Coaching form

[epeeslasher]

Many coaches have different habits in their coaching form, for instance grabbing the student's blade to keep it held to target as opposed to cupping the blade with the off hand. Or telling the student to lunge verbally each time instead of opening a line or recovering from a lunge. What are some actions you see coaches making which you think could be improved upon and how.

*I would very much like this discussion not to become a neverending and fruitless debate about which one cue works better than the other, but rather a list of alternatives actions that could be made in place of the ones being done by the coach*

[Adler]

For a direct attack with a lunge on the coach’s initiative:

1) Tempo from the hand i.e. from an engagement the coach smoothly opens a line and the pupil hits into the opening before the coach finishes his movement.

2) Tempo from the foot i.e. from long distance the coach steps forward and the pupil hits before the coach finishes the step.

For a direct attack on the pupils initiative.

1) The coach is stationary and the pupil hits in their own time.

2) The coach starts simple transitions from one guard to another (Sixte to Quarte for example) changing rhythm the pupil attempts to anticipate the opening and score with a direct attack into the opening line.

3) Pupil uses any preparatory piece of footwork and hits with a direct attack. e.g*:

1)
Pupil: takes a preparatory step backward.
Coach: steps forward.
Pupil: executes a direct attack and hits before the completion of the coaches step.

2)
Pupil: Double step forward (Short-Long) then steps backwards.
Coach: Double step backward then long step forward.
Pupil: Executes a direct attack and hits before the completion of the coach’s step forward.

3)
Pupil: Starts a slow preparatory step forward.
Coach: Either doesn't react or hesitates to react or steps back in time.
Pupil: Attacks on the coach’s delayed or non reaction.

4)
Pupil and coach are manoeuvring as in a bout when the pupil feels the tempo they launch a direct attack trying to take the coach buy surprise.



* Footwork variations could include: Jumps, Stop short, crossovers, Glide etc.

[Allen Evans]

You can also mix these initiatives, in which the coach may give an opportunity for the student to make a hit, but the student does not always take that hit.

AE

[epeeslasher]

2) The coach starts simple transitions from one guard to another (Sixte to Quarte for example) changing rhythm the pupil attempts to anticipate the opening and score with a direct attack into the opening line.

Ooh, haven't heard of this one before, looks helpful for timing.

[Adler]

Ooh, haven't heard of this one before, looks helpful for timing.

It's quiet useful for feint attacks as well.

[epeeslasher]

You can also mix these initiatives, in which the coach may give an opportunity for the student to make a hit, but the student does not always take that hit.

AE

Is this to teach the student 'suprise' for making the hit?

[catwood1]

Is this to teach the student 'suprise' for making the hit?

More so, it is to teach the student to react when it is appropriate. If, for example, I'm having a student lunge when I cue by dropping my tip as I come into distance, I will eventually, start dropping my tip from way outta distance. The student should know not to lunge here. This makes sure that he is reacting to the right things, not just going "HIS POINTS DOWN, LUNGE!!!!!"

At least thats my understanding of it.

[Allen Evans]

Is this to teach the student 'suprise' for making the hit?

I'm not sure what you mean by "surprise" but Catwood had the right of it...the student is given a cue and has the option to respond to it, and the choice of responses. At the beginning level, this might just be the student not balanced enough or close enough for this action to be successful. At a more advanced level, the student is allowed more ways to respond. For instance, the coach might want a beat lunge, but the student decides that the blade is too far away, and passes on the action. Or the student decides that he/she is going to take the cue, but in a different way (perhaps with an engagement and and advance lunge).

The coach is still controlling the lesson to some extent, but the student is given more freedom to act, as long as the student is making actions that make sense.

Note that this is slightly different than a choice/reaction lesson in which the coach may be controlling the entire lesson, but expecting different actions from the student depending on the cues given.

AE

[AaronK]

epeeslasher,

I am not sure I understand your original post (question)...

Are you asking what teaching movements/cues/etc. are being done by a coach that could be improved on?

Or are you asking for a catalog of movements/cues/etc. used by a coach to elicit a response from a student?

Or is it something else completely?

[epeeslasher]

epeeslasher,

I am not sure I understand your original post (question)...

Are you asking what teaching movements/cues/etc. are being done by a coach that could be improved on?

Or are you asking for a catalog of movements/cues/etc. used by a coach to elicit a response from a student?

Or is it something else completely?

The first one, cues that could be improved upon. Though I hesitated to put it that way for I'm sure there are advantages and disadvantages to any style of cues. For instance suppose that your teaching a beginning fencer and you use a click release as a cue for them to recover their arm but if you aren't moving your arm backwards when you click and instead move to 'reposte' (while the student is holding the hit) after the click, then the student 'counter-parries'. To me it would make more sense to just parry the student's attack so they either have to disengage or counter-parry instead of being in some weird lesson-only situation.

This is but one example and I'm sure there are many others that I'd be curious to hear about.

[AdamH]

...

For a direct attack on the pupils initiative.

2) The coach starts simple transitions from one guard to another (Sixte to Quarte for example) changing rhythm the pupil attempts to anticipate the opening and score with a direct attack into the opening line.
...

This is a brilliant exercise and can be built up and also used in a class situation for pairs exercises.

Fencer A (Coach) starts at the enguarde line. Fencer B (student) starts at the back of the piste.

Fencer A begins changing position from sixte to quarte. The transtion speed is constant.

Fencer B begins advancing in sixte and must hit Fencer B in their quarte target with a direct attack by step lunge/ballestra lunge/etc accelerating to make the touch. Fencer B must not stop advancing and must not change lines.

If classes are getting too 'bladeworky', this really helps sort out distance and impresses how important footwork is.

Repeat the exercise so that Fencer B has to hit Fencer A's sixte (ie, shoulder hole).

Exercise then moves on to the next stage where Fencer A begins moving back at a constant rate while changing blade positions also at a constant rate after Fencer B has closed perhaps half the distance. Same restrictions for Fencer B apply regarding constant forward movement and not changing lines. Accelerate with a direct step lung to finish.

Other suggestion: coach talk less.