This is my first year in the conference,
can someone clear up the format for this event for me?
People have told me before, but I always forget.
I heard it is a team event the first day,
then they use those seedings (in addition to other results throughout the season) to make it individual on the second day.
and THEN it is like double elimination, or something different than standard DE's.
This is my first year in the conference,
can someone clear up the format for this event for me?
People have told me before, but I always forget.
I heard it is a team event the first day,
then they use those seedings (in addition to other results throughout the season) to make it individual on the second day.
and THEN it is like double elimination, or something different than standard DE's.
Help me out.
If I recall correctly, this is how it goes:
first, the teams are sorted into pools. In the pools, you fence each other team. The A fencers fence, B fencers fence, and C fencers fence, so you have three bouts against each other team. The performance in these team pools is used for two things:
1. To seed the teams into a DE bracket
2. To pick which fencers qualify for the individual tournaments
Once the teams are seeded into the DE bracket, they start fencing DEs, with the same rules as a normal competition. These matches are all-fence-all 9 bout matches. There's no double elimination; you lose once you're out. Final team standings are determined the same way as in normal competition.
There are a certain number of fencers to qualify for individuals--7 As, 6 Bs, 3 Cs, for example. (Not the actual numbers, but probably close to them) This is done from the results from the big team pools. These fencers are then put into two pools which fence, and those with the best record are put into one final pool and fence. These two pool rounds determine final standings for individuals.
Once the teams are seeded into the DE bracket, they start fencing DEs, with the same rules as a normal competition. These matches are all-fence-all 9 bout matches. There's no double elimination; you lose once you're out. Final team standings are determined the same way as in normal competition.
I know in 2007, there was a cutoff, but that all the (women's) teams fencing the second day (I think that this was teams above 16?) fenced .... to all places? More than just single elimination?
At the very least, teams must fence off for third place. Or, rather, at least they did in 2007.
Somewhat unsurprisingly, I remember significantly more about format the year I did well, and remember almost nothing about format from last year. Last year, I just fenced whoever was in front of me, and then went back to worrying about everything else.
I strongly feel that the host should break even on the event _before_ additional revenue sources like concessions & swag are taken into account. I can't say that my viewpoint is universal, but some motion in that direction has been done.
HAHAHAHAH.
I laugh because while other colleges have given the space to their teams for very little, Smith did not. They cut deals where they could, but based on trainer/parking/janitorial requirements, the Smith team basically spent the same amount of money last year as we did any other year traveling.
This was something Smith agreed to, so I'm not particularly bitter about that (unlike most thing ;P)--- Honestly, I'm much more concerned that the conference breaks even. I do think that the host spending some money on the event is okay (since they don't have to pay for travel or lodging), as long as they're aware of what they're responsible for beforehand. But the conference not even coming close for this many years in a row is NOT okay.
A "squad" is a unit of fencer representing a single gender & weapon from an institution. Ideally 3 fencers + n subs. Each fencer is ranked as an A, B, & C Fencer by the institution. Incomplete squads fill must fill A then B first.
A "team" is a collection of squads of the same gender.
A "school" is a collection of teams that represent the same institution of higher (sic) education.
Format: (sans some pesky details, and from memory, so don't quote me.)
Round 1, squads:
squads are seeded into pools, possibly 3 pools, but maybe different.
Each squad fences all other squad in the pool in the IFA format (A vs A, B vs B, C vs C)
Fencers whom have not been subbed are eligible for individuals. Criteria for promotion to individuals has not been set, but historically the place in one's letter-pool and combined letter results have been used.
Squads are ranked primarily by % victories.
The top 24 squads are promoted to the next round. (Squads of only one fencer are ineligible for promotion.)
Round 2, squads:
All matches fenced in this round are done in a neigh dual-meet format. Potentially 9 bouts are fenced between two squads, with position (A/B/C) no longer used for bout order. All 3 fencers from a squad fence all 3 fencers from the opposing squad until one squad has 5 bout victories, and is declared the winner.
with the top 24 squads, a DE is fenced to 16 squads. (ie, 9-16 vs 17-24)
With the remaining 16, a DE, all places fenced out, is competed. (ie, the losers from the first bracket fence a DE of 8 for places 9-16, etc.)
Round 3, Individuals:
Successive rounds of pools to determine top n places. (n usually == 6)
Round 4, Team & school ranking.
A points formula is applied to the round 1 and round 2 results to calculate the team & school winners.
If you want to know the format for the event you'll have to wait until the night before to hear what it will be.
That will not be the format used.
"Their interpretation is, however, refuted most elegantly by your system of radioactive atom + amplifier + charge of gun powder + cat in a box"
-Albert Einstein, in a letter to Erwin Schrödinger
So, are there more details about where the venue is/how we're supposed to book it? The website and yahoo group are entirely silent.
I ask because we're at the point where we need to buy airplane tickets, and it would be really, really nice to have some official information we could go off of.
I figure I'd ask here to see if I was missing anything obvious before I started emailing people.
"We are getting the venue for free since everyone is required to book through chula vista (it doesnt mean you have to actually stay there, you just have to book through their system and they get a comission so one can still stay at a cheaper hotel).
The welcome letter indicates "All fencers are required to stay at Chula Vista or a WDC sponsoring hotel" but also specifies the price ($50/person/night with 4/room, so $200/room/night). There's no indication in the letter that there are cheaper lodging options available. Is this merely something that has been omitted from the letter, or are there not less expensive alternatives when booking through the CV system but not at the main CV location? If there are alternative "WDC sponsoring" options that are less expensive than $200/night, could someone please post the information regarding those options? Thanks.
-B
"Oh but you can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you!"
The welcome letter indicates "All fencers are required to stay at Chula Vista or a WDC sponsoring hotel" but also specifies the price ($50/person/night with 4/room, so $200/room/night). There's no indication in the letter that there are cheaper lodging options available. Is this merely something that has been omitted from the letter, or are there not less expensive alternatives when booking through the CV system but not at the main CV location? If there are alternative "WDC sponsoring" options that are less expensive than $200/night, could someone please post the information regarding those options? Thanks.
-B
That would actually be incredibly useful. I'm under the impression that you have to stay at the resort, as that indicates. If there are cheaper options for schools they should be notified immediately.
I went looking for information on this event - specifically date, time and location and found it very hard to find. I tentatively agreed to Referee for it, but I had to be sure of the date. erooMynohtnA: The UW club website needs to be updated, badly. The calendar has scheduled events from 2007 and 2008 on it. There is a link on the ChulaVista to that page, so it would probably help to have the information be accurate. The usacfc site is also badly out of date and has no information listed for this upcoming event. I ended up finding the needed info at the resort's website.
From a review standpoint, I have stayed at this resort. Unfortunately for me, I stayed in the off-season. I won a weekend there from a previous employer in an incentive contest and by the time they awarded it, it was October and it had to be used by Dec 31. Kind of lame to give a waterpark resort as a prize and not make it possible to use it when the waterpark is open (other than the indoor one). In any event, It is a pretty nice resort - decent rooms from what I remember. The buffets are good and offer a lot of variety. I recall them having all-you-can-eat crab legs on the Friday night when we went, as part of the buffet. The meal package sounds like a good deal, though there are some good restaurants in the area worth checking out and to commit to a meal plan you don't fully use could be a waste.
Anyway, here is the link to the ChulaVista event page...
I'm impressed with the fencers that got this up and running (especially after the culling of so many varsity teams).
A couple quick questions: Is there a place where I can get historical results? Are club teams from schools that have a varsity program eligible to Participate?
The welcome letter indicates "All fencers are required to stay at Chula Vista or a WDC sponsoring hotel" but also specifies the price ($50/person/night with 4/room, so $200/room/night). There's no indication in the letter that there are cheaper lodging options available. Is this merely something that has been omitted from the letter, or are there not less expensive alternatives when booking through the CV system but not at the main CV location? If there are alternative "WDC sponsoring" options that are less expensive than $200/night, could someone please post the information regarding those options? Thanks.
-B
I haven't seen that welcome letter before today, so I don't know. All I've ever heard is that you can book elsewhere using the code they provide, but I haven't heard anything for quite some time.
I will ask.
Originally Posted by sir alasdair
I went looking for information on this event - specifically date, time and location and found it very hard to find. I tentatively agreed to Referee for it, but I had to be sure of the date. erooMynohtnA: The UW club website needs to be updated, badly. The calendar has scheduled events from 2007 and 2008 on it. There is a link on the ChulaVista to that page, so it would probably help to have the information be accurate. The usacfc site is also badly out of date and has no information listed for this upcoming event. I ended up finding the needed info at the resort's website.
I agree the website needs to be updated. It was discussed some time ago. I don't know why it hasn't been.
We have another student and our coach in charge of the USACFCs. I'm not involved other than occasionally listening in. I tried to give out as much information as I could, but it's become apparent that I'm lagging behind. Sorry.
Are club teams from schools that have a varsity program eligible to Participate?
Not in the gender(s) in which the school has a varsity team.
Including if there is no overlap in membership between the club and varsity programs.
Effectively this eliminates the Penn State Club and prevents the women in the Temple Club from participating. I don't believe there are any other schools that have both club and varsity fencing for the same gender.
-B
"Oh but you can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you!"
The welcome letter indicates "All fencers are required to stay at Chula Vista or a WDC sponsoring hotel" but also specifies the price ($50/person/night with 4/room, so $200/room/night). There's no indication in the letter that there are cheaper lodging options available. Is this merely something that has been omitted from the letter, or are there not less expensive alternatives when booking through the CV system but not at the main CV location? If there are alternative "WDC sponsoring" options that are less expensive than $200/night, could someone please post the information regarding those options? Thanks.
This is the chula vista page about the event and ways to reserve rooms."
...
"Yes people can book at other hotels as long as they book through the Chula vista system and mention the event code
"Call 800-388-4782 and Mention Reservation # 903449"
And say you want to book at another hotel in their reservation system and they should give you the available options"
Originally Posted by Cookeit 
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