Punctured mask at European Jr Championships

[SJCFU#2]

You assume there is equipment inspections at any domestic british events.....

Or that some other NGB (such as the USFA) decides to follow the BFA's lead (as opposed to following the DFB's lead).

Or that analysis of the most recent incident leads the FIE to select a similar course of action (although I admit that seems like a remote possibility unless the only alternative would be for the FIE to completely abandon those same visor mask which they have been pushing for much of the last decade).

[Gav]

DFB?

<padding>

[downunder]

the problem is that they are not regulated enough. Speaking to the manufacturers, there is no requirement on the type of plastic that is put into the mask. There are hundreds of different types of Lexan, and so long as it passes that initial test once under controlled conditions then it's fine forever.

There is no question Lexan is incredibly safe. It is used worldwide for sporting, commercial and military purposes. Perhaps what needs to be done is the FIE specifies the exact type of lexan required - one solution could be the FIE centrally providing each piece to the manufacturers to spec and individually numbered?

Rather than throwing the baby out with the bathwater, we should be looking to address the issues with the mask. A protective layer is just common sense and has been recommended by the FIE for years. I agree with the British Fencing stance and I understand other manufacturers are looking at providing a protective layer to their masks.

[downunder]

DFB?

<padding>

german federation

[KD5MDK]

DFB?

<padding>

DeutchesFechterBund I would imagine. Or something like that.

[fencerbill]

DFB?

<padding>

From a lapel pin, Deutscher Fechter Bund.

[touchefriend]

A foil tip can move at the speed of a .38 and striking energy is not spread out as in a hockey puck. True or false?

[I_luv_saber]

the problem is that they are not regulated enough. {snip}

Rather than throwing the baby out with the bathwater, we should be looking to address the issues with the mask. {snip}

^ This.

[Mihail]

DFB?

<padding>

I'm not sure if this has been addressed thrice before, but it stands for Deutscher Fechter-Bund.

[Gav]

Thanks everyone. I don't think I will forget what DFB means - ever again.

[Barry Paul]

Due to recent events some customers have contacted Leon Paul wanting more information about Visor masks. Below is some extra information about these masks provided by Leon Paul.

Why would you use a Visor mask?
A Visor mask lets in about 20% more light meaning the fencer can see more clearly. This means, we believe, that the fencer will have a faster reaction time. So if there were two identical fencers and one used a standard mask and the other a Visor mask the one wearing the visor mask would have a faster reaction time. Reaction speed in fencing is crucial.

Quote from Richard Kruse European medallist
“Having used the visor masks I would not go back to the traditional mask. What I hope for personally is that they will let the usage of these masks be optional. That way people can decide for themselves.”

Quote from Laurence Halsted European medallist
“The visor masks allow an increased amount of light which means faster reaction times. If given the choice I would always opt for the visor over mesh.”

Do visor mask differ?
In the F.I.E rules book chapter 3 material rules ref 2.1.2 there are recommendations by materials experts on how a Visor mask should be manufactured and designed for maximum performance and safety. Similar advice appears in the CEN European standards. Leon Paul are the only fencing company to have followed all the safety guidelines.

Leon Paul is the only dual layer visor mask. This duel layer greatly increases the residual strength of the mask. This outer scratch layer is recommended by the materials experts but has been ignored by other manufactures. The dual layer prevents damage to the inner protective Lexan layer. The outer layer also helps prevent chemical attack to the Lexan layer. In our expert opinion we believe that if the recent failed mask had used a duel layer as recommended in the two guidelines the mask would not have failed.

Leon Paul use only the best quality Lexan that is unaffected by low temperature up to minus 40 degrees C , which is much lower than the minimum theoretical temperature that can be reached in an aircraft baggage hold.

The Leon Paul mask is a front loading visor mask making the changing of the visor quick and easy. The fixing screws are approached from the outside and the replacement outer scratch layer is easy to do. We use captive nuts which are permanently fixed to the mask frame.

We manufacture everything in our own factory and do not outsource the manufacture of our masks to other firms or countries. This way we can guarantee the product meets our standards and the materials we use do not change. We independently and periodically test our materials to ensure quality control.

To minimise heat, carbon dioxide concentration and condensation on the plastic visor surface we use both anti misting coatings and minimised internal padding which maximise ventilation. In some tests of ventilation our transparent masks outperformed standard mesh masks made by one of our competitors.

How do I look after a Lexan mask.

Looking after a Lexan mask is simple and safe as long as you follow the guidelines laid out in our instructions:
http://www.leonpaul.com/pdfs/285_vision2000.pdf

Key points are:
• If the inner visor under the scratch resistant outer layer appears damaged in any way immediately replace it. Damage includes any scratches to the inner or outer surface or any sign of cracks.

• The visor should not be cleaned using anything other than water and a clean lint free cloth. Use of soaps especially those containing perfume and alcohol such as hand washes and washing up liquid can damage the visor.

• Do not allow the mask to come into contact with any chemicals.

If you have any further questions please email a member of our team at sales@leonpaul.com.
___

[Barry Paul]

Research done on visor masks over the last 10 years make Leon Paul believe that a scratch layer is fundamentally important to the safety of these masks and should be mandatory.

Leon Paul has 15 plus years in research and development in this area, has had test done by F.I.E. approved test houses and used University's for research and development. Leon Paul has also contacted and used advice from Lexan experts including manufactures in paintball helmets, motor bike helmets, ice hockey helmets and many more.

If you want to see the P.P.E. Standrds advice appendix c please go to 11 reply on this page http://fencingforum.com/forum/showth...t=13089&page=5 (or can some one paste it into this post )

[Goldgar]

Leon Paul is the only duel layer visor mask. This duel layer greatly increases the residual strength of the mask.

Although normally I try not to comment on spelling or grammatical errors in forum posts, since this text apparently comes from a document you give out and maybe post on your website, I suggest that you correct "duel" to "dual" throughout.

Unless that was an intentional pun, of course.

[Barry Paul]

Quote Unless that was an intentional pun, of course. If only we were that clever.

Ben wrote it, I read it and spell checker checked it. Slight problem we are both dyslexic but I don't know about Ben? (thanks will amend the master. )

[chinbeard]

The only solution:

http://www.leonpaulusa.com/acatalog/...stic_Foil.html

What's with our attachment to metal? Fencing is about athleticism, coordination, mind-games, and speed. It is no longer about training to kill people with lethal a lethal weapon. Why then should we continue to use things that often become potentially lethal weapons? I know it would be a total game-changer, just as switching from real swords to flimsy foiled blades was hundreds of years ago, but the fundamental elements would still be there.

[Inquartata]

Thanks everyone. I don't think I will forget what DFB means - ever again.

But did you know that Red Bull Cola contains traces of cocaine?

A Visor mask lets in about 20% more light meaning the fencer can see more clearly.

Yes...assuming it doesn't fog up.

And never mind that frame around the window...which compared to a mesh mask lets in, I would estimate, 100% less light.

Leon Paul use only the best quality Lexan that is unaffected by low temperature up to minus 40 degrees C

"We use only the finest baby frogs, dew-picked and flown from Iraq, cleansed in the finest quality spring water, lightly killed, and then sealed in a succulent Swiss quintuple smooth treble cream milk chocolate envelope, and lovingly frosted with glucose."

[Purple Fencer]

"We use only the finest baby frogs, dew-picked and flown from Iraq, cleansed in the finest quality spring water, lightly killed, and then sealed in a succulent Swiss quintuple smooth treble cream milk chocolate envelope, and lovingly frosted with glucose."

"Don't you even take the bones out??"

[erik_blank]

"Don't you even take the bones out??"

"Well it wouldn't be all that CRUNCHY then would it?"

[Fencergrl]

Plus there's more calcium that way... you don't want osteoporosis do you?

[Rockstar44]

What's with our attachment to metal?

Perhaps because it conducts electricity? Maybe even better than plastic?