Olympic Qualification Standings - Late in the Evening Edition

[edew]

I thought you might prefer Italy, where it is still socially acceptable to grab random woman's butts.

I do like Italy. I'm just remarking on the nice pictures of Tallinn.

[ravlik]

I thought you might prefer Italy, where it is still socially acceptable to grab random woman's butts.

Translation from russian with some updates for the thread:

- Captain, you have such success with women. How do you achieve it?
- Simple, I just walk from behind and grab her butt.
- But you could get slapped in the face!!
- Yhea .. May be .. Sometimes...But usually it is success

[Allex]

Hi, Craig. Is the Men's Epee spreadsheet unfinished on this thread?

[misha]

Hi, Craig. Is the Men's Epee spreadsheet unfinished on this thread?

Looks like he updated the points but have not re-sorted placements..

I take that back - look at the "Qualifications" tab - it seems up to date to me

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[Allex]

Looks like he updated the points but have not re-sorted placements..

I take that back - look at the "Qualifications" tab - it seems up to date to me

.

Yes - thank you; and yes - Craig as always is correct - Seth' best chance of qualification is to have Venezuelans fence out of their minds - at least one of them; and for Canadians to fail. Cody's pretty much out unless he finishes in Top 2.
Top 13 are pretty much in, as are the Africans and Li (China), what amazes me that 2006 World Champion Wang Lei still has a great shot of going with 28 points so far. Correct?

[misha]

2. Individual qualification for Men’s Epee and Women’s Sabre
There are 30 places for each weapon and they are allocated as follows:
1. the first 12 from the individual FIE Official Ranking;
2. the first 8 from the individual AOR by zone, with only 1 fencer from any one country (2 for Europe, 2
for Asia-Oceania, 2 for America and 2 for Africa);
3. the 10 fencers from the zone-qualifying events which are only open to the countries that do not have
any fencers who have qualified through the two criteria above in the weapon concerned - 1 fencer per
country and per weapon - (4 for Europe, 3 for Asia-Oceania, 2 for America and 1 for Africa).

In no case may a country qualify more than 2 fencers per weapon through the 1 and 2 criteria.

Yes - thank you; and yes - Craig as always is correct - Seth' best chance of qualification is to have Venezuelans fence out of their minds - at least one of them; and for Canadians to fail. Cody's pretty much out unless he finishes in Top 2.
Top 13 are pretty much in, as are the Africans and Li (China),

So if both VEN perform badly and drop from top 12, only one of them qualifies.
On the other hand if both do well and make top12 it will vacate a spot for a Canadian

Cody will need a win and not more than 2 points by Seth

I would say top 11 are in, except may be IMRE (HUN) who I think still can be theoretically dropped but unlikely...
plus BOUZAID Alexandre (SEN) is in for sure, others are still questionable

what amazes me that 2006 World Champion Wang Lei still has a great shot of going with 28 points so far. Correct?

Wang Lei is out - he would need to overtake his countryman LI Guojie who has 68 points and only 32 points are available for the 1st place.

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[Allex]

2.
Wang Lei is out - he would need to overtake his countryman LI Guojie who has 68 points and only 32 points are available for the 1st place.

.

Correct - completely slipped my mind that only 1 fencer per country can qualify for zonal slots - sorry.

[gladius]

French are notorious to do things their way and they have posted this AOR after Tallin for ME.

From here

AOR - Men's Épée

1- Paolo Pizzo (ITA) - 176 points
2- Bas Verwijlen (NED) - 150
3- Kyoung Doo Park (KOR) - 146
4- Fabian Kauter (SUI) - 141
5- Max Heinzer (SUI) - 129
6- Nikolai Novosjolov (EST) - 135
7- Gauthier Grumier (FRA) - 126
8- Soren Thompson (USA) - 118
9- Geza Imre (HUN) - 117
10- Elmir Alimzhanov (KAZ) - 111
11- Jin Sun Jung (KOR) - 101
12- Silvio Fernandez (VEN) - 101
13- Yannick Borel (FRA) - 99
14- Ruben Limardo (VEN) - 99
15- Jörg Fiedler (GER) - 95
16- Matteo Tagliariol (ITA) - 90
17- Gabor Boczko (HUN) - 90
18- Alfredo Rota (ITA) - 90
19- Ronan Gustin (FRA) - 89
20- Radoslaw Zawrotniak (POL) - 83


I don't take this as the final word since in this list it appears that the positions of Novosjolov and Heinzer are switched, but the points calculated by the French are in some instances different from Craig's list.

[Allex]

French are notorious to do things their way and they have posted this AOR after Tallin for ME.

From here

AOR - Men's Épée

1- Paolo Pizzo (ITA) - 176 points
2- Bas Verwijlen (NED) - 150
3- Kyoung Doo Park (KOR) - 146
4- Fabian Kauter (SUI) - 141
5- Max Heinzer (SUI) - 129
6- Nikolai Novosjolov (EST) - 135
7- Gauthier Grumier (FRA) - 126
8- Soren Thompson (USA) - 118
9- Geza Imre (HUN) - 117
10- Elmir Alimzhanov (KAZ) - 111
11- Jin Sun Jung (KOR) - 101
12- Silvio Fernandez (VEN) - 101
13- Yannick Borel (FRA) - 99
14- Ruben Limardo (VEN) - 99
15- Jörg Fiedler (GER) - 95
16- Matteo Tagliariol (ITA) - 90
17- Gabor Boczko (HUN) - 90
18- Alfredo Rota (ITA) - 90
19- Ronan Gustin (FRA) - 89
20- Radoslaw Zawrotniak (POL) - 83


I don't take this as the final word since in this list it appears that the positions of Novosjolov and Heinzer are switched, but the points calculated by the French are in some instances different from Craig's list.

Right off the bat they have 3 Italian and French epeeists listed.

[MBalderson]

Right off the bat they have 3 Italian and French epeeists listed.

Considering they're including everyone 1-20 on that list, I'm guessing it's not meant to be a qualification list. It's just a points list.

[Allex]

Men's Team Foil - Germany is in, Korea is out - and barring major upsets in Bonn top 8 are set, correct?

[DrWhiteTX]

I do like Italy. I'm just remarking on the nice pictures of Tallinn.

Tallinn is beautiful, especially the old city. It is basically a fully intact medeival fortified city. Like walking back in time. The people are friendly.

[Craig]

I've updated my spreadsheet for the Individual Men's Saber qualification points and shared it via my Google Docs account. The link is here.

Things to remember when looking at it and assumptions that I made:

1. Assumed that countries would put the best 3 individuals based on FIE ranking results into the event.
2. Assumed that countries will send the highest FIE ranked individual to the Zonal Qualification Event

Here is what I did:
1. Highlighted athletes who qualify being part of a team in Yellow on the "Culled Listing" tab
2. Highlighted athletes who qualify via the zonal selection in Orange
3. Deleted all but the highest ranked athlete from any country for countries without a fencer qualified
4. In the case of a points tie, chose the athlete with the better FIE ranking
5. Left the GBR fencers in just in case GBR enters a team

What is next for the athletes?

Zonal qualification tournaments will be held for each zone (Europe, Asia, Africa, Americas). Top 2 from the European tournament and the winner of the Asia, Africa, and America zones qualify.

[ToucheVerte]

Correct me if I am wrong, but here is what I believe to be the current Men's Foil qualfier list:

#1 Cassara (Italy)
#2 Baldini (Italy)
#3 Le Pechoux (France)
#4 Avola (Italy)
#5 El Sayed (Egypt)
#6 Imboden (USA)
#8 Sintes (France)
#9 Joppich (Germany)
#10 Massialas (USA)
#11 Choi (Korea)
#12 Cheremisonov (Russia)
#13 Lei (China)
#14 Ma (China)
#15 Bachmann (Germany)
#16 Schlosser (Austria)
#17 Ota (Japan)
#18 Chida (Japan)
#19 Kwon (Korea)
#20 Huang (China)
#21 Sedov (Russia)
#23 Hertsyk (Ukraine)
#25 Meinhardt (USA)
#32 Akhmatkhuzin (Russia)
#33 Marcilloux (France)
#36 Smandi (Tunisia)
#39 Gomez (Mexico)
#42 Miyake (Japan)
#46 Lalonde (Canada)
#53 Fouad (Egypt)
#54 Wessels (Germany)
#72 Farrag (Egypt)

+ 2 Europeans, 1 Asian, 1 Americas and 1 African TBD at the Zonal Qualifiers in April.

I realize that there are still a couple of events that could alter this list.

[ToucheVerte]

Here are the men who based on current world ranking by country will fight it out for the final two places at the European Zonal Qualifiers for Individual Foil on April 21st:

#24 Kruse (GBR)
#34 Zawada (Poland)
#49 Hatoel (Israel)
#52 Borst (Holland)
#57 Jovanovic (Croatia)
#63 Daraban (Roumania)
#77 Choupenitch (Czechoslovakia)
#80 Santos (Portugal)
#84 Byk (Belarus)
#103 Nakis (Greece)
#107 Cusack (Ireland)
#129 Grigoryev (Kazakhstan)
#134 Biro (Hungary)
#136 Kiil (Denmark)
#184 Delbergue (Spain)
#232 Hedenskog (Sweden)
#249 Anen (Luxembourg)
#269 Ozgurkan (Turkey)
#271 Kralik (Slovakia)
#297 Takala (Finland)
#301 Donne (Belgium)
#385 Petrusenco (Moldova)
#465 Ischer (Switzerland)

[fdad]

Correct me if I am wrong, but here is what I believe to be the current Men's Foil qualfier list:

Each country that qualifies to send a team can determine their own selection criteria. It is not always based on FIE points only. (e.g. according to current USFA Team Points Chamley-Watson is ahead of Meinhardt).

[pinkelephant]

Kruse has just jumped Hertsyk by winning the Copenhagen satellite event.

[Machupuchare]

So just how difficult is it for a fencer to qualify for the 2012 Olympics?

To a casual observer, the answer is “almost impossible”.

Let's take Men's Foil as an example. Just 6% of all internationally licensed male senior foil fencers in the world will represent their country in London (that’s 36 out of 609 FIE-ranked foilists).

Of those 36 fencers, 24 will come from just eight countries. Those eight countries represent the top four teams in the world (Italy, China, France and Germany) and one each from Asia (Japan), Africa (Egypt), Europe (Russia), and the Americas (United States). With the exception of Egypt, who don't boast the depth of the others, getting selected as one of the top three individual fencers in any of those countries is an exceptional feat.

That leaves just 12 spots for the remaining fencers from no less than 75 countries. Of those, seven will be selected based on individual world rankings – two each from Europe, Asia and the Americas, and one from Africa.

As interested parties in this forum already know, representatives from the remaining 68 countries must fight it out for the final 5 places through Zonal Qualifiers. Two men from Europe and one each from Asia, Africa and the Americas will emerge triumphant from a high-pressure one day knockout event in each zone that will take place a few months before the Olympic Men’s Foil finals on August 31st.

The IOC constraints on fencing participation at the Games seem excessive, especially when in so many sports, the individual countries get to decide whether or not to send a competitor.

[Purple Fencer]

The IOC constraints on fencing participation at the Games seem excessive, especially when in so many sports, the individual countries get to decide whether or not to send a competitor.

PLUS the IOC is too cheap to award medals to both genders in all three weapons, in individual and team...thus forcing the rotating screw job that is the quadrennial "sorry, sucks to be you" of team events.

I know one guy who was on track to possibly make the 08 MF team, but then when that even got dropped, he stopped competing.


And this AFTER dropping some entire SPORTS from the overall roster of events....

[edew]

So just how difficult is it for a fencer to qualify for the 2012 Olympics?

To a casual observer, the answer is “almost impossible”.

Let's take Men's Foil as an example. Just 6% of all internationally licensed male senior foil fencers in the world will represent their country in London (that’s 36 out of 609 FIE-ranked foilists).

Of those 36 fencers, 24 will come from just eight countries. Those eight countries represent the top four teams in the world (Italy, China, France and Germany) and one each from Asia (Japan), Africa (Egypt), Europe (Russia), and the Americas (United States). With the exception of Egypt, who don't boast the depth of the others, getting selected as one of the top three individual fencers in any of those countries is an exceptional feat.

That leaves just 12 spots for the remaining fencers from no less than 75 countries. Of those, seven will be selected based on individual world rankings – two each from Europe, Asia and the Americas, and one from Africa.

As interested parties in this forum already know, representatives from the remaining 68 countries must fight it out for the final 5 places through Zonal Qualifiers. Two men from Europe and one each from Asia, Africa and the Americas will emerge triumphant from a high-pressure one day knockout event in each zone that will take place a few months before the Olympic Men’s Foil finals on August 31st.

The IOC constraints on fencing participation at the Games seem excessive, especially when in so many sports, the individual countries get to decide whether or not to send a competitor.

I think all other sports are moving the way of fencing. For example, USA is out for soccer, as El Salvador tied the US in a critical match a few days ago and that knocked the US out of qualifying.

In the marathon, there's a maximal time required for people to qualify. Yes, people still qualify from their respective countries (as opposed to picking the top-24 or top-30 runners with max of 2 per country), but they all need to meet the maximal time. If no runner from a country meets that qualifying time, then that country will not qualifying anyone to the Games.

The IOC needs to contain the number of athletes as it's getting bigger and bigger. I think the number is 10,000, so each sport is tasked to create some equitable method to limit the number of athletes.