USFA considering forcing members to use THS

[hello?]

Originally Posted by CMiner

If the highlighted part means that if I get a waiver if I can reserve a room through Priceline for less than what THS will offer, than I no longer have a problem with this program.
.

Except you wouldn't know what the Priceline rate would be until you commited to it, right? If THS THEN matches it, what do you do with the Priceline reservation you have signed up for but can't cancel?

[ladyofshalott99]

I think our mutual dismay is present because of several things: 1) the idea of staying at the venue hotel being a 'requirement'; 2) lack of a cost-benefit analysis indicating how the USFA has come to the conclusion it has; and 3) all of us coming out of the Gaylord a lot poorer than we expected (even for those of us who made up cost-breakdown sheets before we even left, like I did )

Perhaps we need a petition, or at least a breakdown sheet distributed to Division Officers explaining the proposal, so that we may take it to our constituent fencers and let them decide for themselves what they want to do.

So. I am trying to think about this logically, and give the USFA the benefit of the doubt. I think it's great that the National Office is trying to do something to lower cost for fencers and their families who are trying to attend Nationals at lower cost and less of an inconvenience (with respect to getting around town, being stuck in traffic on the way to the venue, etc.).

However, I'm really stuck on the word "Requirement", and I think that that's what everyone else is as well. I think that, paired with the sub-par service history of THS--who lost half of my reservation at the Gaylord, btw--is what is making everyone angry.

I think I may <sleep on it, calm down, and> write a polite letter to Christine asking, on the behalf of my Division, what the projected cost-benefit analysis states with respect to past and current reservations; whether this would impact the registration fees at events; and what amenities such a proposal would include. I would also inquire as to whether it would be possible for the USFA to AVOID THS ENTIRELY and negotiate directly with the individual hotels. (It would also be beneficial for the USFA to negotiate a discount with an airline that does not charge extra fees for fencing bags.).

Had a whole lot of other stuff posted about why it personally makes me angry, but then I'd have to start thinking about the cost of the Gaylord, and I'm really trying to let that anger go.

[teacup]

Will non US fencers at NAC's, such as Canadians, be forced to use THS?

[occasionalfencer]

Originally Posted by ladyofshalott99

Had a whole lot of other stuff posted about why it personally makes me angry, but then I'd have to start thinking about the cost of the Gaylord, and I'm really trying to let that anger go.

This is a situation where your anger could do some good. Post please. The last thing we want is for the past mistakes of the THS just to get hidden away.

By the way, I have no doubt that the cost/benefit analysis will look good on paper.

[pillow]

Originally Posted by teacup

Will non US fencers at NAC's, such as Canadians, be forced to use THS?

Canadians will use La (or is it Le?) THS.

[teacup]

Originally Posted by pillow

Canadians will use La (or is it Le?) THS.

Only those Canadians from Quebec.

Mexicans, El THS?

[Redblade]

Originally Posted by ladyofshalott99

I think our mutual dismay is present because of several things: 1) the idea of staying at the venue hotel being a 'requirement'; 2) lack of a cost-benefit analysis indicating how the USFA has come to the conclusion it has; and 3) all of us coming out of the Gaylord a lot poorer than we expected.

Ditto. And regarding the third point, even those of us who didn't stay at the Gaylord were soaked with parking fees.

[gatun.czone]

Originally Posted by silver2e

Both links go to the waiver document. How does one find the overview page?

This is now fixed. It is a 27 page PDF that looks like it was taken from a powerpoint presentation.

Nannette

[DLEE]

Originally Posted by ladyofshalott99

So. I am trying to think about this logically, and give the USFA the benefit of the doubt. I think it's great that the National Office is trying to do something to lower cost for fencers and their families who are trying to attend Nationals at lower cost and less of an inconvenience (with respect to getting around town, being stuck in traffic on the way to the venue, etc.).
.

It seems pretty clear that the intent of the USFA is not to lower the cost for fencers but to increase revenue for the USFA.

In my view there are better ways to achieve that goal.

[dberke]

Originally Posted by Redblade

Ditto. And regarding the third point, even those of us who didn't stay at the Gaylord were soaked with parking fees.

Well now, let's be fair - nearly every venue that I've been to with a car over the past 9 years charges upwards of $8/day for parking. At least with the Gaylord, if you learned the secret of getting the validation, you could escape that fee.

I factor in the cost of parking when doing my cost analysis.

Dan

[edew]

Originally Posted by Redblade

Ditto. And regarding the third point, even those of us who didn't stay at the Gaylord were soaked with parking fees.

You could have avoided the parking fees by getting soaked at the bar.

[edew]

Originally Posted by dberke

Well now, let's be fair - nearly every venue that I've been to with a car over the past 9 years charges upwards of $8/day for parking. At least with the Gaylord, if you learned the secret of getting the validation, you could escape that fee.

I factor in the cost of parking when doing my cost analysis.

Dan

Yup. The San Jose SN was $15/day (basically, although if you got knocked out early and didn't stick around, it could be as low as $8). There weren't any way to get validation, as far as I can tell.

[MHS Fencer]

The slide presentation indicates that THS has handled more than 92% of reservations correctly last year. Let's give them the rounding benefit of the doubt - this means that they mishandled 7% of reservations! One in fourteen times people had problems. And we're increasing their responsbility? ****.

If you attend every national event using THS, then you have a 56% chance of not having a problem, under the present system. In other words, about half of people will get ****ed. Now let's increase the strain on the system by a factor of 60-100% (using the USAV cited numbers) - don't tell me that there's some magical, not-yet-in-place system that's going to eliminate problems or that the upscaling in workload isn't going to create problems - THS was pitched as just that in the first place, lest we forget. "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me - you can't get fooled again..." unless, apparently, you're the USFA.

[KidLazy]

Darth THS: Yes, Admiral?

Admiral USFA: Our staffs have sighted fencers, Lord. But they are staying in cheaper and/or higher quality hotels with better services and we can not risk...

Darth THS: Price, quality, and services do not concern me, Admiral. I want their money, not reasons to be competitive.



How do I get people to start a protest by boycotting all national events until this policy is no more?

[flechewounds]

Brad, et al -

One of the challenges with this program has been information - or lack thereof. I know from a number of private conversations that there are board members who are unhappy about this program, but I'm also confident (anecdotal evidence, prior board experience, etc.) that there is strong social pressure not to "rock the boat." (this is one of the reasons that I'm not the world's greatest board member - I have little problem rocking the boat).

From my perspective, however, the board needs to be far more active in dealing with this program. Unlike location and venue selection - or even e-registration - Stay and Pay represents a fundamental shift in the relationship between USFA management and its membership. Kurt is, in effect, trying to insert itself into our bedroom and direct choices for us that are unrelated to the sport of fencing. In my opinion, this type of program is above Kurt's pay grade and requires close, careful board consideration. You guys can't "mail it in" on this one - and I'd argue that doing so may be an actionable breach of your fiduciary duty to the membership.

As one who has take a very vocal role in this issue, I have faced withering criticism from several board members for (a) using my industry knowledge to hypothesize about the program, (b) then looking at an analogous program at US Volleyball and hypothesizing about the program, (c) then reading (apparently too carefully) the PowerPoint circulated by Kurt and drawing conclusions about the program from USFA materials (logo and all), and (d) then reading the actual details posted by the USFA on its web site and drawing conclusions about the program (I was even told by a board member yesterday that the materials were in error and that the revised materials would be posted today). I would expect that the mantra would now be "wait and see the great hotels offered by the program - you'll never want to use Priceline again."

Whether the USFA management likes it or not, it has a deep hole to dig itself out of. You may not be guilty of the sins of the past, but you are stuck with its legacy. About the only indication that management recognizes this is the attempt to capitalize on Christine's goodwill to shove this down our throats.

Face it, even if this program fails miserably and is terminated, it is the membership that suffers the ultimate harm. We will be stuck with room commitments for the year or two after termination. Kurt will move onto a bigger sport, highlighting his "successful income generating program" (and conveniently ignoring the fact that the membership wants his scalp) - and we'll be stuck with this potentially disastrous legacy. After all, if the USFA guarantees a city 6,000 rooms, but only 4,000 show up, who pays? Answer - the USFA (not THS, not Kurt). The USFA will be forced to require compliance - whether it is THS or SH*T or someone's brother-in-law acting as the agent. That is the dirty little (ok, dirty big) secret behind this program.

Feel free to call me alarmist, petulant or any of a number of other, less savory adjectives. However, anyone who looks at this thing objectively recognizes the problem... it's pretty obvious. And no one - not Kurt, not Christine, not the board - is addressing these issues. Why? Because they are, in fact, not addressable. I'm not yelling "fire" in a theater - I'm yelling "fire" in the middle of a burning building. There is a major difference.

Again - Stay and Pay is a major change in the way the USFA relates to its membership. It needs real adult supervision. Please, for your own good and the good of the membership, pull this up to the level that it needs to be - and then kill it before it consumes what little reservoir of goodwill the management has re-earned. I don't think it is in anyone's best interest to have the membership pining for the good old days of the Anderson/Massik administration.

USFA OUT OF OUR BEDROOMS - NOW!

[flechewounds]

Originally Posted by KidLazy

Darth THS: Yes, Admiral?

Admiral USFA: Our staffs have sighted fencers, Lord. But they are staying in cheaper and/or higher quality hotels with better services and we can not risk...

Darth THS: Price, quality, and services do not concern me, Admiral. I want their money, not reasons to be competitive.



How do I get people to start a protest by boycotting all national events until this policy is no more?

Kid - I'm hoping against hope that Captain Kirk (of Priceline) comes in and phasers this thing to death...

[pillow]

Has even one member of f.net gotten a response back from Christine or Kurt about this yet?

[noodle]

Originally Posted by KidLazy

Darth THS: Yes, Admiral?

Admiral USFA: Our staffs have sighted fencers, Lord. But they are staying in cheaper and/or higher quality hotels with better services and we can not risk...

Darth THS: Price, quality, and services do not concern me, Admiral. I want their money, not reasons to be competitive.



How do I get people to start a protest by boycotting all national events until this policy is no more?

i will give out my address if anyone wants to use my address as a protest for next SN. i think they might get the hint if 100 waivers for one address come in.

[Morale Officer]

Originally Posted by pillow

Has even one member of f.net gotten a response back from Christine or Kurt about this yet?

Not me.

[Mr Epee]

I haven't read this thread, but a cursory review of the situation, as it currently stands, leaves me with the following impressions.

A) This is much ado about nothing.

B) This program is simply illegal and can safely be ignored.

What I do feel comfortable asking is it time to revisit the "100 DAY'S PROMISES" of the current Executive Committee made during their election bid?

I don't get the impression that services promised represent services delivered.