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jspierre · 09-20-2002, 05:32 PM

Anyone know any results yet?

Sabresque · 09-21-2002, 12:41 AM

I can't pull men's epee off the top of my head, but I know that the gold metal (? I think) bout was between (last names) French and Soloman.

Women's sabre, I can tell you the top four:

1) Sada Jacobson
2)Valerie Providenza
3T) Eileen Grench
3T) Mariel Zagunis

some other names for women's sabre in the top 8 were, uh, I think, Sarah Parker, Emily Jacobson,

and I can't remember the other two. Hope that's what you were looking for!

edew · 09-21-2002, 02:35 AM

Were there any fencers from outside the American continent (US and Canda, primarily)?

Maybe next year. When it's held at a more, erm, interesting, place.

DHCJr · 09-21-2002, 05:11 AM

Eric,

I had already seen the schedule for next season on the FIE web site. Same Bat time, Same Bat channel. It will be back in Louisville.

Sabresque · 09-21-2002, 07:13 PM

Next year too?!?!?! eeeggkk.

anyhoo. Today in men's foil the top four were Dimitri Kirk-Gordon, Scott McGuire, Gabriel Sinkin and a guy from colorado (??). By the way, this isn't the order, as I didn't stay for the gold bout. the gold medal match was between Scott McGuire and Gabriel Sinkin. There were a few other countries beside the US and Canada, but not many, and not enough to make it a Junior A in most weapons. I know there were a few mexicans and a couple italian foilists, but that's all I heard.

edew · 09-23-2002, 03:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sabresque
Next year too?!?!?! eeeggkk. anyhoo. Today in men's foil the top four were Dimitri Kirk-Gordon, Scott McGuire, Gabriel Sinkin and a guy from colorado (??). By the way, this isn't the order, as I didn't stay for the gold bout. the gold medal match was between Scott McGuire and Gabriel Sinkin. There were a few other countries beside the US and Canada, but not many, and not enough to make it a Junior A in most weapons. I know there were a few mexicans and a couple italian foilists, but that's all I heard.

If I'm not mistaken, I believe you mean Josh McGuire.

And Donald, while it may say on the FIE calendar "Louisville", it can still be changed, for a number of reasons.

DJ Apostrophe · 09-23-2002, 02:28 PM

The results of the events except for MS are up on the usfa's site... read and enjoy
-w

neevel · 09-23-2002, 02:57 PM

I just got back from working there last night. There were only a tiny handful of competitors from outside the U.S and Canada (and most of those were people who were already in the U.S. for school, etc.). This is still the tail-end of the off-season for Europe so fencers are either not training or only just getting back into training. Combine that with the fact that they can just 'drop' the competition from their points tally and there wasn't much incentive to go. As it was, no international points were awarded since the field of competition didn't meet the FIE strength requirements (USFA points were awarded). Next year's is scheduled for November, which will be more into the season proper and thus should be better attended.

-Dave

MHS Fencer · 09-23-2002, 03:58 PM

Well, I was just perusing the FIE Junior Rankings and it appears we got our international points, so all we need are a few more of these weakly attended junior competitions and then we can at least appear to have a strong international showing. I'll go back next year, but I hope that they will move it (either in location or date, preferably closer to the European junior season, or both).

JEC · 09-23-2002, 05:20 PM

The "guy from Colorado (???)" is Andras Horanyi who ended up 18/56 in Junior Men's Epee and 3/61 in Junior Men's Foil. When we used to lived in Colorado, we belong to his club, Northern Colorado Fencers. Andras is just a Cadet but is really an outstanding fencer.

haggis · 09-23-2002, 06:11 PM

Have just looked at the results from Louisville. I can't believe the FIE will let them count towards World Junior rankings. McGuire and Merkl are both pretty good fencers and a few of the Americans are no doubt quite handy but am I convinced that the strength of the last 32 or 16 was remotely near the vast majority of the other Junior World Cups (possibly with the exception of WS where USA are strong)? Not only were they extremely weak but nobody bothered to show. Most World Cups will limit the home nation to 24 fencers plus those in the top 50(?) of the World Cup rankings. On that basis, most of the events would have had an entry of about 28 - 35. I don't think this one's really caught on.

Who knows, maybe the FIE are offering free World Cup points as an incentive scheme.

Greetings from Europe

Haggis (on the cold wet Northern edge)

Saber-Psycho · 09-24-2002, 02:57 AM

MHS fencer says:Well, I was just perusing the FIE Junior Rankings and it appears we got our international points

Haggis says: Have just looked at the results from Louisville. I can't believe the FIE will let them count towards World Junior rankings. McGuire and Merkl are both pretty good fencers and a few of the Americans are no doubt quite handy but am I convinced that the strength of the last 32 or 16 was remotely near the vast majority of the other Junior World Cups

Who is right??

Boo Boo · 09-24-2002, 06:46 AM

The answer is on the FIE website...

My guess is that the FIE is trying to encourage the growth of a Junior A-grade in the US: not awarding FIE ranking points would not do this - awarding ranking points might well encourage more interenational fencers to go next year.

If you want another easy A-grade, go to Havana: I believe that is one of the less tough ones (at least compared with some of the European ones) and I think it is 6 weapon.

Boo

haggis · 09-24-2002, 07:06 AM

Aw, poor little America. If you want to have a high-quality Junior World Cup:
1. Persuade FIE to let you stage it at a time that isn't about a month before any other Junior World Cups. It's too early.

2. Hold it somewhere that people want to go. No offence to Louisville, but it wasn't, isn't and probably never will be top of my list of places to visit before I die.

3. Encourage other nations to attend. Simply having the event is not enough. Plenty of World Cups have folded due to the lack of decent support for the event. A USA/Canada jamboree won't do. If it doesn't get better, FIE will take it away from you.

That's it really

Haggis

Boo Boo · 09-24-2002, 07:25 AM

Look at the results for Havana and Haifa (both Junior events) - definitely a lot easier than a lot of the European Junior A-grades.

Haggis, have you ever been to Goppingen? Louisville can't be a more bland place than Goppingen! (No offence to anybody who has ever lived in Goppingen - the local people were lovely, just there wasn't much going on there at all...).

Boo

haggis · 09-24-2002, 11:50 AM

Goppingen may indeed be bland but it is in the middle of Europe and has had Junior and Senior (?) world Cups for ages. If the USA wants to join the Junior World Cup party, then it has to bring something a bit special or we lazy Eurpoeans won't bother. Having a regular Junior World Cup in the US would be excellent for the sport Stateside but it requires more effort to make it work. Yes, Goppingen may be bland, Burgsteinfurt is very dull but Louisville is a long way away (from Europe). Certainly far further than two to three hours by car or one to two hours by plane.

Goppingen will win on location but Louisville doesn't sound like it's sneaking ahead on other counts.

Haggis

Boo Boo · 09-24-2002, 12:07 PM

Very true.

I guess New York, Boston or Washington DC would be good (most of the other "interesting" places take even longer to fly to).

Oh well, I suppose I have a lot of years before I start worrying where U20 A-grades are held (have to convince my husband that he wants children, then my child/ren that they want to fence first....)

Boo

DHCJr · 09-24-2002, 09:27 PM

Most World Cups will limit the home nation to 24 fencers plus those in the top 50(?) of the World Cup rankings.

With most World Cups being in Europe this would be true, but if you check out rule O.86 you will find they do encourage the locals outside of Europe to participate. I am not sure where the dividing line between the continents of North and South America, but when a World Cup is in North America there is no limit set by the FIE on maximums for countries in North America. If there was, we would be very limited in entry for Havana. It would be 8, plus the number who made the top 32 in the previous World Cup. Since that is not Louisville, that would be very limited.

Also check out O.83, the requirement to be classed as a World Cup outside of Europe is much less.

It may not be that strong, but it gives a feel to our fencers some of the differences between a NAC and a World Cup.

Sabresque · 09-24-2002, 11:55 PM

sorry about the mistakes. sleep deprivation was catching up to me, plus I'm not a huge follower of men's foil, so I don't know all the names. Lo siento.