The Rise of College Club Teams

[catwood1]

As far as the NCAA goes, can a college athlete fencing NCAA charge for teaching lessons to other students?
We were having this discussion the other night at the dinner table. Many clubs let the more advanced students teach the less advanced students to support their fencing habits.
Would it be "legal" for an NCAA fencer to do that?

The Momster

Its moments like this that make me happy I'm a club team fencer.


*Granted, I give like 10 or 15 lessons a week, and being the coach of my team has thus far only COST me money, but its the principle of the matter!

[darius]

As far as the NCAA goes, can a college athlete fencing NCAA charge for teaching lessons to other students?

A friend had an issue with that a while ago, and the fencer in question checked with their compliance officer and the answer was "Yes." If they're being paid to referee or coach, that does not violate the amateur clause of their eligibility, because they're performing a different function, not being paid to fence.

Of course, I may well be wrong/out-of-date; the percentage of my time spent thinking about NCAA rules is insignificant.

darius

[prototoast]

As far as the NCAA goes, can a college athlete fencing NCAA charge for teaching lessons to other students?

Yes, as long as their pay does not exceed the going rate for the job.

[emagdnim]

As far as the NCAA goes, can a college athlete fencing NCAA charge for teaching lessons to other students?
We were having this discussion the other night at the dinner table. Many clubs let the more advanced students teach the less advanced students to support their fencing habits.
Would it be "legal" for an NCAA fencer to do that?

The Momster

That would be wonderful, being president coach and captain at my club prevents me from getting a part time job. There's one big problem with this, how it looks from the outside. I've considered charging for group lessons, just something like 10 dollars a night but I then realized I was the club president leaving with money from the clubs funds, this looks alot like embezzlement to the rec sports department that wouldn't recognize a foil it it hit'm in the head.

Most of the advanced fencers in a college club are officers, and thus in the same position as I.

[Phrogger]

Mo,

I would think there would be someone at the school that would be able to clear up any ethics issues with this. (Military officers have to go through an ethics review for government contract work after they leave the service.)

It also might be easier to separate school and work by teaching the lessons at a location outside the school, such as at a local club. I think your NCAA fencer could definitely supplement her income that way.

[cobalt]

Well, knowhow is the best and cheapest method of support. A short guide to "Starting a Club Team" and a copy of "Sample Bylaws" would be a start, followed by information such as "Writing a Funding Request," "Accounting and Fundraising," and detailed information that will help students navigate such issues as campus "zero tolerance for weapons" policies that are often ridiculously applied to fencing gear.

IMO, the USFA really needs to take a proactive role in dealing with this "zero tolerance for weapons" issue. There are several colleges and high schools (particularly in the south) that are applying this to fencing equipment. And the number seems to be ever increasing.

A common source of information would definitely be helpful as a first course of action. But after that, students and local coaches can only do so much. A lot of times the voice of the "national governing body" may scare them into understanding. And I believe there's even some business sense into putting some legal pressure on them. The USFA is losing revenue on all these lost potential fencers.

[lewis]

As far as the NCAA goes, can a college athlete fencing NCAA charge for teaching lessons to other students?
We were having this discussion the other night at the dinner table. Many clubs let the more advanced students teach the less advanced students to support their fencing habits.
Would it be "legal" for an NCAA fencer to do that?

The Momster

Ask the ncaa compliance officer at the school. I am sure details matter.

[parrythis]

This is one place a little USFA support could go a long way.

I agree. I am not a huge fan of or believer in the "trickle down" theory that suggests that membership dues should be used to support elite athlete programs. Yes - there is trickle down, as evidenced by the recent post-Olympic upswing in beginner fencing registrations, but I would like to see a greater proportion of the available funds go to grass-roots efforts like college clubs and the like to help build fencing from the bottom up.

here's a quick suggestion off the top of my head:

provide scholarships/stipends for lower levels of coaches' college to student-run collegiate clubs that apply for it.

Great suggestion.

Another would be to find more ways to make equipment available to clubs. Having enough equipment to get people going is a recurring problem.

Another might be to create a "visiting coach" program. Often, small clubs are led by an individual that has slightly more experience than everyone else. It might help to have a coach with some teaching experience be able to visit briefly and get people on the right track.

There are probably many more things that could be done to give back to the membership that provides the money via their dues.

[wwalkerjr]

Be more specific.

What would you like to see from US Fencing that would help support collegiate club programs?

-B

One way that might be beneficial for all is to offer the USFA's umbrella of liability insurance for the University (College) club. The offer would be contingent upon making sure that all fencers are members of the USFA, perhaps at a much reduced student rate for membership dues. The insurance coverage may open the administrator's eyes to some of the other issues raised.

[catwood1]

One way that might be beneficial for all is to offer the USFA's umbrella of liability insurance for the University (College) club. The offer would be contingent upon making sure that all fencers are members of the USFA, perhaps at a much reduced student rate for membership dues. The insurance coverage may open the administrator's eyes to some of the other issues raised.

I believe this is already the case. I could be wrong, but I thought it does. Also, doesn't the normal insurance not require that everyone is a USFA member? I thought that it just covered the club, and all club activities.

*Disclaimer, I really have no idea, am am just making a semi-educated guess.