page and got a big rectangular white space embedded in a black background, and no other navigation available to just see the site. No, I don't want to install Flash on this particular machine. Some people use "lock down" desktops that prohibit installing software. At the very least, add a "click here to enter site without Flash'.

Ditto for Java if it's only used for eye-candy. Absolutely no ActiveX controls.

Make it browser neutral. Not everybody uses IE ("friends don't let friends use Internet Explorer"), and not all are on the same version. Use Javascript to detect the browser version if you do anything "fancy" that depends on specific browser types and versions.

[CarlKnoch]

Nice site, but I agree about several things brought up already. The full screen version can easily be duplicated by going to the popup and then hitting F11. that also gives you a toolbar that self hides at the top so you can navigate more easily.

While I don't think that the site should be browser neutral really, I do think that you should offer a site that is non-flash. Something that is mostly text with little to no picts. I like sites like that. After I've seen the animations once, I would really rather hit the text site to read what I want.

That of course, is just my opinion. I could be wrong.

[a517dogg]

have a movie of people fencing

that would be awesome

[rukovsoft]

the clip with music of the Pomme de Terre is coming...patience adrian

[Dragonfly]

It's very nice, the graphics are good, and the fencers look realistic the lighting on the piste has a mysticial quality which is appealling to web-browers, the 'laser'-sword, well, it's starwars but different. Okay, what else.

If you're going to have a dissussion board like this, my only suggestion is to keep your maintenance down only allow up to a certain amount of discusion threads that automatically archive after 300 comments; and then a new thread can open. The use of Avatars is highly recommended; moving avatars. Maybe a link into the Rules book from the chat board that has a search feature, so if someone asks a foil question for example a person can log in search and bingo find the answer, post it and have done with it.

[rukovsoft]

hey, thanks for your feedback

we used to have a text only website...but we really wanted more fancy and classy. not static HTML...but people wanted to be able to update.

that s why i mixed html and flash.

for the browser question...well, 9/10 users use IE.so it s hard to agree about the cross browser problem.

same for macromedia flash. according to macromedia
almost 70% of computers have flash...
flash is so conveient and can generate really light sites if you work in vector images.

dragonfly, we re thinking about a chat or guestbook system. I ll remember that. probably incorporate some modules of a xoops forum.

[jeff]

Well, I took my laptop with Linux on it, followed the instructions to download the Flash installer, did the several steps it takes, including shutting down the browser (Mozilla - there is no IE on Linux; don't recall if there is one on Apple), noted the Macromedia warning about viruses spread by bugs in an older version of Flash, and voila! I now see the home page (5 minutes later). If I wasn't motivated I would have clicked away to another site. If Macromedia is right, 30% of web browsers will go away if flash is mandatory.

As it is - it's very pretty. Please note that the initial home page with the fencers on the strip could be a simple graphic, and the rotating logo, while cute, conveys no particular information, and could also be done by an animated gif. The heavy graphics may make this site painfully slow to use over a dialup line, and new graphics are loaded just via a mouse-over the navigation.

These effects are certainly pretty, and could be done either in Flash or in Javascript. If done in Javascript, it could be done in browser-neutral style - it just takes additional care. Various web designing tools will automaticlly generate Javascript that works with IE, Mozilla, Netscape, Opera and so on. Fencing.net, for example, works with multiple browsers.

Good web design doesn't close the doors on anybody, and favors speed and universal access over eye-candy.

[rukovsoft]

thx Jeff,

well, our marketing target is mostly using high speed internet.
If you have dial-up connection, the websites loads once into the cache after...the second time it should be faster.
there is IE on apple. Good call for linux users. however, I know 1 person who uses a browser different than IE (i think it s opera).

javascripts, are sometimes incompatibles between browsers.
they generate heavy codes.
i used to use them a lot. then dropped them for flash. with flash no problem of compatibility, i design everything myself...

in the coming years the number of computers that have flash will rise dramatically...

i strongly advise using flash, whatever your project is. then it s up to you to make the website sophisticated/fancy/minimalist...

don tforget to add flash pluggin detection codes though nad make an html version for dial up users (if you plan to have dial up users...)

[Craig]

The problem with designing for broadband only is that the US still has pretty low penetration rates for broadband compared to dial.

Once everyone is using the web acceleration technology on dial, then you can design everything to 100-200k connections, but until then you need options for high and low bandwidth.

Of course, if the Boston area has a very high adoption rate for broadband, then you don't need to worry as much.

Craig

[jeff]

Probably the first/best place to look for guidelines on web usability is Jakob Nielsen's Website, http://www.useit.com/ He has excellent advice on designing web sites (or most things with a visual presentation) for usability and effectiveness. Unfortunately, much of the material on the site requires purchase but he does have lots of advice available for free. I also recommend his book "Designing Web Usability: The Practice of Simplicity".

Dial web acceleration (as opposed to real broadband) gives some performance improvement for graphics at the cost of appearance (via lossy image compression). It wont help Flash, which must be transmitted without change.

Enough techie stuff... back to (techie) work...

[jeff]

Just saw this to answer a question I posed earlier: "Microsoft drops IE for Mac", at http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1104-1017126.html

Flash almost certainly will be available on the new Mac browser, Safari, but don't depend on it being IE.

[veeco]

I don't have a problem with Flash myself. As Jeff pointed out, Flash exists for Linux (which is what I run at home, aside from various other WinTel machines laying around).

However, I DESPISE websites who open a full screen version of IE. It's intrusive, obnoxious and doesn't really help with the navigation experience.

[rukovsoft]

agree.
that s why you give the choice between full screen and non-full screen
same thing for the intro. you watch it once and after you enter the website directly...

[Sabresque]

I have flash 5 and it's taking a really long time to load... I do have a dial up connection though. The thing about it loading faster is that it does load faster after it loads the first time BUT once you sign offline then back on again, it downloads just as slowly again as the first time.

[retardedspleen]

The majority of dial up users (yeah.... i use dial up too) are already using web acceleration. thats pretty much the standard protocall for dial up. Broadband is becoming a lot bigger, prices are dropping, speeds are going up (a company is installing FO in most areas now, 30 dollars a month, 10megs up, and 10 megs down.) I would design it for faster connections.


dial up is slow, the only time that it actuly seems fast is when i think back to when i had my old 14.4 and a 386sx1


Broad band is comming, and fast, hell most people now days (or so this seems) have broadband.



I wouldnt make it automaticly full screen....this makes my hand reach for alt-f4....cause most full screen pages...are only ads.


The page, the content, the layout the look. Awesome. it actuly looks A LOT like what i was designing a year and a half ago for my club (although never finished) it looks to be the most up to date fencing web page out there! (Sorry craig, his just looks nicer but yours still rocks) adding Flash was a good and smart touche. Flash is great. But i think given maybe some more time, you can more develop it. Flash has a lot of possabilities. im on dial up, my fastest D/L is 3.8 kb/s i was able to load the entire page in under 50 seconds. no complaints here. While Im still on the flash topic; Why not make an entire portion of the site compleatly out of flash? yea, it'll be a lot of work, but just imagine what you could have when done.


In the photos section; when it loads a pic, the background is white....Heres what I would do, instead of linking to the *.jpg its self, why not link to an html that has the pic on a black background, and on the left to the bottom have context about what the picture is about. I think a lot of people would like this, they like to see pictures and read about it, it gives them better insight.


Media & Gears; I like that a lot. that was a good idea, and is something that i dont think ANY other club has done. and once the gear section is in, that also is something that not many other clubs have, or if they do, it isnt in as nice a style as the rest of your site is.

In the photos. Something nice, a personal photo and FULL bio, including short interview with all of your top studends (or medalists) this not only gives some people drive to do better. but more importantly, it makes them feel a part of the clubs inner workings. (luchettie has something like that, but its very BSed, not very well done, and definatly not updated...ever. [Sorry any luchettie people out there....but its true])

Coachs; add HTML link to photo wich is blown up 40% more, including FULL bio, as well as full interview (its nice to know your coaches/possible future coachs train of thought )

Classes; Perfect, you gave an amazing amount of info out on the page about the class. thats what people like to see! VERY VERY WELL DONE!

Resaults; nice. Even better if its updated ASAP after an event. but; Categorization needs a little help. somewhat confusing...SOO many WS MF WF MF MS....soo many M's and W's perhaps break them out into groups of what weapon in the event. Or, categorize them by person. That will make it easier for people to find what event, and or person they are looking for. one big advantage if you sort by person, is that; if you only have to type that persons name once. you can link their name to the (providing you do this) HTML page that has there picture, and bio

Overview; looks great, very well explaind about how it works, its good you added that you HAVE TO HAVE propper attire, cause if you dont, and somebody gets hurt...you cant claim anything with USFA. or most insurence companys for that matter.


dude the site kicks ***! I like it quite a bit! Keep the good work up!


Chris Triplett

[rukovsoft]

THANK YOU RETARDEDSPLEEN

for the picture section and the white background...i was just too lazy. i ll do it later. i ll follow your advice. maybe create a photoalbum in flash...

i love flash, i wanted 100% flash, but it s a pain when you have a lot of stuff to update. and the board wanted something they could update "themselves" in case i die or drop fencing...

more features will come on the website, like a remote interface that allows some users to update their competition results without knowing anything at HTML.

the coaches bio and full picturea re coming too ...

thx for your feedback.

rukov