Our dear leader going after the kids

[migopod]

1) you don't have to go to state schools.
2) what if your private school still decides to show the president? what recourse is there then?
3) its the individual school's choice to air the piece, as well as the individual teacher's choice to air the piece in their classroom. there are lots of choices involved in the airing of this piece, even beyond the choice of what school to send your kids.


i just want to point out that this is also hypocritical. years ago with a republican president, this kind of piece is ok and the democrats are just angry jerks for wanting to oppose it. today, with a democratic president, its not ok to air this kind of piece, say the republicans that used to be ok with the exact same thing. its sad to see that personal ideals are so easily sold and flipped based on what party is in the white house.

I'm a genuine Socialist who had a full-blown case of Bush Derangement Syndrome and who pretty much opposed nearly all of the previous administrations policies on ideological and personal grounds. That said, I wasn't aware of Bush's addresses to school children (probably because the evil liberal media wasn't making any kind of huge deal out of them). Had I been aware of them, given the content of the addresses, I can't see how they would have been at all inappropriate.

The Democratic opposition to those speeches was evidently pretty small, pretty ineffective and pretty stupid.

The Republican opposition to Obama's address is pretty small (although highly vocal), hopefully will be equally ineffective, and is without question equally stupid.

Seriously, for the entire duration of the last administration, I was pretty livid about nearly everything they did. I had "good reasons", and many of those "good reasons" have held up well with hindsight and revelations about the extent of the incompetence, corruption and complete disregard for the rule of law. Despite my worst fears (of course completely justified at the time), the US didn't wind up imposing martial law, locking up all the dissenters and cancelling elections forever. In retrospect, this is probably because Bush wasn't completely evil as I had supposed, and because he evidently quit listening to Cheney after his first term.

When I see people who are so fundamentally paranoid and so brainlessly opposed to every single thing that Obama says or does, I see myself from even a year ago.

People need to relax.

[Slim]

I'm a genuine Socialist who had a full-blown case of Bush Derangement Syndrome and who pretty much opposed nearly all of the previous administrations policies on ideological and personal grounds. That said, I wasn't aware of Bush's addresses to school children (probably because the evil liberal media wasn't making any kind of huge deal out of them). Had I been aware of them, given the content of the addresses, I can't see how they would have been at all inappropriate.

The Democratic opposition to those speeches was evidently pretty small, pretty ineffective and pretty stupid.

The Republican opposition to Obama's address is pretty small (although highly vocal), hopefully will be equally ineffective, and is without question equally stupid.

Seriously, for the entire duration of the last administration, I was pretty livid about nearly everything they did. I had "good reasons", and many of those "good reasons" have held up well with hindsight and revelations about the extent of the incompetence, corruption and complete disregard for the rule of law. Despite my worst fears (of course completely justified at the time), the US didn't wind up imposing martial law, locking up all the dissenters and cancelling elections forever. In retrospect, this is probably because Bush wasn't completely evil as I had supposed, and because he evidently quit listening to Cheney after his first term.

When I see people who are so fundamentally paranoid and so brainlessly opposed to every single thing that Obama says or does, I see myself from even a year ago.

People need to relax.

So since the group that is in line with your views now has power, you've reflected on your positions against the last administrations and decided they were over the top.

I'll make sure I do same after the next shift in power, hopefully no more than 3+ years from now.

Although, I doubt I'll reach the same conclusion, but one never knows. Thanks.

[I_luv_saber]

3) its the individual school's choice to air the piece, as well as the individual teacher's choice to air the piece in their classroom. there are lots of choices involved in the airing of this piece, even beyond the choice of what school to send your kids.

Just to clarify here, I think if I heard the blurb on CNN correctly, in different areas the decision is being made on different levels. In some places it's at the district level, in some it's at the school level, and in some it's all the way down to teacher/parent level (parents being able to opt out their kids if they so choose).

Could be wrong though, just that was what I had heard this morning (CNN is always on in the hotel lobby...)

This whole thing is really, really silly and overblown though....

[migopod]

So since the group that is in line with your views now has power, you've reflected on your positions against the last administrations and decided they were over the top.

I'll make sure I do same after the next shift in power, hopefully no more than 3+ years from now.

Although, I doubt I'll reach the same conclusion, but one never knows. Thanks.

I'm a Socialist. My party of choice is not even remotely in power.

I've been politically aware through three Republican administrations, and was probably the most politically active during the reign of Bush I. I fundamentally disagreed with a number of policies of Reagan and Bush I, but I certainly didn't have the same inherent distrust and opposition to either of them. Similarly, I disagree with a some of policies of the Clinton and Obama administrations.

My political positions normally tend to be based on reason. Normally I can be swayed by facts and logic. During the previous administration, I retrospectively don't believe that I was entirely basing my opposition to it purely on facts and reason. Similarly, the most vitriolic opposition to the current administration is not largely based on facts and reason.

I was able to modulate my opinions about the former administration somewhat based on new information that has since been revealed. I suspect, however, that you may not be able to similarly modulate your opinions about this administration under any circumstances.

[TrainingDummy]

So since the group that is in line with your views now has power, you've reflected on your positions against the last administrations and decided they were over the top.

Unfortunately, Obama isn't a socialist.

[noodle]

Unfortunately, Obama isn't a socialist.

indeed. nor is he a communist. or that close to either one. it disheartens me greatly to see the process by which:

1) someone exaggerates to make a point.
2) people repeat the exaggeration
3) people forget that its an exaggeration due to the repetition and treat the exaggeration as fact.

this goes doubly for any people throwing "hitler" and "nazi" around as a convenient political trinket.

[Purple Fencer]

Unfortunately, Obama isn't a socialist.

Or any other "-ist" that has been applied to him.

I mean really....he's not giving a policy speech to 5th graders....he's telling them to stay in school.....that is a problem HOW, exactly??

[migopod]

Or any other "-ist" that has been applied to him.

I mean really....he's not giving a policy speech to 5th graders....he's telling them to stay in school.....that is a problem HOW, exactly??

It's a problem because Presiden Barack Obama is delivering the address.

Some people oppose it because they are fundamentally incapable of not opposing everything he does.

You hit the nail on the head with the taking a deep breath comment. I had the analogy in my head: If he were seen brushing his teeth, it would be described as an extreme left-wing political statement about oral hygiene and Glen Beck would have to denounce all tooth-brushing and flossing related treasonous acts.

edit: Also roving bands of gun-totin' teabaggers would start harassing dentists' offices within minutes.

[Slim]

Unfortunately, Obama isn't a socialist.

Time will tell.

[Hauptman]

Good one.


http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpu...gizes-for.html

Current Obama cabinet member "Green Czar" and self proclaimed..well, incase you missed it from the article:



No patterns here. Nope. Move along.

All I see is you changing the subject whenever anyone proves your previous assertions wrong. Is there ever an end to the ridiculous accusations?

It's very simple; Reagan gave a speech to the kids and no one had a problem... GHW Bush gave a speech to the kids and no one had a problem.... GW Bush gave a speech to the kids and again, no problem...

BUT Obama wants to give a speech to the kids and it's "unprecedented"..... riggghhhttt.....

Do you even understand the meaning of the word "hypocricy"?

[noodle]

Time will tell.

burden of proof fallacy.

[Gav]

Noodle

I often get the impression that a lot of those rabid right-wingers in your country have no idea what socialism is let alone what a socialist might do.

[Hauptman]

Noodle

I often get the impression that a lot of those rabid right-wingers in your country have no idea what socialism is let alone what a socialist might do.

You are absolutely correct.

[noodle]

Noodle

I often get the impression that a lot of those rabid right-wingers in your country have no idea what socialism is let alone what a socialist might do.

indeed. its a byproduct of the echo chamber produced by the increasingly rabid partisan politics going on in the US. another good example is the whole "obama isn't a citizen" stuff that happened before. despite providing all possible evidence to the contrary, there were and still are people who don't believe him to be an american citizen.

[migopod]

Noodle

I often get the impression that a lot of those rabid right-wingers in your country have no idea what socialism is let alone what a socialist might do.

Interestingly enough, if providing universal health care makes a country socialist, it means that contrary to post-cold war thinking, socialism is the dominant political system in the vast majority of developed countries.

I guess that means we Socialists won after all.

[jeff]

From the Uncyclopedia: http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/U...ctic_with_rage

[Inquartata]

Heh, speaking of echo chambers, you guys have got a nice one going here.

"No, he's not a socialist. You guys don't KNOW from socialists." Etc.

Really, we have no clear idea whether he is or is not. Politics is the art of the possible, and Obama is pursuing what he thinks is possible. Nationalizing great swaths of the economy completely and instituting cradle-to-grave social welfare programs ( much less true socialist policies ) are not possible, and he's not pursuing them; this does not prove that he would not like to do so if he could. It does not prove that he is not a socialist. The most that can be said is that it is not possible to prove that he is, either...

BTW, migopod, Obama himself now appears to be "listening to Cheney" on certain subjects, such as the value of "enhanced interrogation techniques". What are we to make of that?

[TrainingDummy]

indeed. its a byproduct of the echo chamber produced by the increasingly rabid partisan politics going on in the US. another good example is the whole "obama isn't a citizen" stuff that happened before. despite providing all possible evidence to the contrary, there were and still are people who don't believe him to be an american citizen.

Well, yeah, those people are stupid. MY problem with Obama is that he's a Muslim!

[Hauptman]

Heh, speaking of echo chambers, you guys have got a nice one going here.

"No, he's not a socialist. You guys don't KNOW from socialists." Etc.

Really, we have no clear idea whether he is or is not. Politics is the art of the possible, and Obama is pursuing what he thinks is possible. Nationalizing great swaths of the economy completely and instituting cradle-to-grave social welfare programs ( much less true socialist policies ) are not possible, and he's not pursuing them; this does not prove that he would not like to do so if he could. It does not prove that he is not a socialist. The most that can be said is that it is not possible to prove that he is, either...

BTW, migopod, Obama himself now appears to be "listening to Cheney" on certain subjects, such as the value of "enhanced interrogation techniques". What are we to make of that?

You must be kidding.... because he hasn't proved that he's NOT a socialist then it's ok to rant that he must be a socialist? Is that what you're really suggesting there? And we're all participating in group-think because we find that calling him a socialist, with absolutely no evidence, to be wrong?

Well, hell.... he must be a space alien then. There's nothing to suggest he's NOT a space alien.... in fact, that must be what the fake birth certificate is REALLY hiding!! OMG!!!!

[noodle]

Heh, speaking of echo chambers, you guys have got a nice one going here.

"No, he's not a socialist. You guys don't KNOW from socialists." Etc.

Really, we have no clear idea whether he is or is not. Politics is the art of the possible, and Obama is pursuing what he thinks is possible. Nationalizing great swaths of the economy completely and instituting cradle-to-grave social welfare programs ( much less true socialist policies ) are not possible, and he's not pursuing them; this does not prove that he would not like to do so if he could. It does not prove that he is not a socialist. The most that can be said is that it is not possible to prove that he is, either...

BTW, migopod, Obama himself now appears to be "listening to Cheney" on certain subjects, such as the value of "enhanced interrogation techniques". What are we to make of that?

i'd like to note that it was bush that nationalized great swaths of the economy via the almost $1trillion bank bailout.

does obama have some socialist leanings in his policy? yep. but so has every president, including reagan. obama leans more that way than most, sure.

but its fallacious to say that he is one or could be one despite denying being one and not shifting his politics to be in line with the party. perhaps we should arrest every american citizen, because they could be murderers, they just haven't killed anyone...YET.