Ratings Connundrum

[occasionalfencer]

JAG: Maybe fencing just isn't for you or your son.

(Sounds like his son can fence, so maybe fencing IS for his son, but perhaps he needs to let his son do the fencing.)

Talk to some of the parents and coaches of fencers who HAVE achieved the level you want for your son. Find out if they did all this nit picking in the early days. Seriously. Let us know what you find out.

[mrbiggs]

Says who?

Apparently not the USFA's Operations Manual.

It's been discussed before on this forum. It might be tricky to find, though.


Long story short, I've been to a round robin that gave out classifications. In fact, I've been to a number of them at two different clubs in two different divisions. So Operations Manual or no, it's possible to get classifications at a round robin.

[fdad]

It's been discussed before on this forum. It might be tricky to find, though.

Long story short, I've been to a round robin that gave out classifications. In fact, I've been to a number of them at two different clubs in two different divisions. So Operations Manual or no, it's possible to get classifications at a round robin.

Well, I have no doubt that more than a few events got sanctioned that violated some rule but slipped under the radar. I think in this case there is no rule against round robin.

[JAG]

It's always fun to see an old thread given new life by those who come upon it later and decide to offer their views without reading what came before them. I completely agree that there has been a great deal of wisdom offered by the responses, which have gone in many different directions since the beginning. I've come to see how thoughtful and helpful some are, and how some suffer from the Dunning-Kruger Effect.

Some have disagreed with my concerns, but tried to be helpful about it. Some have argued that my concerns are legitimate, and as long as ratings and seeding exists, they should be done fairly and properly. Some have been nasty and pointless, but I hope it made them feel better about themselves to vent their personal angst, so it wasn't in vain.

On my end, my son did very well in the Summer Nationals and has, since the inception of this thread, increased his rating twice and is well positioned on the national points list. Given that the problems arose not from his losing, but rather his winning, I imagine that comments to the effect that he isn't cut out for fencing reflect someone else's projected psychological issues. His issues, and mine by virtue of his, have resolved themselves, as many have suggested they would.

As for the round robin question, I have no idea whether they are valid competitions, but clubs are holding them and awarding ratings. My son just fences in them, as he does in more typical competitions. Since those who apparently see themselves as the repository of all fencing knowledge here are in disagreement, I will let the mavens hash it out. My son just fences. I just support his fencing.

And as for the value of seeding and ratings, in the month preceding the SNs, a number of competitions were held in my area with the express purpose of improving ratings. Apparently, there are others, including coaches, who held similar concerns as mine. Perhaps we're all wrong, as some mavens suggest, but we clearly weren't alone.

So, to all those who offer their absolutist opinions on the subject, others obviously see it differently. There is no shortage of wise people here who are not only absolutely certain that their opinion is the only correct one, and unsurprisingly, many are in total disagreement with each other. You guys can hash it out over who's right and wrong, since all of you know far more about fencing than I do.

No matter. My son will keep fencing and winning. I will keep supporting him, and his concerns will remain more important to me than the mavens. And you folks who feel that you must have the final answer to all things fencing can deal with whatever emotional deficits are reflected in your posts in whatever way best suits you.

Thanks to all those who offered thoughtful comments, whether in agreement with me or not.

[dcrocket]

...my son did very well in the Summer Nationals...

It is wonderful that good fencing can overcome being repeatedly screwed by the system and whining parents. Who would have guessed?

[wahrman]

Doing well isn't really a very good measure if fencing is or is not for you.
But yeah, I agree with you that the kid should just go fence.

For some reason, I don't see that happening anytime soon.

(Sounds like his son can fence, so maybe fencing IS for his son, but perhaps he needs to let his son do the fencing.)

Talk to some of the parents and coaches of fencers who HAVE achieved the level you want for your son. Find out if they did all this nit picking in the early days. Seriously. Let us know what you find out.

[JAG]

Doing well isn't really a very good measure if fencing is or is not for you.
But yeah, I agree with you that the kid should just go fence.

For some reason, I don't see that happening anytime soon.

We considered whether he should continue fencing because he loves to fence and does so well, or whether he should give it up because someone who knows nothing about him has thought it important enough to express his offensive opinion on a website that fencing is not for him. Oddly, he decided not to ignore his coaches, teammates, friends, even parents, in favor of taking your thoughts to heart.

Yet you think your opinion so critically important, your complete ignorance aside, that you had no choice but to repeat it. I don't know whether this is a cry for psychological help on your part, but I doubt that my son will take your advice this time either. Did you suspect you are that important that he would change his mind if you expressed your opinion again?

I hope that you're a wonderful fencer. As a person, you have serious narcissistic issues.

[dcrocket]

I think that you have once again missed the point. The poor kid seems to be ovecoming a serious handicap: whiny parent.

[wahrman]

As dcrocket already stated, you completely missed the point. Again.

We considered whether he should continue fencing because he loves to fence and does so well, or whether he should give it up because someone who knows nothing about him has thought it important enough to express his offensive opinion on a website that fencing is not for him. Oddly, he decided not to ignore his coaches, teammates, friends, even parents, in favor of taking your thoughts to heart.

Yet you think your opinion so critically important, your complete ignorance aside, that you had no choice but to repeat it. I don't know whether this is a cry for psychological help on your part, but I doubt that my son will take your advice this time either. Did you suspect you are that important that he would change his mind if you expressed your opinion again?

I hope that you're a wonderful fencer. As a person, you have serious narcissistic issues.

[JAG]

And if you and dcrocket think it's worth your while to say something so asinine, do you not see some serious problems with the two of you? As I've said, many here have offered terrific thoughts. You simply aren't amongst them.

I truly feel sorry that you spend your time, on a Friday night no less, to do things like this. Seriously, get some help, and perhaps you will find friends so you don't have to roam the internet to find something close to human interaction. Best of luck.

[wahrman]

Wow. I'm not quite sure where you're getting this. You've read way too much into the few lines I've said. Never have I said or implied that I knew what your kid should do. Never did I resort to insults. I'm glad he's done well at SN and proven the posters on this thread correct. That is, the ratings don't matter much, just go fence and have fun.

It doesn't sound like you're having much fun. It sounds like you're getting your knickers in a twist for no reason.

What I did imply and perhaps too subtly for you was that maybe you don't need to worry so much about the rating system, flawed as it may be.

By the way, it may be Friday night where you are but not necessarily where I am.

cheers.

[dcrocket]

I truly feel sorry that you spend your time, on a Friday night no less, to do things like this.

Ponder this statement, for a little while.

[JAG]

Ponder this statement, for a little while.

Ponder it yourself. I'm here because I started this thread. You, on the other hand, have no horse in this race but persist in posting even though you've had nothing to useful contribute from the start.

[JAG]

Wow. I'm not quite sure where you're getting this. You've read way too much into the few lines I've said. Never have I said or implied that I knew what your kid should do. Never did I resort to insults. I'm glad he's done well at SN and proven the posters on this thread correct. That is, the ratings don't matter much, just go fence and have fun.

It doesn't sound like you're having much fun. It sounds like you're getting your knickers in a twist for no reason.

What I did imply and perhaps too subtly for you was that maybe you don't need to worry so much about the rating system, flawed as it may be.

By the way, it may be Friday night where you are but not necessarily where I am.

cheers.

Your point, which was not only obvious but had been raised long before you felt compelled to post, was that you think it's whiny to complain about ratings. Had you read the beginning of this thread, you would have learned that you didn't have a novel idea. And others who have posted here disagree with that view.

But you chose to make your point by attacking me, and more importantly, my son. Yes, you were insulting, and now you whine about getting it in return. Tough.

You're entitled to think that it's wrong to complain about ratings, though why you were so moved to post over and over suggests your nascissistic self-image, that your opinion is so incredibly important that you must persist in making it even though it's already been hashed out. But you are not entitled to attack someone, and certainly not a kid, in the process.

Some people think ratings don't matter. Others do. Your entitled to your view, but when you made the attack personal, it demonstrated your own demons rather than any you project on someone you don't know.

So wherever you may be, consider what strange voice in your head made you feel compelled to attack in the first place, and then persist in the attack. Your opinion is of no consequence to me or my son, but it reflects some serious issues as to what compels you to behave this way.

[dcrocket]

You are quite right, I have no horse in this race. It is too bad that you do not understand why I have posted here. C'est la vie.

[JAG]

You are quite right, I have no horse in this race. It is too bad that you do not understand why I have posted here. C'est la vie.

I understand why you posted. I don't understand why you continue to post, except in an effort to save face.

[academe]

[occasionalfencer]

But you chose to make your point by attacking me, and more importantly, my son. Yes, you were insulting, and now you whine about getting it in return. Tough.

No one here has attacked your son. If your son is to progress in fencing, it will help him, not hurt him, if you learn to distinguish between yourself and him.

[Inquartata]

No, it won't! This is like strip-coaching, which everyone knows can only help a fencer!

[pinkelephant]

No, it won't! This is like strip-coaching, which everyone knows can only help a fencer!

Is that like strip-poker?