Trouble Advancing from a Bounce (Epee)

[peterlista]

...there is no requirement that feet in on guard be at 90 degrees. Some coaches still inisist on this, but generally the angle many coaches teach (in any weapon) is much less.

Understandably, however, I can't go any less than 145 degrees unless I am on my toes. For example, when fencing epee and bouncing, my back foot is angled in and my knee angles in with it (which, is where I get a slighter straightening of my leg) this is quite comfortable when on my toes, but could never do this with my feet "flat" on the ground in a "traditional" stance.

[Allen Evans]

Very interesting. Thanks.

[JacoKierkegaard]

Have you looked into getting shoes specially designed for those with severe pronation? My issue isn't quite as bad as yours I think, but I do have a pronounced tendency to over-pronate, and so when it came time to shop for a fencing shoe I asked the advice of a guy who specializes in athletic footwear, and I actually wound up buying a running shoe that's specially designed for people with pronated feet.

It's not a fencing-specific shoe, but it's beautifully comfortable to fence in, or do anything else in for that matter. Actually they're the most comfortable pair of shoes I own, but I just restrict them to use for fencing because I don't want them to wear out, and they're a little on the ugly side.

[MyrddinsPrecint]

I would be very careful about being on my toes too much. Not only do you lose stability, but you also put all of you weight on the ball of your foot.

At the very least, make very very certain you are stretching out all parts of your foot/lower leg. If you have trouble with your feet, are fencing with hard plastic against your foot, and then putting your foot in a very strange and unusual position... It sounds to me by trying to avoid one problem, you may be putting yourself at risk for a whole pile of other problems.

[Dev]

So this might apply:

http://www.fencing.net/forums/blogs/...footwork-5553/

This is a good post.

Also, if you're trying to achieve said dynamic instability and still maintain a semblance of controllability, work on your core muscles. To follow the analogy, the core muscles are a big part of the "computer system" that makes the constant corrections for the instability.

[peterlista]

Have you looked into getting shoes specially designed for those with severe pronation? My issue isn't quite as bad as yours I think, but I do have a pronounced tendency to over-pronate, and so when it came time to shop for a fencing shoe I asked the advice of a guy who specializes in athletic footwear, and I actually wound up buying a running shoe that's specially designed for people with pronated feet.

It's not a fencing-specific shoe, but it's beautifully comfortable to fence in, or do anything else in for that matter. Actually they're the most comfortable pair of shoes I own, but I just restrict them to use for fencing because I don't want them to wear out, and they're a little on the ugly side.

I personally don't have shoes specific to pronated feet, I have the ASICS Gel-Rockets, and they are awesome! I took out the removable lining and inserted my own insoles, it works very well.

[peterlista]

I would be very careful about being on my toes too much. Not only do you lose stability, but you also put all of you weight on the ball of your foot.

At the very least, make very very certain you are stretching out all parts of your foot/lower leg. If you have trouble with your feet, are fencing with hard plastic against your foot, and then putting your foot in a very strange and unusual position... It sounds to me by trying to avoid one problem, you may be putting yourself at risk for a whole pile of other problems.

I personally don't worry too much about losing any stability because I am always in a state of constant motion. And as for putting my weight on the ball of my foot, I'm not sure why this matters?

Anyways, I stretch my feet and Achilles tendon before fencing and between all bouts and DEs. I've been dealing with my feet problems for 19 years now, at this point, I know what I can and cannot handle.

[MyrddinsPrecint]

I personally don't worry too much about losing any stability because I am always in a state of constant motion. And as for putting my weight on the ball of my foot, I'm not sure why this matters?

Anyways, I stretch my feet and Achilles tendon before fencing and between all bouts and DEs. I've been dealing with my feet problems for 19 years now, at this point, I know what I can and cannot handle.

When you put ALL your weight on one part of your foot, when your feet were (supposed to be) designed such that the foot was a shock absorber where the entire foot takes the shock of your weight, you put much more stress on one part of your foot. Now, maybe your feet are messed up in a way in which your balls can handle that... But you could do anything from just mildly bruise your feet to get stress fractures. Now, I have no idea how likely any of that is, partially because it depends on your weight and what kind of shape you're in. But if I were tangentially involved in coaching you, I would have you talk about the likelihood with a medical professional.

You should make sure that you stretch your calves and your planter fascia as well. Toe fencing is one-- of many-- ways that fencers can exacerbate planter fasciitis. Or maybe it's just that fencing is how fencers exacerbate PF. In any case, you want to avoid it, and if you're not specifically stretching to avoid it yet, you should start. It can't hurt, and will probably help.

[peterlista]

You should make sure that you stretch your calves and your planter fascia as well. Toe fencing is one-- of many-- ways that fencers can exacerbate planter fasciitis. Or maybe it's just that fencing is how fencers exacerbate PF. In any case, you want to avoid it, and if you're not specifically stretching to avoid it yet, you should start. It can't hurt, and will probably help.

Yeah, definitely a good idea to stretch pretty much everything! I try to get a good amount of stretching in before practices and even more when I am at a tournament.

[DangerMouse]

messed up in a way in which your balls can handle that... I would have you talk about the likelihood with a medical professional.

I think this thread has taken a turn for the worse

[MyrddinsPrecint]

I'd also like to note that at 19, as a guy... you may still be growing. Even if you weren't, your body will over the course of your life change. Changes in muscle mass, changes in weight, changes in posture, changes in how often you stretch, how you use your body, even little things like how quickly you ramp up physical activity will have a big affect on your feet. You're new to fencing. You may have had your feet for 19 years, but you haven't been walking for 19 years, nevermind fencing that long.

I don't say this as a buzzkill, or a "listen to your elders/betters" lecture. You're new round these parts- I say this because I've been there, and I've been in pain. My feet would, if given their say in the matter, stay on their toes the entire time I fence. If I let them, I pay for it. I do a lot better for staying disciplined, and doing a small amount of more correct footwork at a time. My feet are obviously different than yours, in that way in which any two Titan Arrum flowers aren't exactly the same... so you might have better luck than I have..... I just also hope that you can learn from what I've learned from, so that you don't have to go through all of the same painful bits I've had to go through.

... Namely, if you stop fencing for a while..... keep stretching. Damn. That was easily the worst.

[peterlista]

I don't say this as a buzzkill, or a "listen to your elders/betters" lecture. You're new round these parts- I say this because I've been there, and I've been in pain. My feet would, if given their say in the matter, stay on their toes the entire time I fence. If I let them, I pay for it. I do a lot better for staying disciplined, and doing a small amount of more correct footwork at a time.

Haha, not a "buzzkill." And you are right, I have to be careful about not overdoing it... but I still like to think I can!