Italian Grip?

[Gaunai]

I've been scouring the web for a place that sells Italian grips, yet have been unable to find any that doesn't seem shady... Now before people start steering me away from it, I've practiced with quite a few grips my friends have, and found I like the Italian the best. He found his on Ebay.. I have not had such luck.

So, I guess my question is, does anyone know a reliable place where I can get a practice Italian?

Thanks.

[JackOfHearts]

http://stores.thefencingpost.com/-st...Categories.bok

^The best place for true ricasso blades. Otherwise, you can get a false ricasso to convert a regular practice blade to an italian grip from here: http://amfence.com/html/classical.html

[Gaunai]

Thank you very much for the links. I should have asked here to begin with lol.

[EldRick]

Also, American Fencers Supply: http://www.amfence.com/html/class_parts.html

[forethought]

For bellguards, I'd go Negrini:

http://www.negrini.com/eng.php?conte...fioretto&cat=7

I'm not a fan of the Uhlmann Italian bellguards, because the plane of the blade is offset to the plane of the crossbars.

Uhlmann is selling true ricasso blades (where they're forged, I do not know); you can find the non-electric ones here:

http://www.uhlmann-fechtsport.com/mo...ducts_id=57979

I also prefer the Uhlmann plastic Italian grips to those from Negrini, in so much that there's a bit more texture to them (though I wrap mine in athletic tape).
You'll have to pay shipping from Europe

Edit: Whoa, I hadn't seen the new Fencing Post website! It looks like all their Italian gear is Uhlmann, so that may be a good source for the blade and grip, though I'd still recommend Negrini for the guard.

[fatfencer]

i'd forgotten how nice the felt. I got it cinched so tight to my wrist my arm just carries the weight and my death grip relaxes.

I think I'm going to start fencing with it this week.

[fatfencer]

For bellguards, I'd go Negrini:

http://www.negrini.com/eng.php?conte...fioretto&cat=7

I'm not a fan of the Uhlmann Italian bellguards, because the plane of the blade is offset to the plane of the crossbars.

Uhlmann is selling true ricasso blades (where they're forged, I do not know); you can find the non-electric ones here:

http://www.uhlmann-fechtsport.com/mo...ducts_id=57979

I also prefer the Uhlmann plastic Italian grips to those from Negrini, in so much that there's a bit more texture to them (though I wrap mine in athletic tape).
You'll have to pay shipping from Europe

Edit: Whoa, I hadn't seen the new Fencing Post website! It looks like all their Italian gear is Uhlmann, so that may be a good source for the blade and grip, though I'd still recommend Negrini for the guard.

I have a negrini and it too is offset from flat. Not enough to allow one to flick but I bend mine down with a hammer until i get it where I want it.


I also like the plain flat ones. In fact I like them better. Sure I c
ant flick but who cares really? I'm still working on distance and lunging and stuff.

It also makes me feel very comfortable with limiting my parries.

[Ken Mondschein]

I fence with an Italian épée and teach a "scuola mixta" foil form to my historical fencing students to improve their bladework. I really like the Uhlmann foil blades, and wish that true-ricasso spada blades were still being manufactured. Still, AmFence's Tom Rockwell parts are a good substitute gor the latter (you will want to round the corners and tape up the false ricasso, though). If you're going to get a plastic grip, get a Rockwell. They're denser and feel better. (Wood is, of course, optimal.)

I am saying all of this with the caveat that I don't recommend the Italian grip for serious modern competition. If you're going to play the modern game, play the modern game, but don't mix apples and oranges.

[forethought]

I have a negrini and it too is offset from flat. Not enough to allow one to flick but I bend mine down with a hammer until i get it where I want it.


I also like the plain flat ones. In fact I like them better. Sure I c
ant flick but who cares really? I'm still working on distance and lunging and stuff.

It also makes me feel very comfortable with limiting my parries.

When did you acquire your Negrini Italian guards? The ones I have the plane of the blade is just about the same as the plane of the crossbar (maybe 5 degrees off, compared to around 15-20 degrees that the Uhlmann has).

Or, are you talking about something that would allow for a cant to be in the handle?

[fatfencer]

Its about 20 degrees off.. oh dammit wheres my protractor.

I use Tom Rockwells epee pommels. modern electric FIE blades often are heavier than the ricasso-ed, non electric blades of yore. Its slightly longer, by like a 1/ inch or so overall but I don't mind that. For me it helps with my point control.

I fashioned my strap by cutting off an old belt and putting new holes in. Works great.

I have 2 made up now.. that plus 2 visconti smalls and a belgian and I think I'm covered. Eventually I will go with all Italian.

I disagree with Mr Mondschein in that I think it can be used, successfully, in competition. Depends on what one means perhaps by successfully.

I guess what I mean by successfully is that someone could eventually get to be an A fencer with it. I don't think they would be a 'competitive' A fencer, i.e. top 32...

but they would certainly do well at local, regional levels.

I use it mainly to help with my carpal and repetitive stress issues. Lord knows I have no love for 'classicalism' for its own sake. Guys like AA Crown, Evangelista, etc just don't do it for me.

[Joe biebel]

Or you could go here: http://www.twinarmsfencing.com/ They look too nice to play with, but they are made to be used, the owner tells me.

[Ken Mondschein]

I disagree with Mr Mondschein in that I think it can be used, successfully, in competition. Depends on what one means perhaps by successfully.

Certainly, at lower levels (depending on where you are), you can probably do well with it. It comes down to the fencer, after all, not the gear. However, it is in some ways inherently limiting to the modern game - harder to flick, harder to in-fight, etc.

Note the offset Italian épée is a specific modification, introduced, I believe, by the Greco brothers. It aids in angulation, in effect canting the blade. The straight mounts are not made to be canted. One angulates as shown in Gaugler's book, by bending the wrist.

-Ken (who does believe in classicism for its own sake)

[JackOfHearts]

Meh, it's just a handle. If you can poke the other person once, you can poke them enough times to win, regardless of what's on the end of your blade. Whether or not you have the skill to is a different discussion altogether.

[fatfencer]

Certainly, at lower levels (depending on where you are), you can probably do well with it. It comes down to the fencer, after all, not the gear. However, it is in some ways inherently limiting to the modern game - harder to flick, harder to in-fight, etc.

Note the offset Italian épée is a specific modification, introduced, I believe, by the Greco brothers. It aids in angulation, in effect canting the blade. The straight mounts are not made to be canted. One angulates as shown in Gaugler's book, by bending the wrist.

-Ken (who does believe in classicism for its own sake)

Admittedly I find Gaugler's vintage a bit more palatable than those previously mentioned. And I happily admit I would have been Nadi's biggest fan were I alive at the time.

Yes it is nigh unto impossible to flick without banging the **** out of the left 'prong' to make it trigger like. And infighting? Sadly never my specialty in foil fencing. Actually my infighting is legendarily, hopelessly gay.

Give me a backsword or a barong and we got a WHOLE NUTHA discussion.

I guess I do buy Nadi's args about the functional separation of the hand from the arm via the strap. It really does work for me.

Maybe someday we will see a renaissance of Italian grips in the USFA.

[Gaunai]

Well, I'm still "new" to the sport. Loving it so far. I do not see myself ever becoming A rank, hell, I'll be lucky if I can beat most of the people our college club. I'm just looking for something different, and something that feels good in my hands.

I tried the pistol grips and found my fingers are too damn long to use them comfortable (piano fingers), and as for the French... it's nice, but my hand hurts quickly over time.

Anyway, thanks for all the quick help. I'm ordering the one from The Fencing Post as I type this.. literally lol.

[JackOfHearts]

Anyway, thanks for all the quick help. I'm ordering the one from The Fencing Post as I type this.. literally lol.

Excellent choice. It's worked well for me.

[migopod]

You could also learn to weld and make your own. I cooked this one up for someone in my kitchen a few years ago with only an oxy-acetylene torch, a 4" right angle grinder and a dremmel tool.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/98014/foil/grip1_7.jpg
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/98014/foil/grip2_3.jpg

(note the quillons are too long to be legal, and it's a somewhat modified Italian design, but if you do your own you can always make it how you like it.)

[fatfencer]

Especially the 2nd example. Very nice.

Too bad you dont have any extras you'd give away...

[Noxias80]

Or you could go here: http://www.twinarmsfencing.com/ They look too nice to play with, but they are made to be used, the owner tells me.

i have a false ricasso coming from that website this week

[I_luv_saber]

So, with all this said, are Italian grips even legal for competition?

Yes, I'm a jerk.

What about wrist straps? Those can't be legal, right?

Yes, I'm that much of a jerk.