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Thread: Bib is target or not???

  1. #1
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    Bib is target or not???

    Does anyone know whether the bib will be target (foil) for the upcoming season or not? When is the USFA planning to communicate this? What should parents be told who are planning to go take the kids to Dallas for the SYC (Sept 3rd) and don't have the equipment?

  2. #2
    Posting Hound oiuyt's Avatar
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    The conductive bib target will be used for NACs, JOs, and National Championships for Cadet, Junior, Division I, Vet 50, Vet 60, Vet 70, and Wheelchair events as of 8/1/11. In other words, for national events that award points towards National Team selection.

    Target has not been changed for any other events, including all events below the national level or for other age or skill categories. It is not required for SYCs, RYCs, ROCs, local qualifiers, local tournaments, Division II/III NACs/Nationals, Youth NACs/Nationals, Vet Combined NAC events, Vet 40 National Championships, or any team events.

    The NCAA has also announced that the conductive foil bib target will not be in effect for the 2011-12 season at any level. The rule for future seasons will be going through a review process led by the playing rules group.

    -B
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    Posting Hound Purple Fencer's Avatar
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    Any idea of how much lead time will be given if the bibs ARE eventually required at all levels?? A year at least would be nice.
    Need fencing equipment? See me at H.O.M. Fencing Supply

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    Posting Hound oiuyt's Avatar
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    Lead time for the requirement for next season was 9.5 months.* It was decided last October.

    Past performance is no guarantee of future results.

    -B

    * Although effectively 12 months, as there are no affected events in August or September 2011.
    "Oh but you can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you!"

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    Why Vet 50-70, and not Vet 40?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fwenzel View Post
    Why Vet 50-70, and not Vet 40?
    There is no VET40 team. VET40 is not a catagory at FIE level.
    TooLoftheDeviL likes this.

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    Senior Member darius's Avatar
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    So does everybody who does, say, a Cdt/D2/D3 need two bibs, or to tape their bib in-between events? Certainly its to their advantage to remove that target, but will referees during the 2011-2012 season allow fencers who wish to compete with the electric bib to do so?

    darius

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    Senior Member Mergs's Avatar
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    From an equipment check perspective, I would say tape the bib for the in between events, or fence at risk of it being valid target if you use it. This is what I have told folks in the past.
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    Posting Hound Purple Fencer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by darius View Post
    So does everybody who does, say, a Cdt/D2/D3 need two bibs, or to tape their bib in-between events? Certainly its to their advantage to remove that target, but will referees during the 2011-2012 season allow fencers who wish to compete with the electric bib to do so?

    darius
    Or they could get an X-change mask and swap out the bib.
    Need fencing equipment? See me at H.O.M. Fencing Supply

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  10. #10
    Senior Member Guided by Wire's Avatar
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    Bought an X-change during the May sale for the upcoming season just for this reason.
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    Funny, Absolute Fencing Gear has this announcement on the top of their website:

    The USFA has Officially adopted the new rules regarding the lame target area on all foil masks. Any and all competitions affiliated with the USFA will require the new foil bibs on the mask. These rules will come into effect on August 1st 2011.

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    That Guy Craig's Avatar
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    Here's what we've distilled from the board minutes and Brad's clarifying answers:

    http://www.fencing.net/4452/foil-mas...encing-season/

    Craig

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    So the Board of Directors has decided that it is ok for US Fencing to use a different target area than the rest of the world in the youth events? Many youth competitors are training for future competition at the Cadet international level, it would be appropriate if they could compete in the US using the same target area as their international competitors will be using.
    BrodeurNJD30 likes this.

  14. #14
    Posting Hound Purple Fencer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach View Post
    So the Board of Directors has decided that it is ok for US Fencing to use a different target area than the rest of the world in the youth events? Many youth competitors are training for future competition at the Cadet international level, it would be appropriate if they could compete in the US using the same target area as their international competitors will be using.
    What about the financial burden on individuals who don't have any plans to compete for points?? What about the new fencer who just geared up and then finds he has to now 1) get a conversion kit that may or may not be affixed properly, 2) get the mask rebibbed (if he can find someone to DO it), or 3) buy a NEW mask??

    What about scholastic or collegiate programs (never mind the NCAA's decision here..work with me) who have a ton of masks and would find themselves having to do one of the 3 above options? They aren't generally swimming in cash, y'know.

    That's one reason the SoCal Scholastic League decided to NOT sanction our tournaments to allow for ratings to be awarded...a potential financial burden on our programs that can ill afford it.
    Need fencing equipment? See me at H.O.M. Fencing Supply

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    I understand that fencers and fencing programs will incur additional expenses. Many (not all) high school and college fencers also compete at the national level. By not enforcing the rule at all levels, those athletes will need do one of the following, purchase two masks, purchase the very good, but expensive Leon Paul mask, or try to tape the edges of the mask when competing in National events. The latter is not always effective. Either way, someone is going to have to pay, unfortunately fencing is not an inexpensive sport. I just noticed that Absolute Fencing has a retrofit electric bib available for their masks at $12.00. I am sure other vendors will follow suit. I would consider $12.00 to be an added expense, but far from a "financial burden". Even a college or high school program purchasing 20 retrofit kits for their competitive program would only incur an expense of $240.00.

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    I think a phased approach makes sense, but only if everyone knows when the next phase will happen. It is almost a certainty that as soon as you purchase an expensive new mask without bib target the USFA will announce that bib target is mandatory for local events.

  17. #17
    Senior Member Greybeard's Avatar
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    I bought an x-change. However, new lames have a tab in back like Sabre to plug your mask into. So unless you know someone who can sew a lame tab (like I did) you either have to find someone, find a new place to clip your mask, or buy a new lame.

    Wait till we all buy a new mask, then they will bring back the visor.
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  18. #18
    Senior Member SJCFU#2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach View Post
    So the Board of Directors has decided that it is ok for US Fencing to use a different target area than the rest of the world in the youth events? Many youth competitors are training for future competition at the Cadet international level, it would be appropriate if they could compete in the US using the same target area as their international competitors will be using.
    It's probably better than using a different target area than the rest of the world in Junior and Senior events (which actually are FIE events), which has been the case for the previous two years.

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    I agree with fdad that a phased approach makes sense, but the rule has been in full effect in the international community for one full season. I just think the "phasing" should have been started one year ago!

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    Quote Originally Posted by SJCFU#2 View Post
    It's probably better than using a different target area than the rest of the world in Junior and Senior events (which actually are FIE events), which has been the case for the previous two years.
    Agreed.

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