USFA considering forcing members to use THS

[chris437]

If the USFA wants to undertake enforced membership fundraising, why not force the membership to sell cookies or Christmas wrap door to door?

This is also a bad idea. I would not do it even if I had the time to do so.

[teacup]

Getting more revenue from fencers using THS is great!! If THS is the best option then fencers will choose to use it. Especially if they are encouraged to do so and are made aware of the financial benefits that the USFA will receive from using them.

Unfortunately, forcing fencers to use THS will alienate and anger many people. Isn't the better approach to make THS the best option?

The if you built it they will come sort of approach.

[LordShout]

priceline makes a profit, even on the name your own price service.

Yes Yes, but I'm not being forced to use priceline.

[noodle]

Yes Yes, but I'm not being forced to use priceline.

yeah, but even if you were, they do what they do well, and you probably wouldn't have many other complaints besides "i'm forced to use them"

[Ionut]

It's unlikely they can get better prices then priceline name your own price. You might not get a hotel close to the venue but the price difference makes it up for it.

[slartibartfast]

It's unlikely they can get better prices then priceline name your own price. You might not get a hotel close to the venue but the price difference makes it up for it.

Geez. I would rather spend extra money to avoid having to rent a car and/or lug a fencing bag a mile to the venue. Makes a fencing trip much more like a real vacation. I've never understood why, if all my trips are fencing trips, I shouldn't treat myself a little.

[Joe biebel]

If the USFA were paying for my room, they should have some input. In the case of a paid (or in the case of the USFA, not paid referee), they can negotiate the place and the price, and that is fine. As a competitor, I don't want the USFA to have a lick of control over me, where I stay, or who I stay with. It's none of their business. You want me to stay in a certain place, make the deal, so good, I won't want to refuse. And if I do refuse, I have to get their permission or I can't play? It's time to get out the torches and storm the castle.

Once the "competition" is successfully removed, I'm sure the prices will go way down, and they'll be able to give us even better service. Anytime someone "must" use a particular company or service, that's called a monopoly. The odds of getting ripped off increase dramatically, and service will likely take a hit as well. I guess the thing that bothers me the most about the idea, is the whole idea of an organization I belong to "forcing" my cooperation. No faster way to lose customers than to make doing business with you odious.

If THS were the best option, I would use them again. I can figure it out all on my own. Since they seem to rarely be the best option, the best move for them is get someone (or something) to give them a monopoly. USFA, stay out of this. If THS wants my business they can earn it just like everyone else.

[slartibartfast]

Once the "competition" is successfully removed, I'm sure the prices will go way down, and they'll be able to give us even better service. Anytime someone "must" use a particular company or service, that's called a monopoly. The odds of getting ripped off increase dramatically, and service will likely take a hit as well.

Yeh, like Bell Telephone and Blue Cross/Blue Shield and all those monopolies that needed to be broken up so we could save money and get better service . . . oh. Never mind.

[Morale Officer]

Geez. I would rather spend extra money to avoid having to rent a car and/or lug a fencing bag a mile to the venue. Makes a fencing trip much more like a real vacation. I've never understood why, if all my trips are fencing trips, I shouldn't treat myself a little.

Unfortunately, not all of us can afford to "treat ourselves a little." I can't afford to fly to tournaments (not to mention that I'm terrified of flying). I only stayed overnight at one tournament so far, and even then, I split the cost of the hotel room with a friend (she booked with hotels.com or something) and her daughter (I ended up paying like $30). I would rather Carpool to a tournament, share a $60 room, eat a $5 sub, and maybe have to stay a little farther away to save myself some money than be forced to stay at a "participating hotel" and eat at a "participating restaurant" and pay more. Now, I understand that the talk is with waivers and what-not, but honestly, I think it's going to be more trouble than it's worth. I understand that there is potential money savings for the USFA, but honestly I have to think about MY finances and what is affordable for ME. Waivers or not, I definitely DO NOT agree with the "book with THS or you can't fence" attitude.

[Bannor]

So if I decide to stay with friends or relatives who reside in the competition city, I need a waiver? How can they enforce this?

[darius]

If THS were the best option, I would use them again.

That's basically it. I've stayed in THS-booked rooms maybe 1/2-dozen times during my competitive/coaching career, and that was always because I just let parents book ... 2 times out of those 6, we had extreme hassles on the other side. Nothing like finding out, when you've gotten in at midnight with a 7am start, that your 2 Queen room is 1 King, they've overbooked everything else, rollaway beds are prohibited by fire code ... and you're travelling with a student.

Despite our visibility, our club has a VERY tight budget. By rocking fare sales and staying at Econolodges, figuring out the furthest walkable hotel from any venue or the viability of renting a car, we've managed to stay within that, and we try to inform our fencers about the same deals -- 8 NWFC coaches/athletes were sleeping in 2 suites at Nationals!

Anything that forces us, or our fencers to pay a single cent more, screws with our bottom line. We shouldn't have to do the research and then beg THS permission, especially given how many stories there are about THS prices being suboptimal, or not getting timely information back. Make it a price-match guarantee where they'll make up the difference, and I'll happily stay wherever, but otherwise, why would I trust their pricing structures more than the resources I've already found?

darius

[fdad]

We shouldn't have to do the research and then beg THS permission, especially given how many stories there are about THS prices being suboptimal, or not getting timely information back. Make it a price-match guarantee where they'll make up the difference, and I'll happily stay wherever, but otherwise, why would I trust their pricing structures more than the resources I've already found?

Price match usually is based on publicly advertised/available rates. I am frequently able to get cheaper rates through my employee discount than anything publicly advertised.

Perhaps a small financial incentive such as a discount on registration if you book a room thru USFA/THS would work, but forcing me to tell USFA/THS where I plan to sleep and how much I plan to pay for it will not.

[Joe biebel]

I have not seen a lot of "fan" letters for THS. I'm sure there are some and certainly people will make themselves heard more if there is a problem, but is this really the best we can do?

Instead of giving THS a monopoly, (and I do mean "Give", since they have not earned it) why not cancel them for non-performance and start over.

Occassionally, one of my vendors will instigate a policy that is not in my best interest, they become "ex-vendors". The USFA (if your a fencer looking to compete on the national/international level) has a monopoly. I can not take my NAC and nationals experiences elsewhere. My suggestion to them is to charge more for the entry fees, etc. Do not "act" like you have a monopoly and be the 500 pound Gorilla in the room. What the USFA has probably been asking themselves given the current monetary situation is: Can they do it? What I think they should be asking themselves is: Should they do it?

[tbryan]

The USFA (if your a fencer looking to compete on the national/international level) has a monopoly. I can not take my NAC and nationals experiences elsewhere.

If this policy is ratified, I wonder whether more fencers will skip NACs and instead take their fencing vacations to other large events, such as the Duel in the Desert, the Crescent City Open, the Cherry Blossom, etc.

[seak]

I would really prefer entry fee prices not be raised. Even under the new THS scheme, using the waiver process (and lets face it the fact that I ref the NAC's I fence in) I can offset hotel costs. I can't offset registration costs. Raising registration costs would have a more direct and larger negative impact on those fencers who are paying their own way and don't have decent amounts of discretionary income, then this THS plan.

Reading this thread is causing me to think that fencers and THS have irreconcilable differences that probably wont even be fixed through serious counseling.

[hello?]

Geez. I would rather spend extra money to avoid having to rent a car and/or lug a fencing bag a mile to the venue. Makes a fencing trip much more like a real vacation. I've never understood why, if all my trips are fencing trips, I shouldn't treat myself a little.

This is precisely the point, I think. While I agree with you, many people don't. That's why some of us stay at venue hotels, some don't. Also, not everyone can afford to stay at the place they'd really want to stay (you can afford to treat yourself a little -- some people can barely afford to get there and fence). My understanding is that THS will now offer more options to take care of everyone's tastes/budgets. So we'll see....It also sounds like this was pretty much decided already -- THS has to already be in negotiations with the hotels for next season. I am encouraged by the fact that the program won't be totally mandatory the first year, although I am wondering how that can possibly work. How do you test how well it will work to make THS mandatory (thereby increasing their negotiating power) without making THS mandatory (therefore not giving them more negotiating power)? But the USFA has decided that this will work, so they must know better. Right?

[jessicasimpson]

and service will likely take a hit as well.

Service could get worse? Is that even possible?

[Allen Evans]

The prospect of having your NAC or Nationals entry cancelled because of an error on THS's part or an error in the communication between THS and the USFA is the most troubling aspect of this. This adds an entirely new dimension to the coordination between the USFA and THS with serious implications when a failure occurs in that coordination.

Unfortunately (as my day job is proving to me every day) implementations of new systems results in the need for previously unexplored and unimagined cooperation and communication, sometimes between systems and processes that haven't had to do so before. The result is often a long shaking out period. It's easy enough to address when we're talking about numbers on a ledger, it's not so easy when we're talking about someone flying across the country only to find that they aren't going to be allowed to fence because of a clerical error.

AE

[peet]

The prospect of having your NAC or Nationals entry cancelled because of an error on THS's part or an error in the communication between THS and the USFA is the most troubling aspect of this. This adds an entirely new dimension to the coordination between the USFA and THS with serious implications when a failure occurs in that coordination.

Unfortunately (as my day job is proving to me every day) implementations of new systems results in the need for previously unexplored and unimagined cooperation and communication, sometimes between systems and processes that haven't had to do so before. The result is often a long shaking out period. It's easy enough to address when we're talking about numbers on a ledger, it's not so easy when we're talking about someone flying across the country only to find that they aren't going to be allowed to fence because of a clerical error.

AE

QFMFT!

-p

[parrythis]

I don't see why this should be such a major issue for everyone.

If I want to stay in a Hilton, or a Red Roof, or a NoTell Motel, it is nobody's business but mine.

Other groups do this and it saves both individuals and their organizations a great deal of money.

I have ALWAYS found hotels cheaper than than THS offers without even trying hard.

And from what I've read, waivers are available and do not appear to be a problem.

ARGH!!! The last thing anyone wants is more paperwork that can get fouled up!

Just a few weeks ago there were many people on here complaining that all of the THS rooms at the Gaylord were sold out.

Yet another in a LONG string of incidents that suggests that THS is not an organization that I want to do business with.

They said that THS would find and make available more rooms, a wider price range, etc.

But will the price range be wide enough to accommodate my dirt-cheap needs? I doubt it.

I, for one, am looking foward to at least giving this a try!

I, for one, am not.

If the USFA implemented this it would override what little incentive I have to attend NACs, Nationals, etc.

Sometimes I drive distances considerably further than what someone might judge to be "in the area". Am I willing to allow someone else to dictate that I have to get a hotel or a waiver? I am not.

This is easy...

No.

.....Really, No!

............Hell No!!!