Pray for Obama

[noodle]

Originally Posted by Slim

So some dufus comes up with this saying and the entire "christian right" is painted as wishing this on the president?

Lets take a look at those peace loving and accepting liberals for a moment, shall we? They're not quite as subtle as referencing a Psalm





They even made a movie about it....



http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/a...v-docudrama.do


Is it cool? No. Is it all liberals? No. Its not all conservative Christians either.

BTW..can you imagine the $hitestorm that would be raised over a bumpersticker with Obama's image and a noose?

and i don't agree with them either. but i take specific concern with this because its in the name of religion, which allows the idea to virally spread. its pushing forward the rhetoric that the president is specifically evil as per the biblical sense, and would be favorable in the eyes of god/jesus if he were to be not alive anymore.

[Mo]

Gav:

Sorry, I jumped the gun there. I misread your post as saying everyone in our country found this intolerance acceptable. I'm just upset by the way so many on the right treat Obama.
But it's not all of us.

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by Slim

Fundamentalist Christian Jihad? Please.

Yeah, it's called a Crusade. Get it right.

Anyway, I think the bumper sticker is pretty clever, and if someone wants to slap that on their car, it's fine by me.

[Rockstar44]

While I have been an occasional lurker in the Water Cooler, and sometimes have even visited the Politics section, I have so far refrained from posting here. I have my opinions on politics, which in the world of fencing I keep to myself. Some of you guys just amaze me, though. It's pretty easy to pick out the Public School graduates among you. Your (lack of) capacity for rational thought and your (lack of) ability to assess the written word is truly astounding.

Originally Posted by Slim

BTW..can you imagine the $hitestorm that would be raised over a bumpersticker with Obama's image and a noose?

Here, Slim asks a question. He's making a valid point. Even one bumper sticker like this with Obama's name on it would make national news.

Originally Posted by telkanuru

You mean when the message changes from anti-death penalty to "let's lynch the black man", people might get pissy?

I have read Slim's post over and over again, and yet I can't seem to find the part where he says, "Let's lynch the black man". Get your mind out of the gutter.

Originally Posted by Bayou Bum

No one here (either conservative or liberal) condones the bumper sticker about Obama. Everyone agrees that it is in poor taste, but where is the same condemnation of the sayings about Bush?

I notice that there is no rush from Telk and his ilk to answer this question. It's a valid question and deserves an answer. But, I think that we all know what the answer is....

Getting back to what the original post was about, geez, people, it's a joke! Lighten up.

That's another thing that is rampant among you "liberals" out there. You have absolutely no sense of humor!

And, just for the record, I happen to be a registered democrat.

Lighten up. It doesn't hurt (much).

[erooMynohtnA]

Originally Posted by Rockstar44

I notice that there is no rush from Telk and his ilk to answer this question. It's a valid question and deserves an answer. But, I think that we all know what the answer is...

No, what is it? As the only person in this thread who is registered pro bumper sticker I feel I am entitled to ask.

[I_luv_saber]

Originally Posted by Rockstar44

While I have been an occasional lurker in the Water Cooler, and sometimes have even visited the Politics section, I have so far refrained from posting here.

Oh, you're hooked now, buddy!

Be prepared to waste away hours of your time now .

Some of you guys just amaze me, though. It's pretty easy to pick out the Public School graduates among you. Your (lack of) capacity for rational thought and your (lack of) ability to assess the written word is truly astounding.

You'll notice most of us here practice civility without resorting to serious ad hominem (keep in mind, I did say most). Please, don't propagate the bad... this is not a good start.

I have read Slim's post over and over again, and yet I can't seem to find the part where he says, "Let's lynch the black man". Get your mind out of the gutter.

He's not saying that, you're right. What telk was trying to point out (if I'm not mistaken, and telk please correct me if I am) is that when you put Obama next to a noose, it becomes a different meaning to a lot of people. Should that be? Maybe, maybe not. But it's not as simple as "Noose with white guy okay, noose with black guy = bad". Both are wrong. But AFAIK white people are not recently known to have been lynched due to racism. Black people are. Hence it takes on a very different meaning, right or not.

EDIT: Also, I think you should check with the people actually toting those stickers to see of they think it's a "joke". I'm not sure all of them would agree with you. Either way, as a Christian, I find it pretty offensive when people use a book I find to be Holy either as a tool for a crude joke about or as actually wishing those things on someone they don't agree with.

[Rockstar44]

Originally Posted by I_luv_saber

You'll notice most of us here practice civility without resorting to serious ad hominem (keep in mind, I did say most). Please, don't propagate the bad... this is not a good start.

Actually, it's not ad hominem. It's an identifiable trait.

[I_luv_saber]

......

Okay, whatever, I tried...

[Philistine]

Originally Posted by Rockstar44

While I have been an occasional lurker in the Water Cooler, and sometimes have even visited the Politics section, I have so far refrained from posting here.

Except for the dozen or so times you've posted here in the past....

Some of you guys just amaze me, though. It's pretty easy to pick out the Public School graduates among you. Your (lack of) capacity for rational thought and your (lack of) ability to assess the written word is truly astounding.

That's an... interesting outlook you've got there.

Here, Slim asks a question. He's making a valid point. Even one bumper sticker like this with Obama's name on it would make national news.

I have read Slim's post over and over again, and yet I can't seem to find the part where he says, "Let's lynch the black man". Get your mind out of the gutter.
{snip}

As others have noted--there's a different connotation with a noose juxtaposed with a black president. Either you're unaware of it, in which case the jibe at public school graduates falls a bit flat, or you're dissembling.

In any event there are a number of Obama bumper stickers, etc. which make the same general type of reference to the death of Obama without, as you say, making national news.

--Philistine

[migopod]

Originally Posted by Rockstar44

Here, Slim asks a question. He's making a valid point. Even one bumper sticker like this with Obama's name on it would make national news.

First of all, I personally as an unelected representative of the political far left have denounced and condemned the kill Bush signs above.

As far as why the anti-Bush signs and stickers didn't hit the media the same way the anti-Obama stuff is now, I propose a rational explanation.

For whatever reason (and I'll not speculate on it here), anti-war and anti-other-Bush-policy protests received very little media attention. Remember the global anti-war protests on Feb 15 2003? Do you remember how little attention the event was given in the US press vs the 9/12 teabag protest? If the media barely covers an event where even potentially hundreds of people out of a million or so protesters have offensive and inappropriate signage, who sees it?

In fact there was a reluctance in the media to admit public opposition to the Iraq war and Bush in general, at least in his first term. Going into a massive snit about the "Support Bush" sticker, for example, would have required admitting it existed.

Some people surely contend that the VLWC and Liberal press simply covered up the kill Bush material an effort to make the anti-Bush people seem homogenously reasonable and nice. I'd argue that the current crop of protesters is much more media savvy, has allies already established in media (Glen Beck for example) who are much better able to influence the extent to which the media as a whole cover these events. Better coverage leads to more people seeing the protesters messages. The good, the bad and the horribly offensive.

[fencerchica]

Originally Posted by I_luv_saber

He's not saying that, you're right. What telk was trying to point out (if I'm not mistaken, and telk please correct me if I am) is that when you put Obama next to a noose, it becomes a different meaning to a lot of people. Should that be? Maybe, maybe not. But it's not as simple as "Noose with white guy okay, noose with black guy = bad". Both are wrong. But AFAIK white people are not recently known to have been lynched due to racism. Black people are. Hence it takes on a very different meaning, right or not.

This was a good explanation. Too bad it seems to have fallen on deaf ears.

[Bayou Bum]

First:

Did you see the movie?

I've often seen the accusation that THEY (meaning liberals I suppose) made a movie that's some kind of assassination pornography glorifying the death of Bush.

I watched it a few years ago, and it was not at all what people who haven't seen it seem to think it is. You should check it out sometime.

Then:

Originally Posted by migopod

First of all, I personally as an unelected representative of the political far left have denounced and condemned the kill Bush signs above.

Encouraging people to view a movie promoting the death of Bush is certainly how liberals typically denounce such actions.

[migopod]

Originally Posted by Bayou Bum

Encouraging people to view a movie promoting the death of Bush is certainly how liberals typically denounce such actions.

This would be true if the movie indeed promoted the death of Bush. It absolutely did not.

I've frequently seen it referenced as you are now, but if you actually watched it you would see that it does not glorify assassination. It's more about the consequences of the assassination of the president and none of those consequences are presented as being good ones. It really isn't the movie that you seem to think it is. I recommend that people watch it for two reasons. One being that it should disabuse people of the misconception that it's advocating or celebrating assassinating Bush, and the other because it's a really very interesting commentary on the War on Terror extrapolated.

You might not agree with the actual message of the film, but claiming that it's pro-assassination is either ignorant or dishonest.

[fencerchica]

Originally Posted by Bayou Bum

Just where do you come up with this stuff? You have some very serious issues if you believe this. If you have some knowledge of an assignation (sp?) of the President, you should contact the Secret Service immediately.

What planet do you live on?

[telkanuru]

Originally Posted by Rockstar44

Here, Slim asks a question. He's making a valid point. Even one bumper sticker like this with Obama's name on it would make national news.

Of course. Because it would be seen as a statement with distinctly racist overtones.

I have read Slim's post over and over again, and yet I can't seem to find the part where he says, "Let's lynch the black man". Get your mind out of the gutter.

If you are unable to comprehend how putting a noose near the name of a black man implies lynching, you are even dumber than I already thought.

Here's a deep concept: context changes meaning.

I notice that there is no rush from Telk and his ilk to answer this question.

I have ilk? That's nice. How about what I've said before in other threads. I have no more sympathy towards the people that waved around "Kill Bush" signs than I have towards those who decide to pray for the suffering of the President of the United States. Did I like Bush? No, not in the least. But he was still my President, and that's the way that goes.

Don't drink the retard juice before you post, please.

[Bayou Bum]

Originally Posted by fencerchica

What planet do you live on?

Interesting article. I agree with the anti-government outrage. I'm outraged at the power the federal government under the liberals and Obama are trying to seize. But no where in the article did it mention the "Fundamentalist Christian Jihad". Yes, there have been protests against the government take over of health care. Yes, there will be more protests as to the path that Obama is taking this country. But, that is what makes this country great, freedom to do just that. Liberals didn't seem to mind the protests against the war in Iraq and President Bush. What about the anti-government outrage during the civil rights movement? Didn't that bring about change that was good for the country. Hypocrite, you only see protests as an outrage if you don't agree with the message!

[telkanuru]

Originally Posted by Bayou Bum

Interesting article. I agree with the anti-government outrage. I'm outraged at the power the federal government under the liberals and Obama are trying to seize. But no where in the article did it mention the "Fundamentalist Christian Jihad". Yes, there have been protests against the government take over of health care. Yes, there will be more protests as to the path that Obama is taking this country. But, that is what makes this country great, freedom to do just that. Liberals didn't seem to mind the protests against the war in Iraq and President Bush. What about the anti-government outrage during the civil rights movement? Didn't that bring about change that was good for the country. Hypocrite, you only see protests as an outrage if you don't agree with the message!

Oh yes, certainly. We don't need a system of checks and balances. We definitely need the Imperial Presidency. Sure, you can wire tap my phones, arrest me without cause, and imprison me indefinitely with not trial. It's definitely OK to invade countries under false pretenses and lie to the world about why we did so. Let's make sure no one can take any substances that they'd like, nor allow women to dictate what happens to their own bodies.

But God help us if you want to give me healthcare?

[jeff]

Exactly. Where were all these people complaining about the encroachment of the federal government during the last years when the expansion of unitary, concentrated power was actually happening? In fact, BB, where were you prior to the election? I don't recall you complaining about federal government encroachment then? Don't call other people hypocrite - just look in the mirror.

Even saying "government takeover of healthcare" is the same kind of disingenuous nonsense that was said when Medicare came out (we learned to live with it, and gee, it improved the lives of millions of elderly who previously had been cut off).

Civil rights protests weren't partisan attacks directed at only one party, as the current ones are. Shame for trying to associate the current smear campaigns and hysteria with the civil rights movement. Which, if you remember, was also a liberal movement labeled by ring wing nuts as socialism and the end of our county.

[thereom4]

Originally Posted by Rockstar44

It's pretty easy to pick out the Public School graduates among you.Your (lack of) capacity for rational thought and your (lack of) ability to assess the written word is truly astounding.

First off let me say welcome to the Politics section. Secondly, what does going to public school have to do with one's capacity for rational thought and ability to assess the written word? I went to public schools and I take offense to that. Even if I didn't go to public schools, your opinion would still be offensive and assuming. I doubt there is an AP Capacity and Ability class at Excelsior Prep (made up school) or any other private school. Capacity and ability can't be taught. But of course you know that. The difference between public and private school is access (to resources).

[thereom4]

@OP

It doesn't matter what anyone says, God put President Obama in the position he is in. Nothing happens without His knowledge and permission. They can pray for President Obama's destruction all day and all night if they'd like. God is righteous, He doesn't answer evil prayers. You can quote the whole Bible if you'd like, but that prayer won't be answered.

When David wrote that Psalm, he was in trouble. He was praying to God to deliver him from his enemies.

Here is the entire Psalm:

Psalm 109 (New International Version)

For the director of music. Of David. A psalm.

1 O God, whom I praise,
do not remain silent,

2 for wicked and deceitful men
have opened their mouths against me;
they have spoken against me with lying tongues.

3 With words of hatred they surround me;
they attack me without cause.

4 In return for my friendship they accuse me,
but I am a man of prayer.

5 They repay me evil for good,
and hatred for my friendship.

6 Appoint [a] an evil man [b] to oppose him;
let an accuser [c] stand at his right hand.

7 When he is tried, let him be found guilty,
and may his prayers condemn him.

8 May his days be few;
may another take his place of leadership.

9 May his children be fatherless
and his wife a widow.

10 May his children be wandering beggars;
may they be driven [d] from their ruined homes.

11 May a creditor seize all he has;
may strangers plunder the fruits of his labor.

12 May no one extend kindness to him
or take pity on his fatherless children.

13 May his descendants be cut off,
their names blotted out from the next generation.

14 May the iniquity of his fathers be remembered before the LORD;
may the sin of his mother never be blotted out.

15 May their sins always remain before the LORD,
that he may cut off the memory of them from the earth.

16 For he never thought of doing a kindness,
but hounded to death the poor
and the needy and the brokenhearted.

17 He loved to pronounce a curse—
may it [e] come on him;
he found no pleasure in blessing—
may it be [f] far from him.

18 He wore cursing as his garment;
it entered into his body like water,
into his bones like oil.

19 May it be like a cloak wrapped about him,
like a belt tied forever around him.

20 May this be the LORD's payment to my accusers,
to those who speak evil of me.

21 But you, O Sovereign LORD,
deal well with me for your name's sake;
out of the goodness of your love, deliver me.

22 For I am poor and needy,
and my heart is wounded within me.

23 I fade away like an evening shadow;
I am shaken off like a locust.

24 My knees give way from fasting;
my body is thin and gaunt.

25 I am an object of scorn to my accusers;
when they see me, they shake their heads.

26 Help me, O LORD my God;
save me in accordance with your love.

27 Let them know that it is your hand,
that you, O LORD, have done it.

28 They may curse, but you will bless;
when they attack they will be put to shame,
but your servant will rejoice.

29 My accusers will be clothed with disgrace
and wrapped in shame as in a cloak.

30 With my mouth I will greatly extol the LORD;
in the great throng I will praise him.

31 For he stands at the right hand of the needy one,
to save his life from those who condemn him.