If only it was possible to have different grips for the saber. I really love the visconti and the belgium grip for my foil, if only there were some way to change the plane french grip of a saber (which is my primary weapon). Though, because the guard curves around to the grip, would an italian grip work on a saber?
Firstly, the grip on a saber is not French, it is simply a saber grip. The French grip has a different curve in it than a saber to facilitate different movement.
Secondly, I don't think much improvement could be made on the grip. For what you are trying to do (9 times out of 10), cutting, the grip facilitates that better than any other could.
The only possible thing I could see done is doing something similar to the Gardere grip in foil - where it basically retains the traditional shape, and just adds some contour grooves and prongs for a secure position (though in saber these would need to be much smaller, basically just nubs, and the contours more subtle).
Personally, I would find this more inhibiting than helpful. The simplicity and utility of the saber grip facilitates the goal of cutting better than a pistol would.
Try making a series of small, quick head cuts with a saber. Then try the same with a pistol foil.
(I can't see Italian working at all on a saber. It simply puts your fingers in the wrong position and would break them with the first strong beat/parry)
Last edited by I_luv_saber; 11-16-2009 at 04:22 AM.
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it."
I am very happy with my leather wrapped sabre grips...so, I definitely wouldn't change anything. Putting one of my Ziv K2 grips on my sabre would just confuse the living daylights out of me. Besides, like I_luv_saber said, there's not much improvement that could be made and made to be practical. The only improvement I found between sabre grips was going between the rubber grip to the leather wrapped.
"Inside every older person is a younger person wondering what the hell happened." ~Cora Harvey Armstrong
Never do anything you wouldn't want to explain to the Paramedics!
Seconded on the leather. They tend to get a "glaze" that makes them slippery - but I usually just give a quick sanding to make it more rough again until I finally need to rewrap or get a new one...
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it."
As ‘I luv saber stated a French grip and a Sabre grip are not the same. In fact it would be illegal to put a French grip on the Sabre, unless it was a children’s model as it is to long (M.4.1).
Also, an orthopedic handle would be considered illegal also (M.4.6). A rule of thumb for illegal handles is; if it has prongs and an outside pommel, it is illegal.
Also, an orthopedic handle would be considered illegal also (M.4.6). A rule of thumb for illegal handles is; if it has prongs and an outside pommel, it is illegal.
Too right. I should've been more clear that I was speaking completely hypothetically.
Originally Posted by Nico
Ah. I was just curious. Oh well, epic fail I suppose.
Nothing wrong with exploring ideas. FWIW, what's uncomfortable to me, could be quite comfortable to another. Feel free to give it a go, provided legality isn't an issue and this is just something you're toying with.
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it."
If the grip (or glove) includes any device or attachment or has
a special shape (orthopaedic) which fixes the position of the
hand on the grip, the grip must conform to the following
conditions.
(a) It must determine and fix one position only for the hand
on the grip.
(b) When the hand occupies this one position on the grip, the
extremity of the thumb when completely extended must
not be more than 2 cm from the inner surface of the
guard.
Even though it seems reasonably useless to "post" on a saber grip (putting your pinky and possibly ring finger around the pommel), it's still possible. I was under the impression that because of this, the interpretation is you could not use an ortho on a saber, because you could still (sort of) post (hence having a second possible hand position). Then again, I'm no expert on the rules. I would be curious to know whether he/she was somehow able to actually modify their saber to conform, or if this was a (perhaps arbitrary) change of interpretation (or most likely: me just being wrong). Perhaps a very tiny pommel?
EDIT: Here's the other thread. Consensus seems to be leaning towards "yes", but I still have my doubts.
Also found in the thread, some may find this interesting:
Last edited by I_luv_saber; 11-16-2009 at 12:24 PM.
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it."
Bigger problem with that would be that it would almost force the user to do cuts from the wrist, elbow or shoulder ( a la the flick ) rather than with the fingers. Or so it seems to me.
Unless you like doing only point work in sabre, I can't see how it would be of much use...
Use the Shift key, people! Keyboard manufacturers everywhere are ineffably saddened when you ignore what they made just for you!
Bigger problem with that would be that it would almost force the user to do cuts from the wrist, elbow or shoulder ( a la the flick ) rather than with the fingers. Or so it seems to me.
Unless you like doing only point work in sabre, I can't see how it would be of much use...
Agreed, except that flicks don't come from the shoulder, they come from the fingers and hand position.
Agreed, except that flicks don't come from the shoulder, they come from the fingers and hand position.
Admittedly I don't watch a lot of foil, but I can't recall ever seeing a flick accomplished any other way than by first drawing the arm back and then lashing it forward. Can you do one with an extended arm, using just the fingers? Doesn't seem like it would have the necessary force that way.
Use the Shift key, people! Keyboard manufacturers everywhere are ineffably saddened when you ignore what they made just for you!
All this talk of big arm movements suggests that you haven't watched any epee ever...
Or Foil from within the last 10 years.
Both which can feature large amounts of flicking.
Even with the flycasting technique the actual part that's going to provide the flick is the bit right at the end. The arm movement adds additional momentum as well as establishing priority in Foil.
All this talk of big arm movements suggests that you haven't watched any epee ever...
1) I make it a point not to do so.
2) Who was even talking about epee?
Or Foil from within the last 10 years.
Well, you know, I was going to go out and find a few videos of people doing these whip-cracking flicks, but I just couldn't motivate myself to watch enough foil bouts to do that.
I will point you toward two I found just searching for "foil flick" on Youtube, though. One is entitled ( conveniently enough ) "Kliebrink's Flick", by Cyrus of Chaos; the other is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO7Cv6sM0rs. Just look at the flapping mess about 40 seconds in on that one. Look again at 6:20 or so---fellow on the right delivering from the elbow. There's plenty of "big arm movements", and bent-arm attacks that finish not with thrusts but apparently are intended to make the blade arc around and hit scorpion-tail fashion.
Even with the flycasting technique the actual part that's going to provide the flick is the bit right at the end. The arm movement adds additional momentum as well as establishing priority in Foil.
I can but take your word for it, however unlikely that looks to the naked eye.
In any event my point still stands: A pistol grip on a sabre would likely be much too limiting in delivering sabre cuts, as opposed to foil-type flicks.
Use the Shift key, people! Keyboard manufacturers everywhere are ineffably saddened when you ignore what they made just for you!
Originally Posted by DHCJr 
