Fencing @Di$ney

[Mo]

We heard rumors so we called, it seems that to watch fencing at Di$ney, a spectator has to pay a "small amount". To Di$ney, 9 dollars a day on top of the entry fees and hotel and other things you pay, is just peachy.
How annoying....

[veeco]

Originally posted by Mo
We heard rumors so we called, it seems that to watch fencing at Di$ney, a spectator has to pay a "small amount". To Di$ney, 9 dollars a day on top of the entry fees and hotel and other things you pay, is just peachy.
How annoying....

If some of those 9 dollars go towards either the USFA or enhancing the viewers experience, I don't see why it should not be done.

On the other hand, I sure hope that they won't ask fencers to pay to get in, or to see other fencing events on the days that they are not fencing.

I guess I'll have to wait and see what the result is. The previous NACs were definitely not spectator friendly, if those 9 dollars a head make this NAC spectator friendly, then I don't think that there should be any reason to complain about it.

[Mo]

Veeco:

It's our understanding that the money goes directly in Mickey's pocket. It is simply a price of admission to get into the venue as a non competitor.

Surely someone else on the board has been to a previous Disney-sponsored fencing event and can shed some light on whether it's an "enhanced" spectator experience for the money, or merely an "enhanced" revenue stream for Disney stockholders.

Either way, its an enhanced pain in the wallet for us parents/chaperones.

Mr. Mo

[Mo]

Mo,

Thank you for your inquiry. There is a spectator charge for the North American Cup Youth Cadet tournament. Daily tickets and length of events are available.

Daily admission tickets are $9.75 for adults and children ages 10 & older. Daily admission tickets for children ages 3 to 9 are $7.50. A length of event ticket is $24.75 for adults and for children ages 10 & older.

A length of event ticket for children ages 3 to 9 are $17.25. The length of event ticket covers all 4 days of the tournament. Daily admission tickets and length of event tickets can be purchased at Disney's Wide World of Sports box office.

Thank you and have a great day.

Sincerely,
Robin Bizub
Disney Sports Travel

Read it and weep....

[Inquartata]

I noticed that, too. Normally it wouldn't matter to me, but after t---er, a lot of years of fencing coincidence would have it that both my brother and his family AND my boss and his are going to be at Disneyworld at that time and now want to come and watch me. What timing!

Coaches, I understand, can get "credentials", but family and friends must all pay the Disney multi-part tariffs. In the words of Bulldog from "Frasier": "This SUCKS! This is TOTAL B.S!"

I also understand that we will have to submit to bag searches for security purposes. Given the capacious nature of fencing bags, their typical contents and the number of entrants, you might want to bring a folding chair for waiting in line to get in...

Whose clever idea was it to hold an event under these circumstances? Someone at the USFA a major Disney stockholder, maybe?

[afc fencer]

I went to the youth nac held there a few years ago. The venue is located inside a sports complex. The sports complex contains a few baseball fields and basketball courts ect. You pay the nine dollars to get inside the sports complex not the building where the fencing takes place.
The thing that really sucks is they dont let people who arent fencing on to the floor. They keep them in a balconey that over looks the fencing area. It is not spectator friendly at all.

[veeco]

Originally posted by afc fencer

The thing that really sucks is they dont let people who arent fencing on to the floor. They keep them in a balconey that over looks the fencing area. It is not spectator friendly at all.

Actually, I think it is spectator friendly:

- They have a place to sit down, and won't get their seats taken (rightfully so, I might add) by fencers

- They get to see all the action from a much better angle

- They don't hear the coaches yelling at them because they are in their line of sight.

[veeco]

Originally posted by Mo
Mo,

Thank you for your inquiry. There is a spectator charge for the North American Cup Youth Cadet tournament. Daily tickets and length of events are available.

Daily admission tickets are $9.75 for adults and children ages 10 & older. Daily admission tickets for children ages 3 to 9 are $7.50. A length of event ticket is $24.75 for adults and for children ages 10 & older.

A length of event ticket for children ages 3 to 9 are $17.25. The length of event ticket covers all 4 days of the tournament. Daily admission tickets and length of event tickets can be purchased at Disney's Wide World of Sports box office.

Thank you and have a great day.

Sincerely,
Robin Bizub
Disney Sports Travel

Read it and weep....

Doesn't say if the USFA gets a share of the money or not, though it could be implied that it didn't, since they are saying that the tickets should be bought at the _Disney_ Wide World of Sports box office.

I think that coaches should be given credentials, and that's normal, but I would certainly think that someone smart would have proposed that each fencer gets the possiblity to give a free full event pass to one person who's not the coach.

-> It would allow fencers to have their family with them in the venue (even if they are not on the floor, they can still watch).

-> It still allows Disney or whoever is behind this make money of of the people who want to watch what seems like is going to be a poorly organized DivII/DivIII/Cadet event.

[epeemike81]

Originally posted by Mo
Mo,

Thank you for your inquiry. There is a spectator charge for the North American Cup Youth Cadet tournament. Daily tickets and length of events are available.

Daily admission tickets are $9.75 for adults and children ages 10 & older. Daily admission tickets for children ages 3 to 9 are $7.50. A length of event ticket is $24.75 for adults and for children ages 10 & older.

A length of event ticket for children ages 3 to 9 are $17.25. The length of event ticket covers all 4 days of the tournament. Daily admission tickets and length of event tickets can be purchased at Disney's Wide World of Sports box office.

Thank you and have a great day.

Sincerely,
Robin Bizub
Disney Sports Travel

Read it and weep....

Ah, but that is the price we pay to have a good, cheap venue somewhere where it doesn't snow.

-m

[epeemike81]

Originally posted by veeco
Doesn't say if the USFA gets a share of the money or not, though it could be implied that it didn't, since they are saying that the tickets should be bought at the _Disney_ Wide World of Sports box office.

the USFA's share comes in the fact that they are prob. paying very little for the venue. the deal is, they pay next to nothing for the venue, Disney gets to keep the Spec. fees and gets business for their resort hotels.

win win for USFA and Disney, and maybe a win for the fencers. depends on your priorities. if you like the idea of holding NACs somewhere where there are other major attractions and a slightly larger chance of spectators, then it is a good thing for the fencers.

also, lets put this in perspective:
Price for a full day of spectating: $9.75

Price for a 2 hour movie: $8.75
Price for a three hour baseball game: $18 (cheapest seats)

This is not the major expediture y'all are making it out to be!

-m

[afc fencer]

Actually, I think it is spectator friendly:

- They have a place to sit down, and won't get their seats taken (rightfully so, I might add) by fencers

- They get to see all the action from a much better angle

- They don't hear the coaches yelling at them because they are in their line of sight.

At the disney venue I found it hard to see all the strips well.
Other venues have had balconey areas and very few people take advantage of them.

Price for a three hour baseball game: $18 (cheapest seats)

Woah thats real coastly in atl its $8 for the cheapest postseason tickets

[veeco]

Originally posted by epeemike81
the USFA's share comes in the fact that they are prob. paying very little for the venue. the deal is, they pay next to nothing for the venue, Disney gets to keep the Spec. fees and gets business for their resort hotels.

win win for USFA and Disney, and maybe a win for the fencers. depends on your priorities. if you like the idea of holding NACs somewhere where there are other major attractions and a slightly larger chance of spectators, then it is a good thing for the fencers.

also, lets put this in perspective:
Price for a full day of spectating: $9.75

Price for a 2 hour movie: $8.75
Price for a three hour baseball game: $18 (cheapest seats)

This is not the major expediture y'all are making it out to be!

-m

The problem is not that it's a major expenditure. The problem is that the prices are raised for people going into the tournament, for no apparent good reason.

If as you said the USFA pays less for the venue and that these savings are passed on to the accompanying parties of the fencers, and the fencers in some way (better venue, more spectator friendly events, better paid referees, finals on raised strip with curtain backdrop with slow-mo, commentators, or whatever) then that's totally commendable. Otherwise it's just plain exploitation, and it's actually bad publicity for fencing, because the people who are not accompanying fencers will be upset to have paid even 9 bucks for a poor spectacle.

If you pay 8 bucks for a bad 2 hours movie, do you pay another 8 bucks to go and watch it again? I think not.

With the same reasoning, people who have not seen fencing before and paid 9 bucks to watch a non-spectator friendly tournament will be very likely not to pay again to watch fencing. Is that what we want?

[epeemike81]

Originally posted by afc fencer
Woah thats real coastly in atl its $8 for the cheapest postseason tickets

True, Boston is costly for baseball tickets:

$7 for general admission (available to servicemen)
$18 for Standing Room and Upper Bleacher
$20 for Lower Bleacher
$25 for Right field Grandstand
$30 for Infield Grandstand
$40 for Upper Box and Right Field Roof
$60 for Lower Box and Infield Roof Box
$200 for dugout box (the front two rows of infield lower box)
however, even with $8 tickets, the point still applies: $8 for 3 hours vs. 9.75 for ~8 hours. clearly, this is NOT a huge fee.

-m

[epeemike81]

Originally posted by veeco
The problem is not that it's a major expenditure. The problem is that the prices are raised for people going into the tournament, for no apparent good reason.

If as you said the USFA pays less for the venue and that these savings are passed on to the accompanying parties of the fencers, and the fencers in some way (better venue, more spectator friendly events, better paid referees, finals on raised strip with curtain backdrop with slow-mo, commentators, or whatever) then that's totally commendable. Otherwise it's just plain exploitation, and it's actually bad publicity for fencing, because the people who are not accompanying fencers will be upset to have paid even 9 bucks for a poor spectacle.

If you pay 8 bucks for a bad 2 hours movie, do you pay another 8 bucks to go and watch it again? I think not.

With the same reasoning, people who have not seen fencing before and paid 9 bucks to watch a non-spectator friendly tournament will be very likely not to pay again to watch fencing. Is that what we want?

It seems like the USFA can't win with the folks on this board... If they hold it in Saratoga Springs in Winter, it is cheap, and free for spectators, but it is in the middle of nowhere and you risk snow, and you all complain about the snow and location.

they put it in a prime location and you all complain that they want to charge a nominal admission to spectators.....

You cannot eat your cake and have it too.

As to the movie thing, I wouldn't pay another 8 bucks to see the same movie, good or bad. Also, I have seen many bad movies, but still go to OTHER movies. one bad experience will NOT dissuade any but the most tenuous spectators. Odds are, if they have enough interest to pay the 9 bucks, they will enjoy the experience.

-m

[Inquartata]

Originally posted by epeemike81

You cannot eat your cake and have it too.

Sure you can! ( Cough ) Palm Springs ( cough ).

Even as a fencer myself, I would not pay to go watch Div II/III level fencing. Especially not "from the balcony".

As to the cheap-venue angle, someone with inside info may correct me if they know different, but I suspect that Disney doesn't make ANYTHING available "cheap". They are known for squeezing every penny until it hollers....

[epeemike81]

Originally posted by Inquartata
As to the cheap-venue angle, someone with inside info may correct me if they know different, but I suspect that Disney doesn't make ANYTHING available "cheap". They are known for squeezing every penny until it hollers....

In case you haven't noticed, USFA is not rich. If they are holding it at Disney, they are getting a deal. As I said, the advantage to Disney is that they get extra revenues from lodging, food, entertainment. Trust me: if the USFA weren't getting a sweet deal on the venue, the NAC wouldn't be held there, because they could get a sweet deal somewhere else.

-m

[Inquartata]

I dunno, Mike, that sounds awfully like an assumption based on little more than intuition to me...

But be it so---you notice that the entry fees just went up rather sharply this year? I daresay that the USFA is not sending its officers out to beg on streetcorners. Of course, I'm sure they'd rather spend the extra revenue on referees, officials, elite travel and "performance rewards" than on fencers, so maybe you're right after all. All I know is that Disney has this well-earned reputation for holding people upside down and shaking them so that every last dime falls out of their pockets. The concept of "We can make enough money on angles A, B and C so we'll let D go" has probably not much appeal to them...

[epeemike81]

Originally posted by Inquartata
I dunno, Mike, that sounds awfully like an assumption based on little more than intuition to me...

But be it so---you notice that the entry fees just went up rather sharply this year? I daresay that the USFA is not sending its officers out to beg on streetcorners. Of course, I'm sure they'd rather spend the extra revenue on referees, officials, elite travel and "performance rewards" than on fencers, so maybe you're right after all. All I know is that Disney has this well-earned reputation for holding people upside down and shaking them so that every last dime falls out of their pockets. The concept of "We can make enough money on angles A, B and C so we'll let D go" has probably not much appeal to them...

But the people Disney is shaking up and down, as you have noted, are the fencers. they are going to make their revenues in lodging, food, and entertainment (after all, while down there, many of the fencers will go to the parks). the tourney is an attraction for these hundreds of people, and the fee they would get on the venue is peanuts. In scenario 1, Disney charges a large fee for the venue, USFA goes elsewhere, Disney gains nothing. Scenario 2, Disney gives the venue to us, and makes piles of money on the ansillaries. I think their choice is clear.

call it intuition if you like, but at every other event, the USFA has gotten a very cheap or free venue.

I would like to reiterate my point that the USFA can do no good in the minds of people on this board. The fees are VERY necessary for the costs of a NAC. remember that the USFA must pay for whatever the venue costs (not much, as discussed), the airline tickets for all of the officials, the lodging for all officials, lunch (and sometimes dinner) for all officials, the actual pay for officials, pay for all the armorers, etc., etc. .....

-m

[Mo]

Originally posted by epeemike81
Ah, but that is the price we pay to have a good, cheap venue somewhere where it doesn't snow.

-m

Epee Mike, I just noticed on all the other posts I've made that you have to respond with some semi snarky comment.
Get over it.
I noticed when someone said Saber is better than foil or Epee, you said "they are half right, it is better than foil"
So what is the difference??
I made a comment about Epee you make one about foil so now you stalk my posts and use childish inuendo?
Everyone on here thinks their weapon is best and makes light of other people's weapons. Haven't you noticed??
This venue is anything but cheap. The rooms are 120 bucks a night. No food is allowed in, you cannot be near the strips with the kids in case they need something or their weapons break. A body cord replacement??
I wonder what kind of ransom the venders had to pay. There is also a hurricane headed for the Gulf coast right now. The second in a week.
Right....