I have finally seen "Die Another Day"

[KC]

And to be honest I didn't mind the epee fencing at the beginning of the scene. It was decent and what I did like in the movie was the portrayal that fencing was an extreme sport.

Now that that was setteled, how many of your salles look like that? I wish I had half of that room...

The dramatic sword fight in the salle was a bit much and we all saw it comming...

Who else noticed that Bond had on a left handed jacket but fenced right handed???

Anyway I enjoied the most of the movie, and I am glad that I didn't see Madonna fence!

[Katman]

There's a music video of Madonna's song 'Die Another Day' with a fencing theme to tie in with the movie. Starts out with some fairly stylized epee fencing (dig the outfits) before they abandon them and start grabbing axes and maces off the wall.

[DHCJr]

I noticed that in another thread. Also it is a left-handed sabre jacket and their fencing epee.

[NJP3]

I think Leon Paul provided the equipment for the film, wonder why they didnt catch that?

[Peach]

Most movies go with what looks good, not with what's correct. Technical advisors (whether they supply the equipment or not) have very little say in the final product.

[hawaii kid]

I have NOT seen this movie and am holding out until it comes out in Play-Skool View Master format.
Have you seen the way Pierce Brosnan holds a martini glass?

( shudders )

I did accidently see part of the Madonna video the other day. It was O.K. I guess.

[KShan5[PrFC]]

Fencing=good
Sword fighting=bad

I am a big Bond fan, but I did not like the movie. I just seemed as if tehre was a bad pun upon bad pun. Insert a couple of sexual inneundos and tehn back to bad puns. The action scenes were good but on the whole I would give it a B- as a Bond movie. And a B+ versus other movies.

[Catlady]

I agree, to a non-fencer I'm sure the epee looked really exciting. It least it helps me explain what I do and what the different weapons are.

Of course the people who say it with me got treated to running commentary on how they were mixing epee and foil (epee gear, but basically foil target) and various things that one would never do in a real salle (besides the obvious when the swordfight breaks out. I mean actually flinching when hit in the wrist, please , by now you practically have to hit me with a hammer to get a reaction)

I agree though. If that's how the average salle in the UK looks I'll have to move. I also imagine many of the male fencers wish their coaches looked a bit more like Madonna. I hate her and the movie did nothing to change that though the theme song was fairly decent.

I did like the implication that it is possible for women to beat men at fencing (if you recall the female who turns out to be a double agent is the star pupil not the guy she's fencing).

[Event Horizon]

Is it me, or wouldn't it have made more sense for them to Fence Sabre and then segue into fighting with "real" Sabre's?

I enjoyed the fighting sequence though, it was what I would expect from a Bond movie. Most of the stunts in Bond movies are "no way it could happen in real life" situations, but are really fun to watch.

[sabresamurai]

i have not seen die another day but have see various other bond movies
all of my friends that know i fence have been telling me "man, i saw die another day and there is this scene where bond is swordfighting or fencing and stuff, is that waht it is really like? looks tight" hehe i like when people tell me/ ask me stuff like that

[Barry Paul]

Yes Leon paul did supply all the fencing equipment and many of the fencers, and doubles, plus Ben Paul was their for three months as tech advisor and swordmaster assistant to Bob Anderson.
Yes the Jackets did button up the wrong way, allowing Bond to rip of his jacket with his non sword arm while still holding the sword.
Leon Paul will have a stand at the anationals and we hope to have some looped playing of the Bond fencing action. Barry paul Leon paul

[DanInMI]

I haven't seen it.
I am pretty disppointed that Bond fences like a dork in a left handed saber jacket.

He must have known that he would have to rip that jacket off later on.

I don't suppose that anyone from LP had the guts to say "hey, if you do this thousands of fencers are going to collectively GROAN and roll thier eyes."

[Barry Paul]

Leon Paul had the guts, but they had the cheque book. Guess who won?

[remise]

My two kids almost died when they saw the sequence. One of them is a pre-teen, and could only think of how "acting that stupid would get you black-carded from the club, expelled from the USFA and probably kicked out of fencing anywhere." Not bad for an 11 year old, who has been grilled since day 1 about keeping the point down, manners, manners, manners.......never raise a blade to anyone without a mask and jacket.....on and on. My teen was quite upset that all the bad guys were fencers - and bad ones at that.

[edew]

Originally posted by DanInMI
I haven't seen it.
I am pretty disppointed that Bond fences like a dork in a left handed saber jacket.

He must have known that he would have to rip that jacket off later on.

I don't suppose that anyone from LP had the guts to say "hey, if you do this thousands of fencers are going to collectively GROAN and roll thier eyes."

But...the...jacket...was....back...to...right-handed...when...they did the epee fencing bit.... First left, then right, then back to left? Who was the continuity manager?

[Dragonfly]

I never heard of the movie. Okay, I just looked it up. It looks pretty good. I should see it for the fencing. It sounds pretty weird left handed jacket, must have been written into the script; like he grabbed the jacket put it on incorrectly, then suddenly found himself having to fence? I haven't seen a Bond film in a while. Was he fencing in a bout situation or was he in one of his bond-like bad situations, with no choice but to grab any weapon and defend himself? Sounds like Bond. James Bond.

[Feanor]

The technical inaccuracies are an old story in movies. In many situations, what is reasonable and technically correct in real life would be outlandish and disrupt the "suspension of disbelief" in film. Kind of ironic...

I'm certain that Epee weapons were chosen over foils because the overall dimensions of the epee weapons were more "dramatic" (i.e. the width and size of the blade, the guard size, etc...) had they been using Foils, the scale might have made the overal scene less "menacing" weapon wise.

Its now the fencing communities turn to groan in disbelief at movie innacuracies The firearms community, which I would assume is far larger, is constantly appalled by things seen in bond films and just about ANY movie involving firearms...

Examples of this would be dimunitive "suppressors" (there is no such thing as a "Silencer") that are about 1/5 the size they are in the real world. Additionally the "Silencer" on a revolver always made me squirm in disbelief, as exanding gases (aka noise) escapes from the gap between the cylinder and the barrel normally, So a suppressor of any size would do little to nothing on a revolver. Except of course, in the movies...

Muzzle flash is another one... If you took a high powered rifle and fired a shot in total darkness you would see a very small faint blue glow from the end of the barrel, at most! Some of the pyrotechnic displays that erupt from the business ends of night firing movie weapons always has me waiting for the line "Where did everyone go! I can't see a thing!" Maybe this is why Arnold wears his shades at night In real life muzzle flash is VERY mundane.

I'm certain that Leon Paul and the technical crew knew they would be offending the fencing cogniscenti, but in real terms, that would be only a very small fraction of the viewing audience, and mainly forgiven even by the people in the know because after all, its make believe Its funny how people will say "Its a left handed sabre jacket for the love of God!" and in the same breath, ooh and ahh the invisible car *laughing*...

Have a good one all!

Feanor

[Indy4ever]

When i see a film, I dont want a sword fight to be punctuated with talks about safety and 'no Mr Bond, stop waving the broadsword round, you have to salute first...'. nor do wish arnie to go into the details of suppressors on revolvers...
we go to films to forget the mundane realities of life; i would gladly pay to see ben affleck or some other brainless fool ride a nuclear powered camel to the north pole to kill evil, vaguely european terrorist nazis hell bent on starting a non sensical war that will probably result in their deaths too.

I am afraid that the fencing community will have to get off their high horses when at the films that feature a small amount of sword fighting - flexing your knowledge on the subject in the middle of a movie will only make you unpopular with your friends (trust me on this one!)

And as far as bond movies go, you shouldnt be complaining about the actual fencing which wasnt so bad, but the bit in goldfinger where the woman painted gold is apparently killed by 'skin suffocation.' eurgh.... why paint her when you can just hit her on the head?

[rukovsoft]

this epee match was so unrealistic that it was pathetic...kinda exciting though. i m sure they didn t need the consultant for the beginning part of the match (the suppposedly realistic one)? why showing epee ...foil would have been better....in a nutshell i m confused, what did they try to show: something realistic, new, spectacular, foil, epee??...it would have been better if they had grabbed real swords at the beginning of the match !

[Feanor]

Oh I have to agree, that if firearms, OR fencing were accurately depicted in a film that was anything other than a straight documentary, people would be turning to each other in the theater with quizzical looks and saying such astute things as, "huh?" *laughing* I mean how could the mysterious assassin be suave screwing a Suppressor the size of a large pipe bomb on the end of his 45? Or how could you explain that he could only fire a single shot each time, cycling the slide manually after each shot?

We go to the movies to be catapulted into fantasy land, not strapped onto the sawhorse of reality... But people who are familiar with certain aspects that are depicted in film will always raise an eyebrow when something is amiss in the same way that John Q Public would if someone shouted "2 plus 2 equals the squareroot of 5 camels!"

My personal favorite is watching war movies where the German Tiger Tanks are American M60's adorned with Swastikas

"Die Another Day" was fun... period... a work of adventure and make believe... As a Bond film, I liked it, as a Bond film, not as a Fencing video or firearms documentary

I don't think that technical inaccuracies are unmasked simply to impress people with someone's blinding intellect, but simply because its like a small "slap in the face" while you're watching the film that disrupts the story a bit... You can't leave ALL of your brain outside the theater after all People who say that innacuracies in film NEVER bother them in the slightest can say that because they have never been presented with "right" inaccuracy

Have a good one!

Feanor