fleche in sabre

[tauman]

I have a few questions for all you sabre people.

When was the fleche removed from sport sabre?

Why was it removed?

General opinions about this?

[sabreur]

In the early nineties.

To stop the senseless running hither and yon.

Yes, IMNSHO it was a good idea. Sabre fencers now use classical footwork, the game has improved, and we've developed a pseudo fleche that works almost as well as the real fleche did, so you still have that tool in the kit bag if you need it.

This from someone who fenced dry sabre for seven years in the good old days.

MR

[edew]

Originally posted by tauman
I have a few questions for all you sabre people.

When was the fleche removed from sport sabre?

Why was it removed?

General opinions about this?

Around 1992.

Because the running made sabre a dull sport.

Good idea.

[pkt]

Good grief, have we been fencing without fleche i nsabre for almost 10 years now? Time flies.

Sabre rules have changed the most in the 30+ years I've been fencing. But now the weapon is in my biased opinion the best of the 3 weapons.

In the fleche legal days, it was fleche, and running all the time, very little finesse. Now sabreurs actually have to have very strong footwork. stronger than before for sure.

I enjoy it more now, esp. w/ the electric stuff.

PK

[Tsu-La]

I think we must have the strongest footwork of all the weapons now! I have a coach who misses it for a very simple - and a bit funny - reason. He could put out line and they wouldn't know what to do with it (as is true nowadays) so they'd just fleche onto it.

There also used to be rules such as running off the end of the strip was not a penalty, and that after three simultaneouses someone was given priority, and in the next simultaneous, that person would get the touch, then the priority would switch again. Also, the hand used to be target.

[It]

I think we should bring back the Horse. The there will never be question on cross-overs or fleche's. And we wouldn't have to do as much footwork!






Just Kidding!

[oiuyt]

Quick direction changes (especially without turning the back) become more problematical with this approach however....

-B :)

[Peach]

I know! Put the horse on wheels! That's the ticket!

[KShan5[PrFC]]

Sabre fencer....for about 2 years, no idea what crossing over is like. But I do agree, on speculation, that it would be ugly, and I also think it would get boring.

[pkt]

KShan5[PrFC]

It used to be the best flechers were sabreurs.
Try the 'proper'fleche with any combo of footwork.
In fact a few weeks ago, my partner and I tried doing the old-fashioned fleche and we found that we - a couple of old fartsone 40-something and I over 50 - were not in shape for all the running... Perhaps we overdid the fleches just a bit...

PK

[counter riposte]

Agreed with the rest of the thread. Fleche in sabre really takes all of the strategy out of the game, since you can just run at your opponent. It then comes down to a matter of watching two people in simultaneous attacks.... over... and over... and over.... and over.........

Sound familiar to any sabreours out there?

In any case, the footwork has become necessarily better because of it. Unfortunately, that means I can't really fleche in another weapon. I tried doing the fleche in foil, then feeling incredibly stupid doing so.... I fell.... forward. Ouch.....

[edew]

Just a quick note about the fleche. In no weapon is the fleche intended to be used as a distance attack. A long advance lunge or ballestra lunge will cover as much or more distance.

The point of the fleche is quick and surprising change in speed and direction.

If you note, for example, that when one is retreating, the weight is somewhere over the front leg, to allow the rear leg to lift off and gain ground. If most of your weight is on your back leg, you can't lift it to retreat.

Well, the fleche starts basically from that position: the front-weighted position. So, as you retreat and your opponent is chasing you, you can make that quick forward and surprising movement, like the fleche, when your opponent sorta peters out in advancing after you. They stop, you make your 180 in movement direction and whammo! you hit your opponent with the fleche.

The fleche when moving forward is similar: you're almost there and you just need that little reach to make that tap to the head or poke to the chest.

But in the sabre, that fleche, over the years had corrupted into chasing the opponent down the street holding a meat cleaver. That just didn't work very well.

[pkt]

"But in the sabre, that fleche, over the years had corrupted into chasing the opponent down the street holding a meat cleaver. That just didn't work very well."

edew,

The imagery of that last para. is most colourful and to the point. Esp. when the sabre piste was 18m.

PK