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Thread: 2011-2012 Season Changes

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    2011-2012 Season Changes

    Post 'em as you find 'em for the 2011-2012 season

    Epee change: It looks like they've done away with Repechage for Cadet and Junior events, but are continuing it for DIV I events.

    http://assets.teamusa.org/assets/doc...nt_Formats.pdf
    Last edited by kathe23; 07-29-2011 at 09:59 AM. Reason: Added link and tried to change dates to 2011-2012

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    Division IA Qualification Paths for US Nationals

    Division IA Nationals is now primarily driven through the ROC (Regional Open Circuit) system:

    http://www.fencing.net/4518/division...e-roc-edition/

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    I read Craig's article regarding the Div IA qualifiction path, and he touched on Div II and DIv III qualifications as well. It got me wondering what the current qualification path for Vet's is now? Do we only have to compete in a NAC or ROC to auto-qualify for SN, or is there another specific qualification path (having to compete in a Vet ROC or NAC)? Or will the powers that be just let us show up whenever we are able?

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    Quote Originally Posted by shlepzig View Post
    I read Craig's article regarding the Div IA qualifiction path, and he touched on Div II and DIv III qualifications as well. It got me wondering what the current qualification path for Vet's is now? Do we only have to compete in a NAC or ROC to auto-qualify for SN, or is there another specific qualification path (having to compete in a Vet ROC or NAC)? Or will the powers that be just let us show up whenever we are able?
    (1) It was Michael's article. Let's make sure to credit the guy that did the research and pulled it together.

    (2) Vet is unchanged.

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    For the moment. The Board and Committees seem to enjoy fixing what isn't broken, though, so stand by...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig View Post
    (1) It was Michael's article. Let's make sure to credit the guy that did the research and pulled it together.

    (2) Vet is unchanged.
    Apologies to Michael. I just had followed two links you had posted, my brain had followed suit.

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    I think the article seems to suggest that Div II ROCs do not qualify you for Div II Summer Nationals, but they do. According to the ROC Bid packet:

    "At the time of publication of this bid packet, the top 10% of the competitive field (with a minimum of 4; “trickledown” is allowed) of a 2011- 2012 Division II ROC will qualify for the 2012 Division II National Championships."

    Of course, who knows what has changed since the publication of the bid packet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hello? View Post
    I think the article seems to suggest that Div II ROCs do not qualify you for Div II Summer Nationals, but they do. According to the ROC Bid packet:

    "At the time of publication of this bid packet, the top 10% of the competitive field (with a minimum of 4; “trickledown” is allowed) of a 2011- 2012 Division II ROC will qualify for the 2012 Division II National Championships."

    Of course, who knows what has changed since the publication of the bid packet.
    That qualification path was in place last year, hence the "no changes have been made" statement.

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    Another change to the qualification path is in order for fencers to qualify for junior and cadet junior Olympics they must have a top 32 placement even if they have over the minimum number of points to be considered on the points lists.

    If JO qualifiers were held today, this means that the person ranked 52nd on the Jr ME points list would not be qualified, while a person from a small division with fewer than 3 fencers, could walk up and qualify regardless of their fencing ability.
    Last edited by teacup; 07-30-2011 at 01:09 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by teacup View Post
    If JO qualifiers were held today, this means that the person ranked 52nd on the Jr ME points list would not be qualified, while a person from a small division with fewer than 3 fencers, could walk up and qualify regardless of their fencing ability.
    So Junior Olympics qualification works similarly to the big Olympics!
    catwood1 likes this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by teacup View Post
    Another change to the qualification path is in order for fencers to qualify for junior and cadet junior Olympics they must have a top 32 placement even if they have over the minimum number of points to be considered on the points lists.

    If JO qualifiers were held today, this means that the person ranked 52nd on the Jr ME points list would not be qualified, while a person from a small division with fewer than 3 fencers, could walk up and qualify regardless of their fencing ability.
    This does not strike me as unreasonable. It affects people who are either getting points for placing 33-64 now in big events or went to a Junior WC and got anything at all. These are not striking me as people who need to be autoqualifiers and they weren't before either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kathe23 View Post
    Post 'em as you find 'em for the 2011-2012 season

    Epee change: It looks like they've done away with Repechage for Cadet and Junior events, but are continuing it for DIV I events.

    http://assets.teamusa.org/assets/doc...nt_Formats.pdf
    I would be fairly surprised if there aren't changes to the formats, as currently listed in that document. E.g., I don't expect us actually to protect all points-holders in all of the events other than IA/II/III. It would be a fairly massive change to how we've done seeding in the past (where for most non-Div I events only a relative handful of points-holders are protected with the rest moving to the top of their major (letter) classification). I suspect that it is not an intentional element/feature of this document and will be corrected at some point.

    -B
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig View Post

    (2) Vet is unchanged.
    Kind of. Technically, if you are an A or B Vet, you would have had to qualify at Sectionals, right? I guess now you would have to qualify at a ROC. (Although I doubt that any A or B Vet has not gone to Vet tournaments...although it's possible that there could be A-rated 40-50 year olds who have dismissed the tournament and then decide they might as well fence it at SNs.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by hello? View Post
    Kind of. Technically, if you are an A or B Vet, you would have had to qualify at Sectionals, right?
    I qualified by fencing at a Vet NAC. Last season Sectionals was one additional qualifying path, but there were still NACs and ROCs. This year it's NACs and ROCs for the A or B level Vet.

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    2011-2012 Veteran Qualification Path

    Veteran – V40, V50, V60, V70 – USA Fencing National Championships
    VETERAN – must meet age eligibility requirements above AND compete in

    • Current season Division qualifying competition for Division II and/or Division III Championships in which only those with a “C” classification or lower (D, E, or U) may compete
    • OR Any Regional Open Circuit event during the current season
    • OR Any NAC during the current season.



    (From the 5/12/2011 BOD Meeting Minutes)

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    2011-2012 Season Changes from BOD Meeting Minutes

    One Day Memberships: Now $20 and you get that money applied to a full membership:

    4/21/11 - "For the 2011-12 season, the price of one-day memberships be increased from $10 to $20."

    5/12/11 - "When an individual pays for a one-day membership for the first time, the initial fee can be applied towards a higher class of membership in the same season. Effective August 1, 2011."

    $10 Processing fee for mailed or faxed USA Fencing Memberships

    6/9/11 - $10 processing fee for faxed or mailed in membership applications. Waived for registration forms filled out at local fencing tournaments. Goal is to drive more people to sign up online. Office to produce a new membership sign up form for 2011-2012 season. (pp 3)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig View Post
    One Day Memberships: Now $20 and you get that money applied to a full membership:

    4/21/11 - "For the 2011-12 season, the price of one-day memberships be increased from $10 to $20."

    5/12/11 - "When an individual pays for a one-day membership for the first time, the initial fee can be applied towards a higher class of membership in the same season. Effective August 1, 2011."

    $10 Processing fee for mailed or faxed USA Fencing Memberships

    6/9/11 - $10 processing fee for faxed or mailed in membership applications. Waived for registration forms filled out at local fencing tournaments. Goal is to drive more people to sign up online. Office to produce a new membership sign up form for 2011-2012 season. (pp 3)
    This is a silly question, but is there an adavntage for a 1 day membership? Perhaps it's for those people who didn't become a member, but want to fence a sanctioned event?
    I have yet to become a member, but in all probability will have that rectified before the end of the week. I'm wondering if I'm missing something though.
    Thanks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeremyb215 View Post
    This is a silly question, but is there an adavntage for a 1 day membership? Perhaps it's for those people who didn't become a member, but want to fence a sanctioned event?
    I have yet to become a member, but in all probability will have that rectified before the end of the week. I'm wondering if I'm missing something though.
    Thanks.
    A 1-day membership might make sense if you are a HS fencer that only plans to fence in one or two events during the season. If you plan to fence in more than three events in a season, a 1-day membership does not make sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig View Post
    I qualified by fencing at a Vet NAC. Last season Sectionals was one additional qualifying path, but there were still NACs and ROCs. This year it's NACs and ROCs for the A or B level Vet.
    Yes. That's what I meant by this:

    Quote Originally Posted by hello? View Post
    Kind of. Technically, if you are an A or B Vet, you would have had to qualify at Sectionals, right? I guess now you would have to qualify at a ROC. (Although I doubt that any A or B Vet has not gone to Vet tournaments...although it's possible that there could be A-rated 40-50 year olds who have dismissed the tournament and then decide they might as well fence it at SNs.)
    That most Vets who would want to fence Vet at SNs have gone (and qualified) through Vet NACs and therefore do not need to qualify elsewhere. (The only exception I could think of was the A-rated fencer in his forties who has not been interested in fencing Vets before and that suddenly decides he want to at SNs. Even if he's on the Senior Point List, he would have to qualify through a ROC.)

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    If you have Senior Points the odds are extremely high that you attended a Div I NAC and so are qualified under the "attend ANY NAC" rule.
    Inquartata likes this.

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