Causes and the respective possible fixes for a blade to not fire?

[Bell2]

Non-firing blades has been a problem I've run into in the past. Recently though, one of my blades are refusing to firing during clear and concise touches. Another, refuses to fire all together.
What are the possible causes for either of these situations and can they be fixed? If so - how?

I'm sure someone knows the answer to this one! Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[FoilBlender]

Fire?

[Bell2]

You know, when the blade combusts and bursts into flame.

... or when it 'goes off', 'makes the light come on', 'beeps at you'

Is there a generally accepted term that I never got a handle on?

[Nolano]

Haha. You made me laugh. You win a good response.

There are a whole heckuva lot of reasons. We'll start from simplest to fix.

Contact spring out of adjustment

This has happened to me twice today. I must have grabbed an LP contact spring instead of a german one. But if your contact spring gets too tight, it won't be long enough to bridge the contacts and make your epee fire.
The fix? Loosen your contact spring
If it keeps happening? either super glue(note that this is a very permanent solution and may render your tip useless for other weapons or wire jobs) or replace it with a new one.

Improper wire connection in socket

If your wire is broken off or not properly connected to the socket(Ie loose, whatever) it's not gonna work.

The fix? Make sure it's properly connected.

Grounding

Sometimes one of your wires will ground to the weapon. This will cause your machine to not register touches due to a ground signal. It can be due to stripped insulation, the wires getting pinched by the grip, etc.

This can be a hard one... If it's not fixable by repositioning the wires in your guard, you're probably in for a rewire.

Broken Wire

If your wire is broken, your weapon won't work. It can be anywhere. In the guard, in the tip, or even rarely in the middle of the blade.

The fix: Rewiring. Unless you need a faster fix, and the break is where the wire is loose in the guard. It can be soldered, but your wire will be living on borrowed time. It will usually break again later.

Those are probably the four most common reasons. Hope that it's one of the first ones.


N

[mrbiggs]

You're a foilist according to your profile, which means that I'm going to answer you assuming that you're talking about foil. Nolano's response refers to epee, so not all of his proposals will be accurate for foil.

The problem that causes a blade to "not fire" is a ground between the B and C lines. You're probably familiar with them as the two prongs of your bodycord, or the two wires which go into your bayonet. The B line becomes your blade's wire, and continues up into the spring and tip. The C line is conducted through your entire blade and guard. If any piece of your B and C line touch, be it wire to blade, tip to barrel, socket to socket, or any other combination come into contact, you won't register a touch.

I'm going to start from the floorcord and move towards your tip so I don't forget anything. Unfortunately, this means the first thing you should do (CHECK YOUR TAPE) is one of the last things on the list.

Reel and floorcord -- this should be easy to test, just change where you're fencing and see if the problem still happens. Alternatively, have another fencer hook up where you were fencing and see if he also gets the problem. B-C shorts in these devices are rare.

Bodycord -- this is also easy to test, change your weapon and if you still have the problem it's your bodycord. B-C shorts in a bodycord are rare, but not unheard of

bodycord clip (2 prong only)-- this is something I've seen a lot of lately, and I've found a lot of fencers banging their heads against the wall trying to figure this one out. What can happen is that if the clip of a bodycord is not insulated, and lines up correctly against the socket, the two parts of the socket will ground out, in effect grounding the B-C lines. This is easy to test, just pull your bodycord out halfway so that the clip is far away from the socket. If the problems still occur, you can rule it out.

Socket -- make sure that on your weapon, the wire is not touching any part of the socket except where it screws in. On a 2-prong socket, it should only be touching the insulated screw, and on a bayonet socket, it should only be touching the tiny screw next to the socket. If it touches any other piece of metal, you won't be able to get a light on. If there is stray wire hanging around, make sure you clip it.

Wire -- look up and down the wire and see if there is a break in the insulation. Behind the guard, this will mean any piece of the wire which is not protected by spaghetti tubing (of course, the wire has its own insulation, but spaghetti tubing is easy to replace and better safe then sorry when you're having a problem that can lose you a lot of touches like this.) Also, make sure the wire isn't pinched in the guard or behind the grip. Pinching can mean a break in insulation and no touches. Check up and down the blade and make sure there's no break in the insulation.

Wire under barrel -- if your barrel was loose, it may be that while loose, it cut the insulation off the wire under the barrel and this tiny piece of exposed wire is now touching the blade. This problem stinks because it's very difficult to test. Make sure your barrel is tight. If you can recall a time recently when your barrel was loose and you had to tighten it, you'll have to consider this as a possibility. This problem, as well as any other breaks in insulation after the guard can only be solved by rewiring.

Spring -- if the spring in your weapon is misaligned, it can come into contact with the barrel, grounding. Try thwacking your weapon on the floor: put your foot about halfway down the blade and then pull up on the tip. When you let it go, the barrel is going to hit the floor pretty hard, hopefully putting the spring back into place. If doing this a few times doesn't fix anything, take apart the tip, check to make sure the spring looks normal, and put it back together. You might note I didn't actually describe a testing process except for trial and error; this is because I don't know one which can be easily done in a club setting. This is a relatively rare occurrence in my experience.

CHECK YOUR TIP TAPE-- If there are any holes in it, replace the tip tape. Make sure it goes all the way down the barrel (but, of course, it doesn't overlap the tip.) If there is any sort of hole in the tip tape, or a gap at the top, then when you hit your opponent your blade will bend and the blade will come into contact with your opponent's lame, which is what the tape normally protects against. Then your tip and your blade will be connected, a B-C short. Granted, this is through your opponent's lame, but as far as the scoring machine is concerned, your tip is not depressed.

And finally, make sure that you are, in fact, hitting. A lot of hits which seem like they could have or should have gone off no longer do with the new timings. I don't mean to be condescending with this statement; I've just had a lot of blades which seemed to have something horribly wrong with them over the last four years turn out to be perfectly fine, and the problem was not with the blades but was with the new timings. Or me, depending on how you look at it...

[TodG]

There's a handy troubleshooting guide on Leon Paul's web site.

http://www.leonpaul.com/fencing_supp...moury_foil.htm

[lefty_monster]

Fire?

I had a problem with none of my blades firing one year at nationals... had to ignite them with pieces of bagel!

Sorry, couldn't resist!

[epee_0.0]

I´ll take the opportunity to lend the thread and ask a question.

Recently I had new weapon built for me by a somewhat absent minded fencing master/armorer (@this one occasion at least he was kinda stressed out). I paid him and went to practice and did two bouts where the blade performed as it should.

Then I took a break and passed the time "tweaking" the blade bending it into shape de rigeur, and when I tried to fence my third bout it didn´t "fire". Grounding problem I think since the light went on when I tried the bodywire trick with the pins against the bell.

Should I ask for a refund or should I rewire it? Or have him do it...

[D'Art]

Then I took a break and passed the time "tweaking" the blade bending it into shape de rigeur, and when I tried to fence my third bout it didn´t "fire". Grounding problem I think since the light went on when I tried the bodywire trick with the pins against the bell.

Should I ask for a refund or should I rewire it? Or have him do it...

The trick with the pins against the bell just makes sure everything from the bodywire backwards works. If the epee then doesn't work when tested, it's either a break in the blade wire or a grounding problem, which a quick check with a test box will figure out. If, when you test it, both lights come up then it's a grounding problem, which can possibly be fixed if you're lucky. If none come up, it's a re-wire job.

[acaba]

Non-firing blades ...

1. Lack of ammo.
2. Not pulling the trigger hard enough.
3. Not plugged in.
4. Add more flamable materials.
5. Pump the gas pedal twice before turning the key.
6. The blade is flooded.
7. Try turning it up to 11.

[telkanuru]

http://eagleswords.com/library/gunblade.jpg ?

[acaba]

http://eagleswords.com/library/gunblade.jpg ?

8. Cock the hammer before pulling the trigger.

Aaron

[epee_0.0]

Thanks for the advice but I found the problem. The contact spring was distorted...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeunxOKByHs

[Rick Shellhouse]

Then I took a break and passed the time "tweaking" the blade bending it into shape de rigeur, and when I tried to fence my third bout it didn´t "fire". Grounding problem I think since the light went on when I tried the bodywire trick with the pins against the bell.

Ok....well....In all fairness there would be a decent chance your "tweaking" rubbed insulation off or actually caused the grounding.

If the blade worked when you left with it....and you came back unless it was a glue problem i.e. the wire popping loose or a dead spring in less than a reasonable period of time....odds are I would charge you again for the repair...if it was found that was the issue....the deformed spring...I would have just replaced

sorry...just the truth...once we fix a weapon...it passes ...it leaves...its sorta hard to give a blanket we would fix it statement....

Rick