Team order: Is the personal coin flip really necessary?

[Redblade]

Is it really necessary to call up both team captains to participate in a coin toss to determine which side gets the 1-2-3 order and which has 4-5-6, and to have both of them on hand to fill out their orders at the same time?

"You're team A; you know already who you're facing on team B in the DE bracket. ... So what's your teammate fencing order?"

Seemed like a lot of trouble and energy wasted on what could have been a very simple system.

[bbower]

But you need the captains there to fill out the lineup regardless. So flipping for choice of side isn't adding that much more time to the process.

[Warrior Princess]

Aren't the captains not allowed to see the bout order for the others (who's which number)?

[Redblade]

But you need the captains there to fill out the lineup regardless. So flipping for choice of side isn't adding that much more time to the process.

It is not necessary for both captains to be present at the same time. They need only know whether they're turning in a roster for team A (1-2-3) or team B (4-5-6), and who they're fencing. So waiting for the captains, going through the coin flip, and setting a roster at the site does add time and messiness to the process overall.

[peet]

It is not necessary for both captains to be present at the same time. They need only know whether they're turning in a roster for team A (1-2-3) or team B (4-5-6), and who they're fencing. So waiting for the captains, going through the coin flip, and setting a roster at the site does add time and messiness to the process overall.

I'll bet some folks believe that having both captains there adds transparency to the process to keep everyone satisfied that it is fair WRT the small advantage that comes from being B team.

[Namir]

Aren't the captains not allowed to see the bout order for the others (who's which number)?

No, captains are not supposed to see the other teams order, that whould give the later captain an obvious advantage

[Inquartata]

I'll bet some folks believe that having both captains there adds transparency to the process to keep everyone satisfied that it is fair WRT the small advantage that comes from being B team.

That can't be right, I am reliably informed that the USFA does not believe in the concept of transparency...

[Redblade]

I'll bet some folks believe that having both captains there adds transparency to the process to keep everyone satisfied that it is fair WRT the small advantage that comes from being B team.

What is the small advantage?

[oiuyt]

What is the small advantage?

The 6th bout is Team B's anchor, whereas Team A's anchor has his/her second encounter in the 5th slot. Having your anchor go later can be an advantage, assuming that s/he is your best fencer.

There are other considerations in constructing a team order than "best fencer last, next best penultimate bout, other fencer 7th", which can result in other orders and Team A or Team B may be preferably in those cases. And frequently those considerations go quickly, wildly off into the land of over-thinking, diminishing returns, and complete meaninglessness.

Note that in non-relay formats which is preferable between Team A and Team B gets even more complicated as there can be even more considerations. And again quickly off into the wilds.

-B