World Cup 2010-2011

[jjefferies]

I've been told that there will be some changes in the World Cup series for this coming season. From the FIE website "The major changes are the reduction in the number of tournaments and the organisation of individual World Cups jointly with team World Cups.". I've heard the number 7 brandied about as the reduced number of tournaments.

Any comments on how this will affect the fencers trying to participate in the World cup? Is it going to make it harder for newer fencers to enter? Will there still be Grand Prix events and then others?

[Inquartata]

brandied about

"Oooh, what a giveaway!"

[fdad]

I've been told that there will be some changes in the World Cup series for this coming season. From the FIE website "The major changes are the reduction in the number of tournaments and the organisation of individual World Cups jointly with team World Cups.". I've heard the number 7 brandied about as the reduced number of tournaments.

Any comments on how this will affect the fencers trying to participate in the World cup? Is it going to make it harder for newer fencers to enter? Will there still be Grand Prix events and then others?

Mull these over (with brandy if you like):
http://www.fie.ch/download/letters/2...02010-2011.pdf
http://www.fie.ch/download/letters/2...02010-2011.pdf
http://www.fie.ch/download/letters/2...02010-2011.pdf

[Mr Epee]

Limiting the number of World Cup events per weapon to the 5-8 range would be a very good thing for nearly everyone.

[fdad]

Limiting the number of World Cup events per weapon to the 5-8 range would be a very good thing for nearly everyone.

Yes, and hopefully the USFA will allow the max number of fencers for each WC.
Currently, for non-designated WCs, they sometimes limit the number of fencers to avoid having to pay for a referee.
I understand the desire to manage costs, but this limits the development of top fencers and referees.

[oiuyt]

US Fencing requires that one be above a threshold standard (set by the National Coach in that weapon). The threshold for senior world cups ranges from being top 24 on the senior points (or top 12 on the junior) to merely being on the senior points list.

Below that standard one can go as long as one isn't the marginal fencer that adds 500 euro cost to US Fencing (M/W sabre also require explicit written permission from the respective National Coach). There are very few world cups where the US delegation is exactly 4 or 9 qualified athletes, which is the necessary condition for it to not be possible for non-qualified athletes to participate. The way the rules are written makes it sound difficult to enter a world cup, but there's a fair amount of space created by the exceptions, especially for non-designated cups where the US delegation isn't large.

When large numbers of non-qualified athletes want to enter is when there starts to be a limitation issue.

-B

[teacup]

Limiting the number of World Cup events per weapon to the 5-8 range would be a very good thing for nearly everyone.

One of the Jr WCs will be after JOs, and two are in conflict with national events, thus reducing the choice, of which Jr WCs, to designate for team selection.

This potentially condenses the junior season into 7 or 8 weeks, Jan - Feb which will be great for high school students in grades 9, 10, 12, and those taking a gap year, but difficult for high school juniors and college students.

[pillow]

One of the Jr WCs will be after JOs, and two are in conflict with national events, thus reducing the number of Jr WCs which will count towards team selection.

This potentially condenses the junior season into 7 or 8 weeks, Jan - Feb which will be great for high school students in grades 9, 10, 12, and those taking a gap year, but difficult for high school juniors and college students.

Are you talking about a specific weapon? As the list of designated JWCs for each weapon does not yet exist, I am unclear about definite conflicts at this time.

[oiuyt]

Teacup is looking at which world cups are available for designation and is assuming that those in conflict with NACs will not be designated.

Designated international events running opposite national domestic events is a different problem, but is also a problem if it occurs.

-B

[teacup]

Are you talking about a specific weapon? As the list of designated JWCs for each weapon does not yet exist, I am unclear about definite conflicts at this time.

Look at the FIE junior schedule posted above. Two junior WCs conflict with the Nov. NAC and JOs and one is scheduled in March after JOs. These three will probably not be designated. For most squads, that leaves five to choose four to designate, three of which are between January 8 and Feb. 6. Add in two domestic events, Jan and JOs, and that is a lot of travel in two months for junior fencers, especially high school juniors and college fencers, who may also have finals and SAT tests during January.

If the WCs, which conflict with our domestic events are designated, it could potentially weaken our domestic events thus reducing strong fencing opportunities for those cadet and junior fencers not traveling to Europe.

If the WCs after JOs are designated, then the teams would not be determined until March and therefore not be announced at JOs.

[pillow]

Look at the FIE junior schedule posted above. Two junior WCs conflict with the Nov. NAC and JOs and one is scheduled in March after JOs. These three will probably not be designated. For most squads, that leaves five to choose four to designate, three of which are between January 8 and Feb. 6. Add in two domestic events, Jan and JOs, and that is a lot of travel in two months for junior fencers, especially high school juniors and college fencers, who may also have finals and SAT tests during January.

If the WCs, which conflict with our domestic events are designated, it could potentially weaken our domestic events thus reducing strong fencing opportunities for many cadet and junior fencers.

If the WCs after JOs are designated, then the teams would not be announced at JOs and therefore be determined in March.

You'll have to remind me--was it the 08-09 season that a WF or WE event had a conflict? I seem to recall either a designated JWC or Cadet Designated event conflicting with a NAC. It is unclear how a national coach would allow that to happen.

[fdad]

You'll have to remind me--was it the 08-09 season that a WF or WE event had a conflict? I seem to recall either a designated JWC or Cadet Designated event conflicting with a NAC. It is unclear how a national coach would allow that to happen.

I *think* last year (Dec '08) for JWF, Lignano was designated and conflicted with Div 1 NAC C. I am pretty sure it happens every year for at least one weapon. For example, this year (Oct '09) JWS in Sosnwiec conflicted with Cadet NAC A. I am pretty sure there are others. So far the Nat'l coaches haven't shown a lot of concern for avoiding conflicts between designated events and NACs. It will be interesting to see whether with fewer WCs and fewer NACs that start to care.

[esgrima]

Yes, and hopefully the USFA will allow the max number of fencers for each WC.
Currently, for non-designated WCs, they sometimes limit the number of fencers to avoid having to pay for a referee.
I understand the desire to manage costs, but this limits the development of top fencers and referees.

word!!!!