Summer National Equipment requirements?

[Jonathan Jefferies]

I am assuming you mean the US summer nationals. There are
a several other nationalities on this list. But for the
USFA summer nationals my observation is that the name is
required on the jacket or lame. The size is specified in
the rules on the USFA site. But I believe is either
2 or 3 inches. People do get away with a lot as far as
size, i.e. 2 inches. I have seen fencers with their
name done in magic marker on a piece of cloth which was
pinned to the back of their jackets using safety pins -
epeists. This is a national competition and I think everyone
should qualify as american in a legalistic sense so the
country is usually moot. The name is not required on the
leg but is really a nice feature.
j.

C-Sports wrote:
> What are the special equipment requirements for the nationals?
>
> Mask
>
> Jacket- do they need name on back and country?
>
> Pants? - Do they need name on leg? and which one?
>
> How big or how small do the letters need to be?
>
>

[Holly E. Ordway]

"C-Sports" <csports@epconline.com> wrote in
news:wJGdnTj0Hu3yYQOjXTWcrg@accessus.net:

> What are the special equipment requirements for the nationals?

For the U.S. Summer Nationals, all your equipment has to pass
armorer's tests (seems obvious, but if you're in an area where local
and regional competitions never, ever test equipment, it's wise to be
reminded of it!) So you can expect your mask to be punch tested and
visually inspected (and tested for conductivity if it is sabre mask),
your lame (and overglove in sabre) to be tested for conductivity (and
rips, tears, etc), and body cords (and mask cords) to be tested as
well. Tip: get your equipment checked *before* the morning of your
first event, so that if something doesn't pass, you can fix/replace it
without having a heart attack.

Your name does need to be either on the back of your lame (or jacket
in epee) or on your trailing leg - I'll let someone else fill in the
details on the size of the letters. As for me, I've had the lettering
done professionally, because it was worth it for me to a) not have to
mess around with it myself, and b) having it look nice.

It's convenient to have it done *at* Nationals (just again, it's best
not to try to do it the same day you have to fence) - I had both a
sabre and a foil lame (*) stencilled by Marx at Nationals, and boy do
they look nice. Alternatively, if you happen to be buying a new lame,
you can ask the equipment manufacturer to do it (for an additional
charge) - at least, Triplette does, and I had one sabre lame done that
way.

*) Sure, it would be more cost-effective to have it on my knickers,
but it just looks so much nicer on the back. Plus, I can toss my
knickers in the washer without worrying about the name fading.

--Holly

[Fencer91162]

>
>Your name does need to be either on the back of your lame (or jacket
>in epee) or on your trailing leg - I'll let someone else fill in the
>details on the size of the letters. As for me, I've had the lettering
>done professionally, because it was worth it for me to a) not have to
>mess around with it myself, and b) having it look nice.
>
I've done quite a bit of stencilling... the rules only say that the lettering
be "no more than 10 cm. high", or approximately 4". I've done lettering 2" and
3", depending on the length of the name and the person's preference. It's
supposed to be done in dark blue capital letters. They should NOT be done with
fabric paint, but fabric dye. Paint will coat the lame fabric and mess with
the conductivity. Fabric dye will not adhere to the metal.

It's really not that hard to do, if you have the right materials.

Debbie B

[Fencerbill]

In article <20030417162921.18985.00000146@mb-m14.aol.com>, fencer91162@aol.com
(Fencer91162) writes:

>I've done quite a bit of stencilling... the rules only say that the lettering
>be "no more than 10 cm. high", or approximately 4".

The rules say no less than 8 cm and no more than 10 cm.

I agree that for US you don't need the USA but I recommend it. Don't you think
you're good enough to fence in another country some day? Besides the USA is a
bargain. $20 for the name but $25 for name and USA.

The name on the trailing leg is only good in the USA. International requires
name on the back. World Cups now also require the National colors in a specific
pattern on the trailing leg.

Bill Hall

[Fencer91162]

>
>The rules say no less than 8 cm and no more than 10 cm.

Where? When I checked, it only said up to 10 cm. with no minimum. I was
looking in the Rule Book, pg. 149 (3 b.). Is it listed somewhere else?

Thanks,

Debbie B.

[Fencerbill]

In article <20030417170601.18877.00000135@mb-m14.aol.com>, fencer91162@aol.com
(Fencer91162) writes:

>Where? When I checked, it only said up to 10 cm. with no minimum. I was
>looking in the Rule Book, pg. 149 (3 b.). Is it listed somewhere else?
>

I agree with you that your reference to the rule book is correct.

I am still looking for the rest of it.

I worked as an armorer at the 2000 Junior/Cadet World Championships in South
Bend. We worked under the direct supervision of the FIE SEMI, responsible for
testing. We were told to fail any lame where the letters were less than 8 cm.
high (or more than 10 cm).

No, I can't give you the exact reference this minute but you had better believe
me. The insistence on the 8 cm high letters required the Marx stencilers to go
from their three inch stencil maker to a 10 inch stencil maker so it was
signicant to them.

I will look further for the reference.

Bill Hall

[Fencer91162]

>fencer91162@aol.com
>(Fencer91162) writes:
>
>>Where? When I checked, it only said up to 10 cm. with no minimum. I was
>>looking in the Rule Book, pg. 149 (3 b.). Is it listed somewhere else?
>>
>
>I agree with you that your reference to the rule book is correct.
>

Whew! I haven't lost my mind... completely... : )

>I am still looking for the rest of it.
>

Please post when you've found the reference.

>I worked as an armorer at the 2000 Junior/Cadet World Championships in South
>Bend. We worked under the direct supervision of the FIE SEMI, responsible for
>testing. We were told to fail any lame where the letters were less than 8 cm.
>high (or more than 10 cm).
>
>No, I can't give you the exact reference this minute but you had better
>believe
>me. The insistence on the 8 cm high letters required the Marx stencilers to
>go
>from their three inch stencil maker to a 10 inch stencil maker so it was
>signicant to them.
>
>I will look further for the reference.
>
>Bill Hall
>
>
Thanks for the heads up. My son and I will be going and I guess I'd better
figure out how to adjust our lettering. I hate the idea of having to buy two
new foil lames and two new jackets... <sigh> I haven't done his sabre lame or
the two used FIE jackets that I picked up... thank goodness.

I guess I'd better cut some new stencils...

Debbie B.

[Fencerbill]

In article <20030417173422.18877.00000139@mb-m14.aol.com>, fencer91162@aol.com
(Fencer91162) writes:

>Thanks for the heads up. My son and I will be going and I guess I'd better
>figure out how to adjust our lettering. I hate the idea of having to buy two
>new foil lames and two new jackets... <sigh> I haven't done his sabre lame
>or
>the two used FIE jackets that I picked up... thank goodness.
>
>I guess I'd better cut some new stencils...
>
>Debbie B.

Don't do anything yet.

They are not as persnickety at US events as the FIE is at World Championships.
If the fencer's name is neatly done, particularly if it is almost 8 cm high,
they probably won't do anything. I have seen many fencers at NACs this year
whose name didn't strictly comply with the 8-10 cm requirement.

The armorers won't fail the Lames because the USFA allows the option of the
name on the leg. And how many directors make a fuss over the exact size of the
name as long as there is a name? At the point of checking fencers into a pool,
with the bout committee breathing down their necks to get done as soon as
possible?

One thing we did see at South Bend was dozens of fencers using blue magic
markers to extend the height of their names. You just extend the lines and
fatten the curves. If you do it neatly it doesn't look too bad. I was checking
a Lame just last year for a Canadian fencer when I noticed it had such changes.
I asked him if he had been in South Bend and he just laughed.

So, my advice is this: Get a blue dye (not paint, and permanent, not washable)
marker and carry it with you to NACs. If anyone says anything, they will
probably tell you to get it fixed by the DE's or the next event.

In any case, don't trash the Lame. You can always get a patch of Lame cloth,
Vendors sell it by the yard or Ye Olde Armorer will have some. Cover over the
wrong sized name and redo the name in the correct size.

Bill Hall

[Fencerbill]

In article <20030417173422.18877.00000139@mb-m14.aol.com>, fencer91162@aol.com
(Fencer91162) writes:

>Thanks for the heads up. My son and I will be going and I guess I'd better
>figure out how to adjust our lettering. I hate the idea of having to buy two
>new foil lames and two new jackets... <sigh> I haven't done his sabre lame
>or
>the two used FIE jackets that I picked up... thank goodness.
>
>I guess I'd better cut some new stencils...
>
>Debbie B.

Don't do anything yet.

They are not as persnickety at US events as the FIE is at World Championships.
If the fencer's name is neatly done, particularly if it is almost 8 cm high,
they probably won't do anything. I have seen many fencers at NACs this year
whose name didn't strictly comply with the 8-10 cm requirement.

The armorers won't fail the Lames because the USFA allows the option of the
name on the leg. And how many directors make a fuss over the exact size of the
name as long as there is a name? At the point of checking fencers into a pool,
with the bout committee breathing down their necks to get done as soon as
possible?

One thing we did see at South Bend was dozens of fencers using blue magic
markers to extend the height of their names. You just extend the lines and
fatten the curves. If you do it neatly it doesn't look too bad. I was checking
a Lame just last year for a Canadian fencer when I noticed it had such changes.
I asked him if he had been in South Bend and he just laughed.

So, my advice is this: Get a blue dye (not paint, and permanent, not washable)
marker and carry it with you to NACs. If anyone says anything, they will
probably tell you to get it fixed by the DE's or the next event.

In any case, don't trash the Lame. You can always get a patch of Lame cloth,
Vendors sell it by the yard or Ye Olde Armorer will have some. Cover over the
wrong sized name and redo the name in the correct size.

Bill Hall

[Mark C. Orton]

On 17 Apr 2003 21:26:13 GMT, fencerbill@aol.com (Fencerbill) wrote:

> In article <20030417170601.18877.00000135@mb-m14.aol.com>, fencer91162@aol.com
> (Fencer91162) writes:
>
> >Where? When I checked, it only said up to 10 cm. with no minimum. I was
> >looking in the Rule Book, pg. 149 (3 b.). Is it listed somewhere else?
> >
>
> I agree with you that your reference to the rule book is correct.
>
> I am still looking for the rest of it.

I suspect the 8 cm minimum is somebody's interpretation of the
requirement that the letters be legible.

-Mark-

[David Neevel]

If you look at the online copy of the rules at the FIE website, the 8-10 cm
specifcation is
in there. The omission of the lower limit is an error in the US edition.

-Dave

Fencerbill wrote:

> In article <20030417170601.18877.00000135@mb-m14.aol.com>, fencer91162@aol.com
> (Fencer91162) writes:
>
> >Where? When I checked, it only said up to 10 cm. with no minimum. I was
> >looking in the Rule Book, pg. 149 (3 b.). Is it listed somewhere else?
> >
>
> I agree with you that your reference to the rule book is correct.
>
> I am still looking for the rest of it.
>
> I worked as an armorer at the 2000 Junior/Cadet World Championships in South
> Bend. We worked under the direct supervision of the FIE SEMI, responsible for
> testing. We were told to fail any lame where the letters were less than 8 cm.
> high (or more than 10 cm).
>
> No, I can't give you the exact reference this minute but you had better believe
> me. The insistence on the 8 cm high letters required the Marx stencilers to go
> from their three inch stencil maker to a 10 inch stencil maker so it was
> signicant to them.
>
> I will look further for the reference.
>
> Bill Hall

[Mark C. Orton]

On Fri, 18 Apr 2003 18:21:15 -0500, David Neevel <neevel@execpc.com>
wrote:

> If you look at the online copy of the rules at the FIE website, the 8-10 cm
> specifcation is
> in there. The omission of the lower limit is an error in the US edition.

Specifically, it's in the Publicity Code, IV (C) (b).

I see additional material differences between the USFA and FIE
versions in the same paragraph (50 vs. 75 cm^2, 200 vs. 300 cm^2)
which suggest the USFA document is out of date.

-Mark-

[C-Sports]

What are the special equipment requirements for the nationals?

Mask

Jacket- do they need name on back and country?

Pants? - Do they need name on leg? and which one?

How big or how small do the letters need to be?

[Jonathan Jefferies]

I am assuming you mean the US summer nationals. There are
a several other nationalities on this list. But for the
USFA summer nationals my observation is that the name is
required on the jacket or lame. The size is specified in
the rules on the USFA site. But I believe is either
2 or 3 inches. People do get away with a lot as far as
size, i.e. 2 inches. I have seen fencers with their
name done in magic marker on a piece of cloth which was
pinned to the back of their jackets using safety pins -
epeists. This is a national competition and I think everyone
should qualify as american in a legalistic sense so the
country is usually moot. The name is not required on the
leg but is really a nice feature.
j.

C-Sports wrote:
> What are the special equipment requirements for the nationals?
>
> Mask
>
> Jacket- do they need name on back and country?
>
> Pants? - Do they need name on leg? and which one?
>
> How big or how small do the letters need to be?
>
>

[Holly E. Ordway]

"C-Sports" <csports@epconline.com> wrote in
news:wJGdnTj0Hu3yYQOjXTWcrg@accessus.net:

> What are the special equipment requirements for the nationals?

For the U.S. Summer Nationals, all your equipment has to pass
armorer's tests (seems obvious, but if you're in an area where local
and regional competitions never, ever test equipment, it's wise to be
reminded of it!) So you can expect your mask to be punch tested and
visually inspected (and tested for conductivity if it is sabre mask),
your lame (and overglove in sabre) to be tested for conductivity (and
rips, tears, etc), and body cords (and mask cords) to be tested as
well. Tip: get your equipment checked *before* the morning of your
first event, so that if something doesn't pass, you can fix/replace it
without having a heart attack.

Your name does need to be either on the back of your lame (or jacket
in epee) or on your trailing leg - I'll let someone else fill in the
details on the size of the letters. As for me, I've had the lettering
done professionally, because it was worth it for me to a) not have to
mess around with it myself, and b) having it look nice.

It's convenient to have it done *at* Nationals (just again, it's best
not to try to do it the same day you have to fence) - I had both a
sabre and a foil lame (*) stencilled by Marx at Nationals, and boy do
they look nice. Alternatively, if you happen to be buying a new lame,
you can ask the equipment manufacturer to do it (for an additional
charge) - at least, Triplette does, and I had one sabre lame done that
way.

*) Sure, it would be more cost-effective to have it on my knickers,
but it just looks so much nicer on the back. Plus, I can toss my
knickers in the washer without worrying about the name fading.

--Holly

[Fencer91162]

>
>Your name does need to be either on the back of your lame (or jacket
>in epee) or on your trailing leg - I'll let someone else fill in the
>details on the size of the letters. As for me, I've had the lettering
>done professionally, because it was worth it for me to a) not have to
>mess around with it myself, and b) having it look nice.
>
I've done quite a bit of stencilling... the rules only say that the lettering
be "no more than 10 cm. high", or approximately 4". I've done lettering 2" and
3", depending on the length of the name and the person's preference. It's
supposed to be done in dark blue capital letters. They should NOT be done with
fabric paint, but fabric dye. Paint will coat the lame fabric and mess with
the conductivity. Fabric dye will not adhere to the metal.

It's really not that hard to do, if you have the right materials.

Debbie B

[Fencerbill]

In article <20030417162921.18985.00000146@mb-m14.aol.com>, fencer91162@aol.com
(Fencer91162) writes:

>I've done quite a bit of stencilling... the rules only say that the lettering
>be "no more than 10 cm. high", or approximately 4".

The rules say no less than 8 cm and no more than 10 cm.

I agree that for US you don't need the USA but I recommend it. Don't you think
you're good enough to fence in another country some day? Besides the USA is a
bargain. $20 for the name but $25 for name and USA.

The name on the trailing leg is only good in the USA. International requires
name on the back. World Cups now also require the National colors in a specific
pattern on the trailing leg.

Bill Hall