Coaching and Competing

[DangerMouse]

DM: So you're saying that for now I'm fine, and in a year or so I should take the time to double check that and make sure I'm coaching for the right reasons.

I guess what I'm really trying to say is that if you decide to focus your time on helping your students better themselves and not worrying about competing against them then you will either:

a) become a better and happier coach and earn your students respect through teaching (and probably a better fencer at the same time)
b) create a fencer who is a better coach and wants to take over from you so you can focus on your competition (and become a better fencer)
c) get beat by a student, relize you can't let go of the emotions, completely lose your sh!t and your students' respect along with it

In conclusion, it's best if you remember that your role is to help them better themselves and let the rest take care of itself.

[MdA]

…….This is something that the USFCA could provide an immense help with. Call it "OMG! I'm new to this school/town/place and there's no coach and/or club! Help me USFCA! You're my only hope!"

I agree with Allen, this is a large undertaking. You’re really hoping for an Obi wan Kenobi to drop whatever he is doing and take this on for free. Try to imagine some of our top college coaches working on this….. in their spare time. Unless he or she is retired and living on a desert planet.

…….
Personally, I have enough confidence in my ability as a coach that I wasn't too worried about it. I know that I'm a much better coach than I am fencer. Most of my students trusted what I had to say, regardless of sometimes beating me in a bout..

I think this is a key point. Are you more confident in your ability as a coach or as a fencer? It’s probably hard for you to tell at this point since you are young…that may be what is causing your dilemma.

…….
But I think that the situation we have now is worse since those folks are going to coach anyway, and they're just making it up as they go along. They're unlikely to come up with something all by themselves that would be as good as a decent "OMG! I'm the coach. Now what?" kind of manual.

This is another good point….I agree something is needed.

There are so many things happening in this thread that it's difficult to know where to start……
What's at stake here isn't a competition/teaching dynamic, but a question of leadership. ……
Why doesn't the USFCA design a course for people who suddenly find themselves running a college club? This would be a pretty big undertaking, the work of quite a few hours, …..
We're back to the leadership issue again. There is actually a lot of information -- much more than there use to be -- about teaching basic fencing actions for coaches who have little coaching experiance. But it takes some work to ferret it out, some time to absorb, some guts to apply the information, and leadership skills from the coach to convince his or her students to have patience while the coach fumbles through the material and adapts it for the club.
A

I agree with Allen there is more information available now than when I started 28 years ago.

As Allen is saying, most of what goes on in a college club isn't going to succeed or fail based on fencing skill, or your ability to give private lessons. Its your ability as a leader more than anything. Stay in touch with what the fencers want and are looking for, and it will make it easier to lead them there.
…….For some fencers or groups, they'll want you to push them to their limit. Some might want to be there to get dates, honestly.

College fencing clubs are complex….again leadership is the key and is often difficult for young fencers thrust into the coaching role. This is why it continues to amaze me that many colleges just let the students “go at it” without attempting to get a qualified fencing coach. This is a challenge for the USFCA and the USFA.
My first coaching job was at Laramie County Community College in Cheyenne, Wyoming. At least the current coach (a local dentist and member of the college board) was able to convince the Athletic Director to hire someone with a little experience. They sought me out and asked me to coach…I was a recently retired college fencer with no coaching experience but …the current coach (who still wanted to fence) realized he was not the guy for the job. I learned a lot giving him lessons…we both learned.

…..
Just to reiterate, and make sure it's perfectly clear, I understand why you started coaching. It's why you CONTINUE coaching that you will need to figure out on your own. Allen has highlighted the role of leadership better than I can, but understanding your own reasons for continuing to coach will significantly improve your ability to lead.

It tough trying to lead a club while you still want to fence. Fortunately, during my first coaching job, I didn’t want to compete anymore. I also didn’t have any problems beating my students at practice…they were at a pretty low level accept for the dentist.

…..In conclusion, it's best if you remember that your role is to help them better themselves and let the rest take care of itself.

It took me about seven years to figure this out. I was an amateur part-time coach and then took a full time coaching job at my alma mater. I went to my first Coaches College thinking I needed to learn to coach epee.
Ed Richards drafted me into the advanced foil class the first years….told me I could do epee next year.
I agree with JFarmer that clinics might not be the most effective approach for college student/coaches but they wouldn’t hurt.
As Allen said, there is a lot of material out there….most of it directed towards professional or sem-professional coaches….like the recent USFCA newsletter I just posted in this forum.
Perhaps the best approach is for someone to write an article for the Newsletter for the next issue. This thread would provide a great basis for the article. This might generate enough interest for a young Master candidate to pick the topic for his thesis….this would be just touching the tip of the iceberg…but it might be a good start. As tbryan said, something on this topic is needed for young coaches.
…..by the way Alexander….I suggest you read the entire contents of the latest newsletter in addition to this thread. There is a lot of great material in there….including the historical article by Andy Shaw about Giorgio Santelli….and his journey from amateur to professional.

[Alexander Kai]

Thank you MdA. I will try to read the newsletter after I am done with finals for the semester.

Also, I don't suppose you are free as a coach now? =P I'm just kidding, I had to ask.

Thank you everyone for your advice, I appreciate it.

[stillchris]

while I aggree with the leadership topics and advice there are documents available from the Canadians on how and what to coach. http://www.fencing.ca/coaching_manuals/manuals.htm

While these will not make you an expert coach they may help you on your journey and give you some structure and ideas.