Adrenaline it's for Teaching!

[Sean Butler]

Having been out of fencing for so long (20 years) in returning to it, the first tournament definitely got my blood pumping. It reminded me how much I always loved this sport. But the tournament did something else which really amazed me.

When I got into the semi-final bout, it was really close, finally reaching 14-14. I was tired and my chest was pounding; I felt a surge of adrenaline flow through me. As the action happened, everything felt like it was happening in slow motion. The director called halt and awarded the point to my opponent, though in my head it surely should have been mine.

Later when I got home that night, I kept replaying in my head the exact details of the point. He advances, I feint stop cut, he lunges, I pull back, his cut misses, I counterattack and he remises with the point. It was odd how clearly I saw it all, and how many times it kept replaying in my head. Finally it dawned on me that virtually every action that day where adrenaline was flowing was remembered as clear as day.

This got me to thinking: What role does adrenaline play in our memories? Why was I able to recall these points so easily? Doing a little research I found that this idea is a fairly new discovery, about 15 years ago researchers began to study the relationship. Here is an article from 1994 which summarizes what I had intuitively discovered.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E0CE4D9143FF936A15753C1A9629582 60&sec=health&spon=&pagewanted=all

It seems that adrenaline turns on our internal recording camera and makes it run highspeed, capturing many more frames per second than normal. The recording is so vivid that the person can reexperience the event as if he was still there. So, the question is, how can coaches, teachers, employers, etc. use this to teach others? Since this is a fencing forum, maybe we should stick to the former question: what can coaches do to harness this memory imprinting power of adrenaline?

Obviously too much adrenaline can cause a negative memory retention, like one sees in shock victims who don't remember anything about the accident they were involved in. So how do we get our students to experience a small rush which then improves memory retention?

The first idea I had was something I have seen very often. Pick a student and test him in front of the rest of the class. Make him perform something which will most likely embarass him due to his lack of knowledge or skill. Maybe make him lead a drill for the rest of the class. The point isn't to make him feel bad, but to bump his adrenaline production so that he remembers it. Try to do this with every student in the class, if possible. Make sure to critque their form and insist on proper sequencing of actions etc. The more good info you can get in while they are high on adrenaline, the better they should retain it.

The second idea I had was to surprise the students with a loud noise when they get something right. Noises are known to trigger an adrenaline rush. So if you see someone doing something very well, sneak up behind them and startle them with a loud noise, then congratulate them. You could shout or stomp your foot loudly, anything to startle them.

Finally, if you know your students well, you could use loud music to inspire them to produce adrenaline while they do footwork exercises. I am not sure this would work for all fencers, but it might, especially if you timed your drills to the features in the music.

I know these sound unorthodox, and even bad (I mean startling people, come on, this isn't a horror show), but I am struggling to find ways other than tournaments where instruction can be driven home while the student's brain is on high-alert and thus retains it.

Does anyone else have ideas about how this might be done? Has anyone tried this approach specifically with the goal of producing an adrenaline rush for learning?

[darius]

Coach: "____, make sure you're facing forwards when doing footwork."
[...time passes...]
Coach: "Where do you want to be looking, ____? If there's a sword wielding maniac, don't you want to keep your eyes on him?"
[...time passes...]
[...more feedback...]
[...time passes...]
Coach: [sneaks right in front of student who is completely oblivious to the giggles of a half-dozen other 10-14 year olds, and yells really loudly, brandishing a sabre]
Student: [diligently faces forward, for at least 30 seconds]

I don't think adrenaline has a place in the learning process at all.

darius

[Sean Butler]

If someone doesn't care to learn, then whatever they might learn is never put to use. If I was that kid's coach, I wouldn't bother with him. I would make it clear that he needs to pay attention and do the drills or he can go sit down. If a kid isn't going to pay attention during fencing, he's going to eventually get hurt.

[Allen Evans]

Ahhhhhh.....this is a very old technique, much used by old Eastern European coaches.

You make a mistake, you get striped on the leg, often hard enough to draw blood

Very time tested. Most coaches from that era regret it's passing.

AE

[Sean Butler]

Aye pain would be one way, haha! I laugh, but honestly, in some articles they recommended that if you want to memorize something, slap yourself hard on the leg so that it makes a big noise. The small amount of adrenaline you can release from the pain and noise apparently helps. Maybe those coaches weren't wrong.

[fencerchica]

Ahhhhhh.....this is a very old technique, much used by old Eastern European coaches.

You make a mistake, you get striped on the leg, often hard enough to draw blood

Very time tested. Most coaches from that era regret it's passing.

AE

"Tactile reinforcement"! Demonstrates why one shouldn't wear shorts while fencing, even taking lessons; highly effective reminder to keep correct distance. I do still think of that when I catch myself drifting too close to my opponent.

[Zilverzmurfen]

Ahhhhhh.....this is a very old technique, much used by old Eastern European coaches.

You make a mistake, you get striped on the leg, often hard enough to draw blood

Very time tested. Most coaches from that era regret it's passing.

AE

IMO physical violence has no place in any learning process.
Different cultures etc. but AFAIAC it's conter-productive.

[Allen Evans]

It's true then.

No one expects me to be funny on F.net.

*sigh*

AE

[Zilverzmurfen]

It's true then.

No one expects me to be funny on F.net.

*sigh*

AE

Hey, if that was supposed to be "humourous" I simply missed it due to me being a non-native english speaker/typer.

My personal opinion on the matter, though, still stands.

[MdA]

Ahhhhhh.....this is a very old technique, much used by old Eastern European coaches.
AE

I remember this technique. It worked. However, I would have trouble convincing the parents of our current fencers...maybe you should use it only with adults after having them sign a waiver.

Exciting and engaging warm up games seem to work as a subsitute. We play floor hockey sometimes... and I get to whack them a few times....or check them into the wall....accidentally, of course. Dodge ball is another favorite warm up game..."fight or flight".

[fencerchica]

I remember this technique. It worked. However, I would have trouble convincing the parents of our current fencers...maybe you should use it only with adults after having them sign a waiver.

Exciting and engaging warm up games seem to work as a subsitute. We play floor hockey sometimes... and I get to whack them a few times....or check them into the wall....accidentally, of course. Dodge ball is another favorite warm up game..."fight or flight".

Gosh... I actually don't really mind the "tactile reinforcement" so much because in my view, the effectiveness is undeniable (assuming a dynamic with the student that permits this, of course) and the risk of substantial injury is virtually nonexistent. On the other hand, I HATE dodgeball type exercises, because in a relatively confined and sometimes cluttered salle, I think they're a perfect recipe for ankle injuries, ranging from minor to disastrous. It's happened to me; it's happened to my clubmates.

[telkanuru]

I remember this technique. It worked. However, I would have trouble convincing the parents of our current fencers...maybe you should use it only with adults after having them sign a waiver.

IDK my coach often smacks me upside the mask if I do something stupid. Slightly more humane but with the same effect.

[jBirch]

Yup. Gotta agree with Telk: smacks upside the head do wonders for attention.

And there's a world of difference between physical correction and malicious violence. If getting hit or hitting someone else is so abhorrent, I suggest a different sport...perhaps Bridge?

Doesn't Jason speak volumes about "realism" in our coaching practices? Isn't the "correct" way to adjust a fencer's technique to take advantage of the flaw and hit them?

James.

[MdA]

...
Doesn't Jason speak volumes about "realism" in our coaching practices? Isn't the "correct" way to adjust a fencer's technique to take advantage of the flaw and hit them?

James.

Yes. I use this technique. For example: if the fencer is not closing out the line with their extension during an attack. I will just leave my POL and let them lunge onto it...assuming that they are wearing protective fencing clothes and underarm plastron...of course.

I will also tap them on the head sometimes...lightly...left over from my old Master...but some parents are not too fond of that one....so I have limit myself...but with my own sons....

...you can also make them stop...in mid-lesson and make them do 10 push-ups..of course Jason would argue that this would "put them to sleep" (grin)

[telkanuru]

See, that's not enough reinforcement imo , but I guess it depends on you and your student. My coach has a much faster hand than I do, so regardless of my mistake it usually ends up being punished by a flick to the side of the mask.

It's also fair to note that the only protective gear I wear in lesson is a mask and glove.

[Allen Evans]

Okay, perhaps it's time to stop being funny, and put on my serious hat again.

I witnessed (but never took lessons from) coaches who smacked their students in the leg when they made a mistake -- this is not the same thing as advocating "realistic" training by scoring against a student with a legitimate fencing action when they make a mistake. These strikes were hard hits designed to sting or hurt, to punish mistakes. There are coaches who insist this method works, but for every student that shows progress by being beaten, I can show another (equally as talented) that shuts down under this sort of treatment.

The fact that it is probably grounds for criminal charges for the coach if the fencer is underage is an additional strike against this method.

Sean...reread the article again. The article focused on the brain's ability to recall traumatic events in great detail, perhaps influenced by an adrenilin influx. This sounds like it might have limited utility (since the study doesn't discuss linking adrenilin to positive events). The article speculates about using adreniline to enhance learning of information, but never goes into detail about what sort of information is retained, or how much adreniline is needed (perhaps a cup of coffee would do the same thing, rather than seeing a car accident?).

Successful athletes are able to recreate positive emotions while competiting. These positive emotions enhance their ability to perform at peak levels for an extended period (you'll often hear sports psyche people talk about "flow"). These positive emotions seem to be able to harness the body's ability to produce adrenilin just as a negitive emotion (fear, for instance) do. I think that promoting those experiances in the lesson are probably more beneficial than watching everyone watch "Saw XV" before practice.


AE

[Sean Butler]

Yes, Allen, I think you are right about trying to find positive ways to increase adrenaline. I want to note, however, that my limited research of this adrenaline-memory relationship was not limited to this article. If you do a search you will find a multitude of articles about it. They range from treatment of Alzheimer's, to finding ways to prevent adrenaline from imprinting bad memories.

I don't advocate scare tactics, but I do think, especially after my own experience in a tournament, that there is a real benefit to be gained from adrenaline. If you have a young student whom you coach during tournaments, and you'd like to see him or her get better. You might want to consider the fact that he is almost undoubtedly pumped with adrenaline right after a close bout. If you can say something profound and insightful right then, something that will really help him with the rest of the tournament, it will probably stick... for good. He will probably remember that advice for as long as he is a fencer.

[jBirch]

Okay, perhaps it's time to stop being funny, and put on my serious hat again.

I witnessed (but never took lessons from) coaches who smacked their students in the leg when they made a mistake -- this is not the same thing as advocating "realistic" training by scoring against a student with a legitimate fencing action when they make a mistake. These strikes were hard hits designed to sting or hurt, to punish mistakes. There are coaches who insist this method works, but for every student that shows progress by being beaten, I can show another (equally as talented) that shuts down under this sort of treatment.
AE

And, to play along, I've seen the opposite too...for every fencer that responds to nicety and gentility, I've seen another walk away.

There is a nuanced balance to the relationship and if we're to base our coaching on what may and may not get us sued, we won't be able to teach anything to anyone. Any physical contact with a student could be construed as inappropriate and yet our sport is such a tactile one that some sort of reasonableness needs to have primacy.

Thwacks with the blade are, for some students/parents/athletes, part of the expected role that the coach needs to play. So long as the coach stays within those bounds, the relationship should be allowed to grow into a real team of Master and student.

And those team dynamics may look odd to outsiders, even dangerous or offensive, but it is the way that the team works best. So long as it stays reasonable, then it's all good IMHO.

James.

[MdA]

Wow...Thanks Allen...that put the nail in the coffin of my push-up theory.

[Allen Evans]

I won't argue that smacking some students with a blade isn't beneficial to their learning process. But far fewer people respond to this than most coaches would like to think. The difficulty with this approach is knowing who is going to respond, and who isn't.

My own experiance with fencers in the middle of very intense bouts is that they will remember a salient piece of information with great clarity under these conditions. But only ONE salient piece of information at a time (I mention this in my web article about coaching strip side). Outside of a lab setting, I think the variables in using adrenaline make it tricky to gauge what the coach should or shouldn't be doing. And, of course, there is also the problem of the over-aroused fencer, who has too much adrenaline in the system to listen to anything at all.

I think that if the coach is creating a good lesson experiance and learning environment, adrenaline will be a natural part of that, and the coach doesn't have to worry about creating extra stimuli for the student.

AE