Head Parry vs Bell

[Alexander Kai]

Hi all. Simple question, think I know the answer.

Fencer A attacks with a downward cut towards the head.
Fencer B parries 5 (arm above head)

Fencer A muscles through B's Parry and his bell guard eventually rests on Fencer B's shoulder.

Note that Fencer A did not STRIKE Fencer B's shoulder with any amount of force. Fencer A simply used enough force to muscle through the parry and get the touch, upon getting the touch Fencer A reduced the amount of force in his attack so as not to unnecessarily hurt fencer B.

I believe that the call here is still a black card for punching and removal from the tournament, or would it be a red-card?

and no, neither of them are wearing nike ballestras.

[yearsofwisdom]

sounds sorta dirty...

[keropie]

Well, if the touch was scored with the guard, that's a red card, iirc. If the guard touch is afterwards, I suppose maybe not. However, from the description it seems unlikely that it would be a black card. Unless one was given for collusion, since I'm wondering what B is doing after the parry while A causes the guard to 'eventually' rest upon the shoulder... (I kid)

[trafl926]

There's a lot of things wrong with the title of this thread.

[Omar Bhutta]

Hi all. Simple question, think I know the answer.

Fencer A attacks with a downward cut towards the head.
Fencer B parries 5 (arm above head)

Fencer A muscles through B's Parry and his bell guard eventually rests on Fencer B's shoulder.

Note that Fencer A did not STRIKE Fencer B's shoulder with any amount of force. Fencer A simply used enough force to muscle through the parry and get the touch, upon getting the touch Fencer A reduced the amount of force in his attack so as not to unnecessarily hurt fencer B.

I believe that the call here is still a black card for punching and removal from the tournament, or would it be a red-card?

and no, neither of them are wearing nike ballestras.

t.70.3. This is a group 1 offense. Touch scored with the guard. If the referee feels it is a dangerous, brutal, vindictive touch the penalty may range from group 1 to group 4. By your description it is none of these.

[Inquartata]

Yes. SO unfortunate.

[Alexander Kai]

Well, if the touch was scored with the guard, that's a red card, iirc. If the guard touch is afterwards, I suppose maybe not. However, from the description it seems unlikely that it would be a black card. Unless one was given for collusion, since I'm wondering what B is doing after the parry while A causes the guard to 'eventually' rest upon the shoulder... (I kid)

Lol, no collusion since it was a practice match. Fencer B did Riposte once his blade was free but he was locked out (or would have been in electric, there was definitely a full second between the parry and the riposte.

I wasn't deliberately trying to be gentle (I'll be honest my wording and writing on this is horrible, as a few of you have pointed out), but I'm the type of fencer where the instant I know that I got the touch (either through machine or feel) I will make it a point to soften the blow.

[erooMynohtnA]

The trick is prevention. Before anyone fisted anyone else, you should have carded them for disrobing on strip.

Edit: Now my hilarious joke doesn't make any sense.

[Rick Shellhouse]

The trick is prevention. Before anyone fisted anyone else, you should have carded them for disrobing on strip.

Thank you..... now I have a new definition for dirty fencing....





R

[damianip]

sounds sorta dirty...

I'll say. Thought I had mistyped the URL.

Could be the most perversely ominous thread title ever.

Paolo

[Rick Shellhouse]

I'll say. Thought I had mistyped the URL.

Could be the most perversely ominous thread title ever.

Paolo

Welll and yeah I know Im gonna rot in h%^

It could have been titled the Dirty Santelli....



R

[RITFencing]

I believe that the call here is still a black card for punching and removal from the tournament, or would it be a red-card?

"Punching" is not mentioned anywhere in the rulebook, to my knowledge. "Deliberate Brutality," however, is. This is certainly not a case of that, though, just ugly fencing and "touch scored with the guard."

Out of curiousity, why did the other fencer not riposte?

[Alexander Kai]

"Punching" is not mentioned anywhere in the rulebook, to my knowledge. "Deliberate Brutality," however, is. This is certainly not a case of that, though, just ugly fencing and "touch scored with the guard."

Out of curiousity, why did the other fencer not riposte?

Because his blade was trapped by the attack.

[RITFencing]

Because his blade was trapped by the attack.

Ah. Sounds like the parry should have been accompanied by pulling the distance, which would facilitate a riposte and (at least partially) remove the threat of a remise.