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Senior Member
Array The art of deception Let's see where this goes. http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/pc...rtisan-agenda/
First piss-Christ, then Maplethorpe and now this. This isnt art. Its propaganda.
The issue is using tax dollars to fund a group being told what sort of "art" to do by the current administration.
I dont like it. Truth is Liberal.  -
 Originally Posted by Slim I dont like it. -
 Originally Posted by Slim First piss-Christ, then Maplethorpe and now this. This isnt art. Its propaganda. Get it right, Maplethorpe was first, then Piss Christ -
 Originally Posted by Slim Let's see where this goes. http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/pc...rtisan-agenda/
First piss-Christ, then Maplethorpe and now this. This isnt art. Its propaganda.
The issue is using tax dollars to fund a group being told what sort of "art" to do by the current administration.
I dont like it. Art often has a message, and that message can be political; in of itself, that is not automatically a bad thing.
Anti-establishment art gets more attention because art in support of the powers-that-be is ubiquitous. - Wisdom is the knowledge of how much you don't know. -
Senior Member
Array typical.
idiot who isnt smart enough to get a real job draws art.
nobody wants crappy art.
artist is hungry.
fascist dictator in the making sees artist and offers money to artist to draw propaganda.
maybe im to cynical but that did not suprise me at all. Bury socialist healthcare with Ted Kennedy.
Cutting liberals down to size is my business, and business is GOOD. -
 Originally Posted by chase typical.
idiot who isnt smart enough to get a real job draws art.
nobody wants crappy art.
artist is hungry.
fascist dictator in the making sees artist and offers money to artist to draw propaganda.
maybe im to cynical but that did not suprise me at all. seriously? you call obama a socialist in one thread and a fascist in another? you do realize they're not interchangeable right? -
Senior Member
Array  Originally Posted by noodle seriously? you call obama a socialist in one thread and a fascist in another? you do realize they're not interchangeable right? Movement conservatism has been waging a PR war for some time now attempting to falsely conflate socialism with fascism with liberalism. Their point man last year was a mouthbreathing recipient of wingnut welfare (i.e. a talentless hack who lived on the largesse of the conservative think-tank network) named Jonah Goldberg. He wrote a book called Liberal Fascism, for people just like Chase. The central thesis seems to be that "fascism is just any generic kind of totalitarianism" and "liberals are totalitarian because they support regulation", and thus "liberals are fascists, QED". -
Senior Member
Array  Originally Posted by Hauptman Art often has a message, and that message can be political; in of itself, that is not automatically a bad thing.
Anti-establishment art gets more attention because art in support of the powers-that-be is ubiquitous. Not a problem. Take my avatar as an example. It's brilliant. But it was not funded by a grant from the NEA.
The Obama administration is telling the NEA how to spend their money and on what type of art they expect to come out of it. Of course you dont have a problem with this since you're ok with their agenda. Truth is Liberal.  -
 Originally Posted by Slim Not a problem. Take my avatar as an example. It's brilliant. But it was not funded by a grant from the NEA.
The Obama administration is telling the NEA how to spend their money and on what type of art they expect to come out of it. Of course you dont have a problem with this since you're ok with their agenda. lol... I guess "brilliant" is in the eye of the beholder. 
But your conclusion of what is going on between the administration and the NEA is a broad bit of speculation and inference based on a slanted article that is full of speculation and inference. What is lacking is the inclusion of clear statements of fact.
I however don't think that is an indication of conservative thinking; only sloppy thinking. - Wisdom is the knowledge of how much you don't know. -
Curmudgeon Emeritus
Array  Originally Posted by fencerchica Movement conservatism has been waging a PR war for some time now attempting to falsely conflate socialism with fascism with liberalism.
Are you familiar with the theory that the political spectrum is not a line but a circle? And that in terms of practical outcomes fascism and totalitarian communism are almost indistinguishable?
How different were Stalin and Mussolini ( to avoid Godwin I omit the customary comparison ) in terms of what they did in the real world, as opposed to the philosophies they spouted? Use the Shift key, people! Keyboard manufacturers everywhere are ineffably saddened when you ignore what they made just for you! -
Senior Member
Array  Originally Posted by Inquartata Are you familiar with the theory that the political spectrum is not a line but a circle? And that in terms of practical outcomes fascism and totalitarian communism are almost indistinguishable?
How different were Stalin and Mussolini ( to avoid Godwin I omit the customary comparison ) in terms of what they did in the real world, as opposed to the philosophies they spouted? Stalin's and Mussolini's states shared certain characteristics because both shared in a totalitarian nature; totalitarianism is the antithesis of liberalism.
The economic and ideological structures of Stalin's and Mussolini's states were quite dissimilar from one another even though the totalitarianism which they had in common produced a bottom-line impact to their peoples' level of freedom that was (somewhat) similar (herein lies the circular visualization). Furthermore, neither of them had anything in common with liberalism. -
Curmudgeon Emeritus
Array  Originally Posted by fencerchica Stalin's and Mussolini's states shared certain characteristics because both shared in a totalitarian nature; totalitarianism is the antithesis of liberalism. Yes.
And both fascism and communism are totalitarism, no?
The economic and ideological structures of Stalin's and Mussolini's states were quite dissimilar from one another even though the totalitarianism which they had in common produced a bottom-line impact to their peoples' level of freedom that was (somewhat) similar (herein lies the circular visualization). Furthermore, neither of them had anything in common with liberalism.
Which liberalism? The socialist or fascist form? Use the Shift key, people! Keyboard manufacturers everywhere are ineffably saddened when you ignore what they made just for you! -
The problem is that socialism is an economic model while fascism is a political model. Combine the two (totalitarian socialism) and you have communism.
But then it gets even more complicated because ideologically communism is not the same as the Soviet, Chinese, or Cuban models of communism that we are familiar with.
Possible we only see totalitarian socialism (communism) because the people wouldn't go for a pure socialist state without being forced to. 
Now if we could just get people to acknowledge that pure capitalism is as flawed as pure socialism then we might actually start making progress again. - Wisdom is the knowledge of how much you don't know. -
Curmudgeon Emeritus
Array That's like saying that unicorns are as flawed as dragons. Since none of them actually exist, it's a moot question. Use the Shift key, people! Keyboard manufacturers everywhere are ineffably saddened when you ignore what they made just for you! -
Senior Member
Array  Originally Posted by Inquartata That's like saying that unicorns are as flawed as dragons. Since none of them actually exist, it's a moot question. Existence isn't a prerequisite for debate, is it? People have been debating theology for simply ages! 
In any event, it's been well established that dragons are more flawed than unicorns. Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem
~
^[:wq -
 Originally Posted by Inquartata That's like saying that unicorns are as flawed as dragons. Since none of them actually exist, it's a moot question. Maybe they don't exist, but try telling that to all the zero-regulation, free-market capitalists we have in the U.S.!! - Wisdom is the knowledge of how much you don't know. -
Senior Member
Array The bottom line is that the institutions of movement conservatism (National Review, et al) are deliberately pushing falsehoods such as socialism=fascism=liberalism for the eager consumption of the intellectually lazy, such as Chase. And sure enough, here he is repeating them back like the good little parrot he is. -
 Originally Posted by fencerchica The bottom line is that the institutions of movement conservatism (National Review, et al) are deliberately pushing falsehoods such as socialism=fascism=liberalism for the eager consumption of the intellectually lazy, such as Chase. And sure enough, here he is repeating them back like the good little parrot he is. Too true. - Wisdom is the knowledge of how much you don't know. -
Senior Member
Array  Originally Posted by Inquartata That's like saying that unicorns are as flawed as dragons. Since none of them actually exist, it's a moot question. You need to believe harder "There is a fine line between clever and stupid" David St. Hubbins -
Senior Member
Array  Originally Posted by Hauptman lol... I guess "brilliant" is in the eye of the beholder. 
Isnt that what art is all about?  Originally Posted by Hauptman But your conclusion of what is going on between the administration and the NEA is a broad bit of speculation and inference based on a slanted article that is full of speculation and inference. What is lacking is the inclusion of clear statements of fact.
I however don't think that is an indication of conservative thinking; only sloppy thinking. Really now? http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpu...uidelines.html
Something certainly wasn't appropriate.
Last edited by Slim; 09-22-2009 at 06:24 PM.
Truth is Liberal. 
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