One year later,,, and still no foil coach at OSU.

[indypacers]

What gives here, when a suitable replacement doesn't appear the horizon?

It's been more than a year since one of the better foil coaches up rooted and still no replacement. Seems odd when one of the better programs has this kind of problem.

Even a prized alum seems to get no love from a he program that he participated and won in. Is this more telling, because a suitable candidate still hasn't surfaced?

[fdad]

What gives here, when a suitable replacement doesn't appear the horizon?

It's been more than a year since one of the better foil coaches up rooted and still no replacement. Seems odd when one of the better programs has this kind of problem.

Even a prized alum seems to get no love from a he program that he participated and won in. Is this more telling, because a suitable candidate still hasn't surfaced?

Do most schools have a separate coach for each weapon?

[erooMynohtnA]

Most highly successful NCAA teams have several assistant coaches, typically weapon specialists. However, that doesn't mean that each squad or weapon gets its own coach.

Although, it appears OSU has Andras Horanyi volunteering as a coach (I'm guessing foil), so I don't know what all the butt-hurt is about. Maybe he's the prized alumnus that gets no love, maybe Boaz Ellis is, maybe it's R. L. Stine. I don't know. Specifics, please.

[noodle]

whats that? there's a shortage of good fencing coaches? you don't say...

[telkanuru]

OSU will get a foil coach when you stop abusing the comma.

[Superscribe]

What gives here, when a suitable replacement doesn't appear the horizon?

It's been more than a year since one of the better foil coaches up rooted and still no replacement. Seems odd when one of the better programs has this kind of problem.

Even a prized alum seems to get no love from a he program that he participated and won in. Is this more telling, because a suitable candidate still hasn't surfaced?

That is ridiculous. You have been a very successful coach of other sports. You should apply for this position. Turn the whole collegiete fencing scene upside down.

[LordShout]

Why keep a cow when milk is so cheap? If they can get decently high level coaching for free out of Andras and/or Boaz why pay?

[MBalderson]

OSU will get a foil coach when you stop abusing the comma.

Rep owed

[flick n' roll]

Most highly successful NCAA teams have several assistant coaches, typically weapon specialists. However, that doesn't mean that each squad or weapon gets its own coach.

Although, it appears OSU has Andras Horanyi volunteering as a coach (I'm guessing foil), so I don't know what all the butt-hurt is about. Maybe he's the prized alumnus that gets no love, maybe Boaz Ellis is, maybe it's R. L. Stine. I don't know. Specifics, please.

I don't know about Boaz, but from what I heard/saw at Nationals Andras is training in NYC now with Empire United. Still, why the curiosity?? Or can you provide more specifics in your interest???

[indypacers]

I love the responses---take a serious question and fencers respond with a personal attack, how fitting. Anyway, it doesn't address the question, "why if you have a coach in your budget have you not been able to attract a coach to a supposedly top flight program?"

Why would you resend an offer to a prized alum? Why have offers been extended only to be turned down? Aren't there any ;suitable candidates here stateside that aren't H1B or visa problems? It's just an legit question.

above the fray for now REVENUE PRODUCING SPORT.

[erooMynohtnA]

I love the responses---take a serious question and fencers respond with a personal attack, how fitting. Anyway, it doesn't address the question, "why if you have a coach in your budget have you not been able to attract a coach to a supposedly top flight program?"

How do you know they have it in their budget? Please note, I am not attacking you, I am asking for specifics of the situation.

Seems to me, that if you know what their budget is, you should know why they haven't hired another coach.

Why would you resend an offer to a prized alum? Why have offers been extended only to be turned down? Aren't there any ;suitable candidates here stateside that aren't H1B or visa problems? It's just an legit question.

The word you're looking for is rescind, and again, what offers are you talking about?

Not everyone has been watching you on secret camera, so you can't assume we're privy to the same information you are and just do this stream of consciousness stuff. If you can't change, just stick to youtube comments.

[telkanuru]

Pretty much that.

(must spread rep)

[noodle]

I love the responses---take a serious question and fencers respond with a personal attack, how fitting. Anyway, it doesn't address the question, "why if you have a coach in your budget have you not been able to attract a coach to a supposedly top flight program?"

Why would you resend an offer to a prized alum? Why have offers been extended only to be turned down? Aren't there any ;suitable candidates here stateside that aren't H1B or visa problems? It's just an legit question.

above the fray for now REVENUE PRODUCING SPORT.

here's a legit answer: there's an extreme shortage of qualified coaches, and someone who can produce results will almost definitely be able to make more money in lessons at their own club instead of being a salaried university employee. if the university won't import someone from overseas, they're highly unlikely to pull someone in domestically who is qualified to run a "top flight" program. the growth of the sport is outpacing the growth of its infrastructure. this will likely only become a bigger problem with time.

[indypacers]

Noodle,

Your point is well taken, but are you saying there haven't been many Americans pipelined into coaching and have the skill/ability to coach at the NCAA elite level, or that they would rather stay at the club level and continue to coach? That model works in NYC were you have a number of fencers, but elsewhere in the US I don't see that.

It seems that the development has been placed on identifying talent and keeping them interested in fencing, while leaving the coaching /develpoment of that talent to someone else whether at the club or collegiate level. Where does that talent go when they no longer fence competitively?

[eac]

The NCAA is dumb.

In particular, as a coach, the NCAA task is defined as follows:

a) Recruit people. Which is to say, find elite fencers who are already good under other coaches, butter them up, and beg the administration to pay their tuition.

b) In under four years, take said already-elite, jaded, alien-system fencers and somehow induce them to win more than they would otherwise.

i. If you have an idea for how to teach fencing, it's not going to be what they've been successful with, and trying to get them to change will probably just make them worse. And, even if it eventually started to help, they'll graduate before you get any kind of return-on-investment.

ii. If you give up any pretense about having any idea about how people should fence, you a) give up half the point of being a fencing coach, and b) are more or less reduced to a physical trainer and motivator; you get them in shape, get them pumped up, and say 'go!'

c) Receive almost no credit for any competitive results they may achieve (which will almost universally come in the form of 5-touch bouts against random wigglers from a neighboring collection of transplanted fencers).

d) Lose the people in whom you've invested blood/sweat/tears after a maximum of four years, watch them quit fencing, and start over again with a new set of assh0les.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Contrast this with the USFA/FIE task:

a) Take raw 6-to-10-year-olds with rich parents with no previous training or bad habits, and see the brilliant fire of fencing and competition come alive in their eyes.

b) Train these kids in your system from the start, and develop a shared vocabulary, a set of shared experiences, and a personal connection.

c) Watch them grow into powerful, athletic, intelligent, successful young adults, and have a significant positive influence on their development in this regard.

d) Watch and influence their technical development over the aforementioned 8-12 years, and see massive ROI on your blood-sweat-tear operation. Watch them compete with the best in the country and maybe someday the world.

e) Be reasonably compensated for this effort, and also have a shot at traveling around the world if you meet sufficient levels of success.

f) Have a hand in their launching into adult life by helping their admission prospects into a university.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't know about you, but it doesn't sound like a particularly difficult choice to me.

[SEM Fencer]

Rep owed

here, here!

[edew]

Eac, that's ultra jaded!

[fdad]

Noodle,

Your point is well taken, but are you saying there haven't been many Americans pipelined into coaching and have the skill/ability to coach at the NCAA elite level, or that they would rather stay at the club level and continue to coach? That model works in NYC were you have a number of fencers, but elsewhere in the US I don't see that.

It seems that the development has been placed on identifying talent and keeping them interested in fencing, while leaving the coaching /develpoment of that talent to someone else whether at the club or collegiate level. Where does that talent go when they no longer fence competitively?

I get the feeling that, you are really saying... My kid living in Columbus needs a foil coach and I'd like Ohio State to subsidize one for her.

[jfarmer]

1. Ohio State has no open positions posted for their fencing program. Eg., they aren't looking for a foil coach.

2. Most of their Assistant Coach positions are either Voluntary or Graduate Assistantships.

3. What if any salary have they offered?

4. AFAIK the only NCAA coaching position that's posted is for Head Coach at Stevens (and they want you to teach some PE courses as well...)

[jfarmer]

Noodle,

Your point is well taken, but are you saying there haven't been many Americans pipelined into coaching and have the skill/ability to coach at the NCAA elite level, or that they would rather stay at the club level and continue to coach? That model works in NYC were you have a number of fencers, but elsewhere in the US I don't see that.

It seems that the development has been placed on identifying talent and keeping them interested in fencing, while leaving the coaching /develpoment of that talent to someone else whether at the club or collegiate level. Where does that talent go when they no longer fence competitively?

You're missing several points. In the US, in general, the "club level" is more highly thought of than most NCAA programs.

As to "pipelining" people into coaching fencing, who's supposed to be doing that? How do you propose that to happen?

I'm not sure what to make of your statement, "the development has been placed on identifying talent and keeping them interested in fencing, while leaving the coaching /develpoment of that talent to someone else whether at the club or collegiate level."