Warning: Venting re NAC event scheduling

[Mattie & John Condray]

Just wanted to vent a bit over the spacing of the Women's Foil (and saber,
even tho I only fence foil) events at the upcoming Div II/III/Veteran's NAC.
The USFA has scheduled the Div II and III events for the first and last days
(Friday and Monday). Thus, if I want to fence both events, which would be
nice if I'm going to schlepp all the way to Texas, I will end up having to
take 4 days off of work and cough up for 5 nights at a hotel. Which means
that I probably won't bother going at all. With the exception of women's
saber, each of the other Div II/III events are back to back, making for a
more reasonable trip (from both a monetary and time cost standpoint). I
find it hard to believe that the schedulers couldn't have come up with a
formula that at least had these events no more than two days apart.

Thanks for letting me complain. -mcc

[Fencerbill]

Guess the USFA has the same attitude towards Womens Sabre as the FIE has.

Bill Hall

[Fencerbill]

Guess the USFA has the same attitude towards Womens Sabre as the FIE has.

Bill Hall

[Holly E. Ordway]

"Mattie & John Condray" <chezcondray@comcast.net> wrote in
<isGdnZGC-P0HTrejXTWcog@comcast.com>:

>Just wanted to vent a bit over the spacing of the Women's Foil (and
>saber, even tho I only fence foil) events at the upcoming Div
>II/III/Veteran's NAC. The USFA has scheduled the Div II and III
>events for the first and last days (Friday and Monday). Thus, if I
>want to fence both events, which would be nice if I'm going to
>schlepp all the way to Texas, I will end up having to take 4 days off
>of work and cough up for 5 nights at a hotel. Which means that I
>probably won't bother going at all.

That makes two of us. I had also planned to go until I saw the schedule.
I had intended to fence both foil and sabre, but as Mattie points out,
both events are spread out too much.

Not to be a conspiracy theorist, but not only did the women's sabre and
foil get the worst schedule in terms of being spread out over four days,
but also in terms of being back-to-back with other women's events.
Women's Div III foil and sabre are on the same day, as are women's Div II
foil and sabre. The men's events have some overlap but none of them have
that kind of one-to-one matchup that shafts female sabre/foilists.

--Holly

[Holly E. Ordway]

"Mattie & John Condray" <chezcondray@comcast.net> wrote in
<isGdnZGC-P0HTrejXTWcog@comcast.com>:

>Just wanted to vent a bit over the spacing of the Women's Foil (and
>saber, even tho I only fence foil) events at the upcoming Div
>II/III/Veteran's NAC. The USFA has scheduled the Div II and III
>events for the first and last days (Friday and Monday). Thus, if I
>want to fence both events, which would be nice if I'm going to
>schlepp all the way to Texas, I will end up having to take 4 days off
>of work and cough up for 5 nights at a hotel. Which means that I
>probably won't bother going at all.

That makes two of us. I had also planned to go until I saw the schedule.
I had intended to fence both foil and sabre, but as Mattie points out,
both events are spread out too much.

Not to be a conspiracy theorist, but not only did the women's sabre and
foil get the worst schedule in terms of being spread out over four days,
but also in terms of being back-to-back with other women's events.
Women's Div III foil and sabre are on the same day, as are women's Div II
foil and sabre. The men's events have some overlap but none of them have
that kind of one-to-one matchup that shafts female sabre/foilists.

--Holly

[CLHagenMN]

In article <isGdnZGC-P0HTrejXTWcog@comcast.com>, "Mattie & John Condray"
<chezcondray@comcast.net> writes:

>Subject: Warning: Venting re NAC event scheduling
>From: "Mattie & John Condray" <chezcondray@comcast.net>
>Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 11:38:16 -0500
>
>Just wanted to vent a bit over the spacing of the Women's Foil (and saber,
>even tho I only fence foil) events at the upcoming Div II/III/Veteran's NAC.
>The USFA has scheduled the Div II and III events for the first and last days
>(Friday and Monday). Thus, if I want to fence both events, which would be
>nice if I'm going to schlepp all the way to Texas, I will end up having to
>take 4 days off of work and cough up for 5 nights at a hotel. Which means
>that I probably won't bother going at all. With the exception of women's
>saber, each of the other Div II/III events are back to back, making for a
>more reasonable trip (from both a monetary and time cost standpoint). I
>find it hard to believe that the schedulers couldn't have come up with a
>formula that at least had these events no more than two days apart.
>
>Thanks for letting me complain. -mcc

Well, I am not going to say that the USFA event scheduling process, of late,
has made to much sense to me, either, (I was a liitle disappointed in Austin,
2000, when ALL Div 1A, Div 2 and Div 3 events were scheduled in 4 days, and I
had to make some choices), I WILL say that it poses a much more complicated
challenge than previously (i.e. back in the days when they didn't have the
NAC's, and the US Nationals (Before 'Summer Nationals') only had Open events,
Junior events, and Open Team events.

Taking into account that fact the SOME people fence more than one weapon, and
in different divsions, and SOME kids (and a few veterans for that matter) are
at the top of the senior points lists, there really isn't going to be any way
to make everybody happy. THAT said, there still are numerous confounding
occurances of events being scheduled in what could easily be predicted to cause
people conflicts; there's just too many events, and too many people fencing
different mixes of events to be able to make it work for everyone.

You will just have to decide what you are really trying to get out of the
events, and which ones will give you the best chance of getting that.

Have a nice day!

[CLHagenMN]

In article <isGdnZGC-P0HTrejXTWcog@comcast.com>, "Mattie & John Condray"
<chezcondray@comcast.net> writes:

>Subject: Warning: Venting re NAC event scheduling
>From: "Mattie & John Condray" <chezcondray@comcast.net>
>Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 11:38:16 -0500
>
>Just wanted to vent a bit over the spacing of the Women's Foil (and saber,
>even tho I only fence foil) events at the upcoming Div II/III/Veteran's NAC.
>The USFA has scheduled the Div II and III events for the first and last days
>(Friday and Monday). Thus, if I want to fence both events, which would be
>nice if I'm going to schlepp all the way to Texas, I will end up having to
>take 4 days off of work and cough up for 5 nights at a hotel. Which means
>that I probably won't bother going at all. With the exception of women's
>saber, each of the other Div II/III events are back to back, making for a
>more reasonable trip (from both a monetary and time cost standpoint). I
>find it hard to believe that the schedulers couldn't have come up with a
>formula that at least had these events no more than two days apart.
>
>Thanks for letting me complain. -mcc

Well, I am not going to say that the USFA event scheduling process, of late,
has made to much sense to me, either, (I was a liitle disappointed in Austin,
2000, when ALL Div 1A, Div 2 and Div 3 events were scheduled in 4 days, and I
had to make some choices), I WILL say that it poses a much more complicated
challenge than previously (i.e. back in the days when they didn't have the
NAC's, and the US Nationals (Before 'Summer Nationals') only had Open events,
Junior events, and Open Team events.

Taking into account that fact the SOME people fence more than one weapon, and
in different divsions, and SOME kids (and a few veterans for that matter) are
at the top of the senior points lists, there really isn't going to be any way
to make everybody happy. THAT said, there still are numerous confounding
occurances of events being scheduled in what could easily be predicted to cause
people conflicts; there's just too many events, and too many people fencing
different mixes of events to be able to make it work for everyone.

You will just have to decide what you are really trying to get out of the
events, and which ones will give you the best chance of getting that.

Have a nice day!

[Carol]

"Holly E. Ordway" wrote:

> Not to be a conspiracy theorist, but not only did the women's sabre and
> foil get the worst schedule in terms of being spread out over four days,
> but also in terms of being back-to-back with other women's events.
> Women's Div III foil and sabre are on the same day, as are women's Div II
> foil and sabre. The men's events have some overlap but none of them have
> that kind of one-to-one matchup that shafts female sabre/foilists.

At least the USFA could make a change now to make Div II WF and Div III WS
on one day, and Div II WS and Div III WF on another day -- in that way, it
would give people more events to fence in to make the 4 day spread
worthwhile.

There is still time for the USFA to make this change -- and if they do, then
they would have to change one of either the Div II or Div III WE in order to
let WF and WS be able to fence in both Div II and Div III -- only a couple
of moves, and it would make more people happier, as well as allow more
people to attend rather than the many that are opting out now due to the
schedule.

[Carol]

"Holly E. Ordway" wrote:

> Not to be a conspiracy theorist, but not only did the women's sabre and
> foil get the worst schedule in terms of being spread out over four days,
> but also in terms of being back-to-back with other women's events.
> Women's Div III foil and sabre are on the same day, as are women's Div II
> foil and sabre. The men's events have some overlap but none of them have
> that kind of one-to-one matchup that shafts female sabre/foilists.

At least the USFA could make a change now to make Div II WF and Div III WS
on one day, and Div II WS and Div III WF on another day -- in that way, it
would give people more events to fence in to make the 4 day spread
worthwhile.

There is still time for the USFA to make this change -- and if they do, then
they would have to change one of either the Div II or Div III WE in order to
let WF and WS be able to fence in both Div II and Div III -- only a couple
of moves, and it would make more people happier, as well as allow more
people to attend rather than the many that are opting out now due to the
schedule.

[William Marshal]

Everyone seems to get a turn at this treatment. This is the first NAC
I can remember for which all the MS events are consecutive. Even if
you don't fence multiple weapons those spreads can be a deterrent to
those with more energy that time or money. I gave Nationals a miss
last year for just this reason---a day or two between events.

Given the number of entrants for events like MF and ME, and the time
those two weapons consume, I can see how it'd be difficult to fit
every weapon's events into consecutive days. At least they don't hit
the same one every time. But sabre does seem to get more than its
share of the muddy stick...

( Heh, and if they DID figure out a way to put all weapons on
successive days, there'd still be complaints from those who "need a
day of rest in between"! )

[William Marshal]

Everyone seems to get a turn at this treatment. This is the first NAC
I can remember for which all the MS events are consecutive. Even if
you don't fence multiple weapons those spreads can be a deterrent to
those with more energy that time or money. I gave Nationals a miss
last year for just this reason---a day or two between events.

Given the number of entrants for events like MF and ME, and the time
those two weapons consume, I can see how it'd be difficult to fit
every weapon's events into consecutive days. At least they don't hit
the same one every time. But sabre does seem to get more than its
share of the muddy stick...

( Heh, and if they DID figure out a way to put all weapons on
successive days, there'd still be complaints from those who "need a
day of rest in between"! )

[Mattie & John Condray]

I wouldn't have even minded so much a day between events, but one event is
Friday and the other isn't until Monday. To do both, I'd end up taking 4
days off of work. I may not have even take 4 whole days off of work for
last year's Summer Nationals, at which I fenced in 4 events. Oh well, kind
of the USFA to save me the time and money, I suppose.......