foil wire

[Pierfrancesco]

the wire has popped out of the groove at the base of my foil blade. safe to just glue it back in? super glue?

[neevel]

If by "base" you mean down near the guard, then yes, you should be able to glue it back down with little problem. Something fast curing like superglue will work best. Gently press the wire back into the groove, taking care not to damage the insulation (a plastic dish scraper is ideal for this sort of thing), and then glue it back down. You should also pay attention to not run glue up onto the tang or under the guard.

-Dave

[Pierfrancesco]

it looks like some of the insulation has already come off the wire - is this a problem?

[Mergs]

Could be. You could put several coats of superglue around the area where you have lost the insulation and let it dry thoroughly. Then glue the wire in. May not be the school solution and if you use superglue to fix the wire back into the groove, it may disolve the "insulation" you put around the bare spot. It's worth a try.

[DJ Apostrophe]

If you use nailpolish to cover the exposed wire (clear or colored ...doesnt matter), let that dry, then glue it back into place you should be ok...

[mifencer]

Try superglue or nail polish to coat the wire before you put it back into the grove.

Speaking of foil wires, do you make your own wires? If so, besides Radio Shack's wrapping wire, what else have you used that works. I'm not a big fan of the polyurathane coated wires.

[neevel]

The suggestions of coating with nail polish or extra superglue are the right thing. Using a thicker, gap-filling superglue to glue it down and fill in around the wire may also work. If it's a German wire, the varnish will act as "backup" insulation.

Re: making wires

A couple of years back the local American Science and Surplus had a bunch of large spools of 27 and 30 gauge cotton-insulated copper wire similar to what Prieur uses. I and one other person cleaned them out. Other than that, I've never seen the stuff available retail. You might try taking a sample of a weapon wire in to an industrial cable & wire supplier and ask if they could find some for you.

-Dave

[sallearmourer]

Radio Shack carry some wire that can be use. It's come in red

and blue . I use it when I made my own.


TIM

[engardemisami]

Neevel,
Thanks for all your great tips and suggestions. I ran to the Amer Sci Surp store nearby and bought a spool of wire (must be a few hundred feet) for $2. The wire is 28 gauge and even AllStar red, double cotton insulated. I am getting handy with this soldering gun and was able to solder the wire with the foil contact with insulating cup.
My next challenge is epee wires as the cup contacts are smaller and there are 2 per cup.

[mifencer]

Tim: Radio Shack even has wrapping wire in white too. So you can have red, white & blue wires. I'm looking for an alternative like neevel mentioned. Maybe I'll try the net, I'll let you guys know if I come across anything.

Engardemisami: make sure you take apart the contact from the cup. (I know it's obvious, but I just wanted to make sure you know that) The jeweler's screw driver you have in your toolkit works great.

[engardemisami]

Oh yes, I tapped out the metal contact first from the cup. Apparently, one does not even need that metal contact but instead can make a little spool of wire in cup creating a base for the spring contact. Now, if I can only find these plastic cups, I can make dozens of wires for the club instead of waiting for broken blades, which lately has been happening a lot anyway.

[DHCJr]

Yes, you can make a ring with wire, but why not reuse the contact? It will give you a much better connection and it is very easy to do. Get a surgical probe, which can be bought at your local college or high school. It is used in the biology classes. If there is any wire left attached to the contact, grab the wire with some needle nose plyers and heat up the conact to melt the solder. Then you can place the contact in a vise (not with plastic jaws) and do not clamp down tightly. Heat up the probe and push it through the center and you will have cleared a hole. With the plastic cup loose on the wire but away from the end bare and tin about 1/2" of wire, heat the contact and push the wire through the whole. Let it cool, break off the excess wire that has pushed through and put the contact back in the plastic cup and you have a new wire with a better contact then the ring.

As far as getting more cups and contacts, offer to take off the barrel on any broken blades, give them their barrel and keep the cup and contact since they would throw it out anyway.

More on wires, there are different types of as you call it "polyurathane" coated wires, I would avoid Teflon, but I have found that Krynel wire-wrap wire works best for me. I personally do not like the Radio Shack coating or its tensile properties, but it is readily available.

Two other options for wire, if you do not like the "polyurathane" type wires, is magnet wire. The positive is it is easy to take off the coating, the negative is it is easy to take off the coating, you must be very careful. The manufaturers sell more than what is in their catalog. Armorers can get items like pins for epee wires, plastic cups, contacts for epee wires, wire to make body cords and yes even blade wire. You just need to know to ask.

[mfp]

Originally posted by mifencer
Tim: Radio Shack even has wrapping wire in white too. So you can have red, white & blue wires. I'm looking for an alternative like neevel mentioned. Maybe I'll try the net, I'll let you guys know if I come across anything.

I wonder if a certain armorer might be interested in purple wires

[Purple Fencer]

Originally posted by mfp
I wonder if a certain armorer might be interested in purple wires

Don't give me ideas!

[engardemisami]

Originally posted by DHCJr
Armorers can get items like pins for epee wires, plastic cups, contacts for epee wires, wire to make body cords and yes even blade wire. You just need to know to ask.

I finally got a chance to wire an epee cup. Those pins, once crimpped are not re-usable. So, who are these manufacturers? Would they be like Uhlmann? Any here in the States? I need to get some epee wire pins.

[DHCJr]

Without seeing the actual plastic, I can not be sure, but if they are crimped, they are most likely Uhlmann or Allstar. None of the vendors in the United States would carry them. You would have to talk directly to the company. The problem is finding the right person there, since it is not a standard item, but it can be done. If I can get specifics of who later in the week, I will get back to you.

[engardemisami]

I take it that not all pins are alike. I think the wire is allstar because it is red. But the cup is not the same as a recent allstar purchase that I made. It does not have the recessed area whose opening is square for the contact spring. The cup that I pulled the pins from has a flat circular plateau where the pins stick out from. I think this is a russian knock off. Now that I look at the blade the wire came from, it has Blades' mark on it.

From your experience, if they are not crimpped, how are the wires usually attached to the pins? I don't see any solder even on my new wires. I am thinking they are glued in.

Anyway, if I had to order pins anywhere, shipping should be negligible. Are these things expensive? They are miniature and not a readily accessible commodity.

[DHCJr]

It has been a while since I purchased any, but they were not too bad. A lot of this is out-sourced, so it varies. How they were originally done is dipping in liquid solder to tin and heat on the pin. The best way for you is to tin the wire, put on the pin and heat. Let cool, make sure they are connected and put back in the plastic.

Glue is not a good conductor. Remember you are only allowed 1 Ohm per line and that includes the guard connector and the tip.

[Greg Z.]

I've meant to post on this thread for sometime. I do not like spending 2-3 dollars for a foil wire that I can make in less than 5 minutes for about 2-3 cents. I tried to cannabalize old cups and rewire the metal conductors but I have a hard time getting the center hole cleared, and I agree with Don that you probably get a better contact with a metal plate in the bottom of the cup.

As far as obtaining the plastic cups , I have found an endless and almost free source of plastic cups. I will not reveal my secret just yet.

First I use 30 gauge plastic or synthetic insulated wire. I bought an old half empty role in the back of a small electronics store, it's about 1000-1500 feet left for $20. To make the metal contact I found some copper sheeting, hobby stores carry it in large rolls, and using a leather punch, I punch out small round discs. The leather punch sets come from hobby or crafts stores and have different size punches. Trial and error will get to the correct size to fit in the bottom of the plastic cups.You can get hundreds from a very small patch of copper. Next use a sewing needle you punch a small hole in the center of these discs.
(Sounds tedious doesn't it, but it's not) The hole should be big enough to just let the stripped wire through but not the insulation. The discs will have a gentle cupping to them from the leather punch. You are now ready to solder the wire to the cup.

Cut a piece of wire a bit longer than the length of a foil, strip the last 1/4 inch or so. Place the wire on you workbench and anchor it down under a weight of some kind or tape it down and have the stripped end coming straight up from the table about 3 inches or so. Next place a small copper disc on the end of the wire with the bowed(concave) side up. Next solder the disc in place. It is not hard to do and the slight bow in the disc will leave you with a beautifullt flat contact surface. It does help to use thin solder, not the common thick type sold with the typical soldering iron.

Now the moment you have all been waiting for. You now need to place all of this into a plastic cup. Ofcourse you can use an old one, but why if you can use an endless supply that costs about a dollar or 75-100 cups, about a penny apiece. Ready?
For those of you who have young boys you already have these in you home. I use the plastic caps from play guns. They are the round revolver style caps that are sold in dollar stores. They come in packages of 8-9 revolver reloads. After the kids play and fire the caps just cut out the little cups with a sharp exacto type blade and there you go. If you don't want to fire the caps the small charge can be taken out with a needle very easily. Punch a small hole in the center of the cup(just large enough for the insulated wire to fit) with a sewing needle. Thread your wire through and seat the copper cup in the bottom with a point setter. When you place these in the barrel you will have to push them in fairly firmly, they are a bit wider that the regular cups, but they fit just fine with just a little elbow grease.

I sit down and make a bunch of these componants at one sitting and once you get going it really goes fast, and with the cost savings it is worth it to make your own wires. One can easily make 10 wires in about 15-20 minutes.(60-80 dollars an hour savings)

I am sorry for the length of this, I never write this much.
I'd love to hear feedback from you guys who have a lot more experience. I am very pleased with this process so far and have yet to have a problem with these wires.

The only problem is that my family thinks I'm nuts to do all this. Am I?

[mifencer]

Originally posted by Greg Z.
The only problem is that my family thinks I'm nuts to do all this. Am I?

No, I have the same problem about buying wire. In fact, I think my wires are better than the one I can buy.

My question to you is: which type of barrel do you use? German? French?

Thanks for the plastic cap tip.