Our dear leader going after the kids

[thereom4]

Yes he is, even though I didn't vote for him. Unlike the liberals who refused to acknowledge that Bush was their President.

Who are these liberals you're talking about? Do they exist outside of your own head?

[Inquartata]

Right, but when the charge of Obama being a socialist is made, the burden of proof is on those making the charge.

Absolutely.

There is this vexed problem: In politics, very often it seems that charges are made as pre-emptive strikes. I can somewhat see the reason for this. If I think that Bob is trying to do X, but Bob denies it, that he is trying to do X may only be proved by Bob actually accomplishing X; by which time it's too late to do anything about it. So the charges are made and vigorously defended without proof, just to prevent Bob from sneaking X through, and to make X more difficult...

Another reason why I'm glad I don't have to live in that world. Lies, dissembling and dancing "the Sidestep" are all required practices.

Hence, the statement "Obama is not a socialist" is the default position and must be DISproven (you know, kinda like 'Innocent until proven guilty').

You'd think so, wouldn't you?

Although personally I'd prefer a neutral default position, rather than a firm assertion of either A or not-A...

Otherwise, the thesis that you ARE a thief has the same validity as the thesis that you are NOT, with the burden of proof equally distributed. I mean, I'm not saying that you ARE, but I have no proof to the contrary, right?

Very true!

But!

How committed is your view that "not a thief" must be one's default condition? For instance, are you going to ask a stranger to watch a bag containing your life's savings for a minute? Are you going to leave your car running and the door open while you run inside the gas station?

There's such a thing as caution. It's safer to consider everyone a potential thief until you have enough information to know better, is it not? Maybe not charitable, but safer. Lock your doors, watch your wallet, and keep an eye on your politicians at all times...

Actually @Inquartata, I've yet to see a reference to your comment about Obama and his policy with respect to detainee abuse. Did he decide to continue the program, or is he just using the fruit of that particular poisoned tree?

Just the latter, I think, although we can't know with utmost confidence. He doesn't seem to be advocating the dropping of charges against detainees who were interrogated with..."enhanced" methods. He doesn't seem to be saying that we will not act on verifiable intelligence gotten through such methods in the past. He just seems to be saying he doesn't intend to see these methods used in future. ( And I'm not sure if that's just for public consumption or not. )

How about just the simple fact that he SAYS that he's not a socialist, and hasn't behaved in anyway that RESEMBLES a socialist (at least not compared to any other president in the last hundred years).

I wonder how many people are dead because they accepted an impression of a Ted Bundy or a BTK at face value?

Yes, an extreme example. But as House might say, "Everyone lies". People lead secret lives sometimes. A con man will work hard to convince you that he's as honest and trustworthy as the day is long in Nigeria, and may do absolutely nothing to tip you off that he is not until he has your money and disappears.

Remember Nixon's "I am not a crook"? Remember Clinton's "I did not have sexual relations with that woman"?

As for Mr. Obama, I don't know that I agree on the "hasn't behaved in any way that resembles" part. IMO having government take over health care sounds a tiny little alarm bell. All those czars...the auto industry bailout...setting caps on compensation for bank executives... It may be a matter of boiling frogs, who can know for sure? I'm not ready to say that he IS advancing a socialist agenda, but clearly he distrusts the private sector, distrusts the market and believes in an expanded role for government...

And my point is that you might as well say he's a space alien based on the logical approach you are taking, while there is obvious reason to believe he is not a socialist.

Nope. I can't say that he is...or isn't. But on that one I'll play the odds that he's not.

[lindajdunn]

So you're fine with this video being shown in school to elementary aged kids? You are ok with this message?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51kAw4OTlA0

I epecially like the one about never giving anyone the finger while driving again.

I know a few people that I WISH would make that pledge.

[Inquartata]

Whaaaat?! You want to drive the state bird of New Jersey into extinction?

That's a good way to make PETA's "enemies" list.

[Purple Fencer]

Whaaaat?! You want to drive the state bird of New Jersey into extinction?

That's a good way to make PETA's "enemies" list.

If you even think about getting a puppy from a pet store you make PETA's enemies list...

[jessicasimpson]

Does anyone really think that an 18 min speach will undo all that was instilled over the lifetime of your children?

[Purple Fencer]

Does anyone really think that an 18 min speach will undo all that was instilled over the lifetime of your children?

Slim, BB, and other career paranoids seem to think so.

[jessicasimpson]

Slim, BB, and other career paranoids seem to think so.

They think the goverment can't do anything right, exept brainwash kids in record time. Why do they hate America so?

[pigeonmeister]

I am saying that the thesis "Obama is not a socialist" has not been proven.

Not according to this good lady (0:45)

Think of the children.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/vide...892/index.html

[Purple Fencer]

Text of the speech is at: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090907/...ol_speech_text

Sorry...but I see no indoctrination here...no attempt to subvert the minds of students...

I just see the Prez telling everyone to stay in school, work hard, and do their best.

Or is that somehow something evil? Sorry, but I'd prefer kids NOT to be kept ignorant and stupid because of the irrational paranoia of certain adults...

[Bayou Bum]

God bless you, and God bless America.

No one is offended about Obama mentioning God in school? Is it only if a conservative christian mentions God in school that it is offensive?

I'm glad he listened and made the changes. Except for it being long winded and I think most of the students won't listen, it isn't bad. I like the part of self reliance and having to work for a living. Maybe he is learning that the government can't support everyone.

[thereom4]

No one is offended about Obama mentioning God in school? Is it only if a conservative christian mentions God in school that it is offensive?

I'm glad he listened and made the changes. Except for it being long winded and I think most of the students won't listen, it isn't bad. I like the part of self reliance and having to work for a living. Maybe he is learning that the government can't support everyone.

At first I found you amusing, but really you're just annoying. Maybe you should go back to school so you can hear the speech. You need it. Find a worthy purpose.....please.

[tchwojko]

The sky is falling. Again.

[jessicasimpson]

No one is offended about Obama mentioning God in school? Is it only if a conservative christian mentions God in school that it is offensive?

I'm glad he listened and made the changes.

We will not know if people are offended untill he gives the speach.
What changes?
What did you think he was going to say?

[Purple Fencer]

We will not know if people are offended untill he gives the speach.
What changes?
What did you think he was going to say?

He thought it was gonna be a Big Brother speech....you know his rampant paranoia about a Brotha in the White House...

[Bayou Bum]

We will not know if people are offended untill he gives the speach.
What changes?
What did you think he was going to say?

Are you serious? Where do you get your information from?

[NGV]

Text of the speech is at: [url]
Sorry...but I see no indoctrination here...no attempt to subvert the minds of students.....

The text of the speech may seem innocuous enough. However, I have it on good authority that slowing down the audio of the speech by 75% and playing it backwards will reveal an audible demand for the abolition of the U.S. Constitution in favor of a revolutionary dictatorship of the proletariat that will seize total control of the means of production.

[Purple Fencer]

The text of the speech may seem innocuous enough. However, I have it on good authority that slowing down the audio of the speech by 75% and playing it backwards will reveal an audible demand for the abolition of the U.S. Constitution in favor of a revolutionary dictatorship of the proletariat that will seize total control of the means of production.

Thanks....that last bit gave me a flashback to a Monty Python sketch!!

[Bayou Bum]

The text of the speech may seem innocuous enough. However, I have it on good authority that slowing down the audio of the speech by 75% and playing it backwards will reveal an audible demand for the abolition of the U.S. Constitution in favor of a revolutionary dictatorship of the proletariat that will seize total control of the means of production.

You can play his speeches forward at normal speed and hear that message!

[pigeonmeister]

I would have paid a lot of money for Obama to start his speech...

"Al salaam a'alaykum, comrades"