More racist claims

[Slim]

No seriously when was the last time you were hassled by a cop for the color of your skin? Or denied a loan even though you could afford it and had the credit? Just because we now have a black President doesn't mean that white people everywhere have thrown off the mantle of White Privilege that has been so carefully cultivated for the last thousand years.

White people can make racially motivated comments whenever they feel like and no one will call them on it. Glenn Beck can call the president a "Kenyan Muslim", even though he's not or a "Welfare Thug" whatever that is. Who calls him on it? Does he have to answer for these false and bizarre accusations? No.

If a black person were to say something like that they wouldn't be allowed on TV. Oh wait I forgot there are almost no black hosts on cable news networks. Nevermind, they couldn't even say it if they wanted to. So guess what, black people don't even have the same say on major news networks as white people. Sounds like racism to me.


I'll leave you with this. We can all name leaders in Black Liberation Theology. Every time they say something controversial it gets played over and over again. Can you name any of the White Power movement leaders?

This is joke, right? Umbrella, is that you? chase? Bayou Bum trying to be funny? Jeff perhaps?

[Slim]

Keith Olberman, for one.

But that's easy, since Beck's such a retard...

And Olberman is to be taken seriously? You've been hanging out with AnalogDigital I see.

[Slim]

Admins have the power to neg, but my question is Chase's repping power now negative?


Also, Obama the racist:

The point of this being?

[Hauptman]

What rock have you been living under?

What's up, Slim? This seems to be the sum total of your arguments these days; which is to say zero.

These one-liner ad hominems are getting old.

[Purple Fencer]

What's up, Slim? This seems to be the sum total of your arguments these days; which is to say zero.

These one-liner ad hominems are getting old.

Well, considering that's all he's ever had in the face of actual facts....

[Digital Analog]

This is joke, right? Umbrella, is that you? chase? Bayou Bum trying to be funny? Jeff perhaps?

Nope I'm just an educated young man with a passion for politics who likes to pick fights

[I_luv_saber]

No seriously when was the last time you were hassled by a cop for the color of your skin? Or denied a loan even though you could afford it and had the credit? Just because we now have a black President doesn't mean that white people everywhere have thrown off the mantle of White Privilege that has been so carefully cultivated for the last thousand years.

However, colleges also offer special advantages to people of different races. That's clear-cut racism. Now, you can argue that it's a good use of racism (which I don't believe, myself), but it's still the definition of racism, all the same.

White people can make racially motivated comments whenever they feel like and no one will call them on it. Glenn Beck can call the president a "Kenyan Muslim", even though he's not or a "Welfare Thug" whatever that is. Who calls him on it? Does he have to answer for these false and bizarre accusations? No.

Bull.

A white person can be labeled a racist simply from an accusation. It's akin to (though not quite as harsh) as accusing someone of being a child-molester. Even if you disprove the accusation, it still sticks.

And white people can say racially motivated things and get away with it? What?! Yeah, that worked out really well for, say, Michael Richards .

Black comedians can make fun of any race unabashed. White comedians run the risk of being labeled racists.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to argue that there is no racism on the part of white people. That's ridiculous. Nor am I arguing that racism from black people is more prolific than racism from white people. But to ignore it exists is being disingenuous.

How about we have a "Asian History Month" (or if there is one, more airplay)? How about a "European History Month" . I'm proud of my heritage too.

[Philistine]

However, colleges also offer special advantages to people of different races. That's clear-cut racism. Now, you can argue that it's a good use of racism (which I don't believe, myself), but it's still the definition of racism, all the same.
{snip}

It's not "racism." It is racial discrimination--but the two aren't the same. (In the same sense that providing seperate men's and women's bathrooms is sexual discrimination, but not sexism.)

--Philistine

[I_luv_saber]

It's not "racism." It is racial discrimination--but the two aren't the same. (In the same sense that providing seperate men's and women's bathrooms is sexual discrimination, but not sexism.)

--Philistine

True. But many of the claims of racism towards black people are also cases of racial discrimination and not actual racism.

Quite right, though.

EDIT: I also wouldn't call your example discrimination, but segregation. Discrimination implies an advantage to one or the other.

EDIT EDIT: Although I wonder if urinals could be considered an advantage?

[jessicasimpson]

However, colleges also offer special advantages to people of different races. That's clear-cut racism. Now, you can argue that it's a good use of racism (which I don't believe, myself), but it's still the definition of racism, all the same.

What kind of advantage? Do they use a different grading scale? Do they pay different tuitions? Or do they just have different standards for addmit?

[Philistine]

True. But many of the claims of racism towards black people are also cases of racial discrimination and not actual racism.{snip}

I've always understood the difference to be that racism is a belief, wheras racial discrimination was an action.

Very often racial discrimination is caused by racism (conscious or uncounscious), and "rascist" as an adjective is often used as a shorthand for saying that something shows that the person is rascist--but all cases of racial discrimination aren't racism (for that matter, alll rascists don't necessarily believe there should be racial discriination).

EDIT: I also wouldn't call your example discrimination, but segregation. Discrimination implies an advantage to one or the other.

It certainly has come to often have a connotation as advantage to one (or disadvantage to another), though as a technical matter that is not so.

EDIT EDIT: Although I wonder if urinals could be considered an advantage?

You misunderstand--guys are disadvantaged by not having all the ameneties in a women's restrooms. Some women's restrooms are nicer than apartments that I've lived in. I'll tell you one thing--no men's restroom ever had a couch in it!

--Philistine

[I_luv_saber]

You misunderstand--guys are disadvantaged by not having all the ameneties in a women's restrooms. Some women's restrooms are nicer than apartments that I've lived in. I'll tell you one thing--no men's restroom ever had a couch in it!

--Philistine

Too true! When I was still working as a bellhop I had to service restrooms overnight. The first time I walked into the women's restroom I couldn't believe it. I had never heard of a restroom having it's own lobby before then!

[I_luv_saber]

What kind of advantage? Do they use a different grading scale? Do they pay different tuitions? Or do they just have different standards for addmit?

Admissions, mostly. Affirmative Action.

Here's a story in USA Today

It's an old article, but just a quick Google.

[Bayou Bum]

Your inclusion of Justice Sotomayor alongside Rev. Wright and Jesse Jackson sreveals a lot about your prejudices.

How so? I included Sotomayer to show that the problem includes all races.

[migopod]

How so? I included Sotomayer to show that the problem includes all races.

Okay, I'll bite. What makes you think justice Sotomayor is a racist?

[Bayou Bum]

No seriously when was the last time you were hassled by a cop for the color of your skin? Or denied a loan even though you could afford it and had the credit? Just because we now have a black President doesn't mean that white people everywhere have thrown off the mantle of White Privilege that has been so carefully cultivated for the last thousand years.

White people can make racially motivated comments whenever they feel like and no one will call them on it. Glenn Beck can call the president a "Kenyan Muslim", even though he's not or a "Welfare Thug" whatever that is. Who calls him on it? Does he have to answer for these false and bizarre accusations? No.

If a black person were to say something like that they wouldn't be allowed on TV. Oh wait I forgot there are almost no black hosts on cable news networks. Nevermind, they couldn't even say it if they wanted to. So guess what, black people don't even have the same say on major news networks as white people. Sounds like racism to me.


I'll leave you with this. We can all name leaders in Black Liberation Theology. Every time they say something controversial it gets played over and over again. Can you name any of the White Power movement leaders?

You really need to get some help with your issues. Such hatred is really not healthy.

And yes, I've been hassled by a police officer of color, and I couldn't do anything about it. If he had beaten the crap out of me, no one would have cared. I've been denied a government SBA loan because I was white. That white privilege thing is overblown. Contrary to popular belief, I don't get bags of money on my doorstep just for being white and I have been turned down for jobs because of quotas.

Never mind. There is no hope on having an intelligent discussion with you on the subject. Personally, I think I should be able to choose which race I want to be. I'm being discriminated against because I do not get to choose my race. And why does Obama get to be a black man? After all, he is half white?

I give up. I'm done with the subject. Call me a racist all you want. Actually, it should be one the choices on the forms: Hispanic, White - Non Hispanic, Black, Asian, Racist, Cajun, Holier than thou, etc.

[jessicasimpson]

Admissions, mostly. Affirmative Action.

Well to me, giving a legacy (child of alumni) admission over someone with better grades and test scores is Affirmative action. Do you think that should be stopped also?

[MyrddinsPrecint]

Personally, I think I should be able to choose which race I want to be. I'm being discriminated against because I do not get to choose my race. And why does Obama get to be a black man? After all, he is half white?

What's stopping you? When you're filling out forms for employers, schools, etc in which race is a question, is it ever defined for you? Does it say you have to have had a certain number of grandparents who identified as something before you can check off a box?

Granted, if you look super White, you might get some strange looks and some judgment. If you fail to seem to have any idea of the cultural heritage of a particular racial group, you also might run into some stumbling blocks. You might have to get some plastic surgery. Depending on the direction you want to go, different eye shape, probably a nose job, perhaps spending a whole bunch of time in a tanning salon... you can even be read as at least "mixed" pretty easily, and if you're read as "mixed", you usually get the benefit of the doubt on these things....

But let's assume you're not as committed to that statement as a little plastic surgery allows, and give you another example:


I do appear more on the "white" side of the spectrum, but I am often assumed to be part or all Asian. I can probably either check off the "White" box, the "Asian" box, or the "Mixed" box without significant challenge. I've never met most of my mother's family, and both her parents were dead before I was born. I majored in math and cook with mostly Asian influence. Surgery could make my eyes appear more or less Asian, and isn't too major. A nose job could put me more in either direction, although it's unlikely I (personally) would elect to have one. Dying my hair is a super easy and reversible way to make myself appear more or less Asian.

I do, for most intents and purposes, have a choice. Even if I choose not to change myself in any way with surgery or hair dye, I can easily claim "White", "Asian" or "Mixed". Which should I choose? Is it ethical to choose something I know to be false, or is it just claiming the official privileges of something others assume me to be already? Is changing my appearance for this purpose ethical?

[keith]

And why does Obama get to be a black man? After all, he is half white?

.... and working out the answer to that question might tell you a lot about race in america.

[I_luv_saber]

Well to me, giving a legacy (child of alumni) admission over someone with better grades and test scores is Affirmative action. Do you think that should be stopped also?

Well, I think that's a bit of a different situation. However, yes, I believe I would be opposed to that as well.

That said, I'm not sure I'd be against financial discrimination (advantages to the poor, namely), but that's not the same thing as giving an advantage based on the color of someone's skin. That's a whole 'nother can of worms, though!