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veeco · 09-04-2002, 11:31 PM

OK, last season, I started keeping track of my results in competition and at practise.

Basically I have a very basic spreadsheet that contains 6 columns:

Name of opponent
Date
Practise/Competition name
My score
his score
DE/Pool bout

When ever I go practice, usually I can remember the names of all my opponents (they're usually the same) and the scores, so I put them in when I come back.

When I go to tournaments, I get a little notebook and enter the results of my bouts after each pool round and DE bout.

The spreadsheet calculates automatically a season indicator, as well as records the number of touches given and the number of touches received over the season (that's a pretty basic calculation). It also put out the number of bouts that I have fenced so far, in the season.

Anyone else does this? What have you done with this data?

Now, since a new season is starting up, I'd like to keep doing it, and maybe improve a little upon what I have done so far, so here are some more questions:

If you were to do this what kind of things would you like to be able to do with it?

Any other things that you guys think would be worth keeping track of?

JEC · 09-05-2002, 12:05 AM

I know of a fencing club that keeps a "scouting" report of local fencers that includes their fencing style and strategy. I would suggest adding ranking (if known). On the other side, Aladar Kogler has a training log system that includes daily routines, bouts (sharp and competitive), training, lessons, supplemental training (i.e.: weights, etc.), minutes of footwork, free fence, and "mental prep". In addition, rest days. The log has examples by Olympians he trained. I'll never be that compulsive, but you might have the skill and desire if you goal is to beat EDEW.

Inquartata · 09-05-2002, 01:06 AM

I'm not anywhere nearly that organized. I usually record my bouts at serious competitions, just opponent's name, rating, seeding and the score, all on whatever scrap of paper comes to hand.

For training and planning purposes I suppose it might reward effort to record the director and perhaps whether the opponent had any identifiable idiosyncrasies---left-handed, taller, offensive/defensive game, etc.

veeco · 09-05-2002, 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JEC
I know of a fencing club that keeps a "scouting" report of local fencers that includes their fencing style and strategy. I would suggest adding ranking (if known). On the other side, Aladar Kogler has a training log system that includes daily routines, bouts (sharp and competitive), training, lessons, supplemental training (i.e.: weights, etc.), minutes of footwork, free fence, and "mental prep". In addition, rest days. The log has examples by Olympians he trained.

Where can we get this log? Is it available somewhere?

Quote:

I'll never be that compulsive, but you might have the skill and desire if you goal is to beat EDEW.

Damn, I don't think that would be nearly enough. I mean after all, EDEW's left-handed, you see

.

Jason · 09-05-2002, 05:29 AM

It can be pretty useful to also record what actions were successful in your bouts.
If you spend a couple of weeks at practice writing down all your successful actions--noting, for example, whether the action was foreseen, unforeseen, or partly foreseen; noting if it was offensive, defensive, counter-offensive; etc.--it'll help guide your training.
also, by doing the same thing at competiitons, you can see if the skills youre developing at practice are being transferred to competition.

JEC · 09-05-2002, 09:58 AM

Not far from where you live.

american fencers supply books

PLANNING TO WIN (the training log),
Aladar Kogler, PhD at $13.95

This is a motivation book. CLEARING THE PATH TO VICTORY,
Aladar Kogler, PhD. at $17.95

kro · 09-05-2002, 10:58 AM

I have read 'Planning to Win' and it has been a great help to my fencing. I would highly suggest using his techniques.

I also started using the training log. I am not a very easily motivated person, but knowing that I want to do well this season and knowing that I don't want to work hard I have found that the log sorta guilts me into working out. Hey, whatever works at getting me to workout and practice-- wheather through guilt or otherwise is a good thing. I have been using the log for three months and it does show some interesting results. Once you set up your plan for training keeping track of what you do is easy. So when I do not do as well as I want to do this season I will be able to look back and see why...

kro

jspierre · 09-05-2002, 12:52 PM

The Kolger log is good because he includes examples of Olympic level fencers. You can use that as a benchmark to measuer "how much you take in". So, I've been using the log in a slightly modified way (since there is no way I can train exactly like Kolger's Olympic hopefuls). One thing that I discovered is that my training load is approx. 1/3rd (on average) of the examples Kolger gives for his Olympic students. The log also helps me in periodization of my training; I can see the build-up prior to major competions, and (alas) can see the light summer load. I can also pin-point training weaknesses like insufficient footwork time, or not enough bouting volume week to week. I also keep a written notebook, and make entries after every fencing day.

If you're not tracking your training, you're really not systematically progressing your skills, technique and fitness.

JEC · 09-06-2002, 12:51 AM

Quote:

after all, EDEW's left-handed ...

I knew that EDEW had sinister traits ... just read the water cooler's controversy about capital punishment.

Anyway, study his moves, invitos, etc. You would eventually beat him. If sooner, it would be due to your skill or training, but at least you can take comfort that aging always takes a toll, even for outstanding fencers like Eric.

veeco · 09-06-2002, 01:24 AM

Well, actually, I'm left-handed too.

And in the weapon that matters (Epee), EDEW is like an appetizer for me. Right Eric?!

135711 · 09-06-2002, 01:35 AM

an appitizer! as a former good cook, i'll put him on the combination menu of italian/asian: fried squid with a little mustard sauce.

I did start a book that I kept at home. it was a simple log of fencers that I bouted with either in class or in competition. I simply wrote:

Epee
Me vs J___ = friday 5/2002 = 5 point bout: J won 5-3
Me vs K___= friday 5/2002 = 15 point bout: K won 15-11
Me vs D___= friday 5/2000 = 15 point bout: D won 15-12
then i would note:
next time: fence J with faster retreats
fence K more strongly don't forget double touches
fence D more frequently

then a foil list
me vs R___= friday 5/2000 = 5 point bout : R won 5-4
notes:
R. getting very strong, but does same thing, a circle 6 lunge,
until you find a better way, get him in tempo.
Take a lesson with so and so and get to the bottom of this.

always end with a word of encouragement for yourself:
ex: J fencer for 6 years, your only fencing 2 years, you're doing okay, on schedule or something like that.

edew · 09-06-2002, 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by veeco
Where can we get this log? Is it available somewhere?

Damn, I don't think that would be nearly enough. I mean after all, EDEW's left-handed, you see .

I am right-handed. I fence left-handed just to keep mortal.

edew · 09-06-2002, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by veeco
Well, actually, I'm left-handed too.

And in the weapon that matters (Epee), EDEW is like an appetizer for me. Right Eric?!

More like fast food: simple, quick, satisfying, but gives you the runs.

Give me another few weeks, if my body holds out. Yesterday, I went for a run with some of the other fencers. We ran to the track and did several laps with sprints. Now, my foot hurts like it has a fracture in it. I'm just bleepin' old. My frickin' body's falling apart. Where's the damned warrantee?

edew · 09-06-2002, 02:33 AM

As for me, I used to keep a log of my fencing, together with results and such. But I realized that I never went back to read about what I did. That's always been my failing: I'll set up a to-do list or something, but never bother to read it (so my Visor's To Do feature is basically worthless to me).

On the other hand, by virtue of writing things down, I remember it, so that's partly why I don't go back to read what I wrote.

Right now, what I see I need is more conditioning (and rest, sort of a conflict, but a necessity) and specific drills on certain actions.

Hey Veeco, when do I get to snack on you in foil?

veeco · 09-06-2002, 06:28 AM

Eric, you might just have to live with this. Hey there was a Polish guy not so long ago who said the worse your physical condition was the better your fencing was, so if I were you I would not worry too much

How's the Glucosamine working for you?

I don't know if I should try foil. Maybe I'll do a Bay Cup this year in foil.

edew · 09-06-2002, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by veeco
Eric, you might just have to live with this. Hey there was a Polish guy not so long ago who said the worse your physical condition was the better your fencing was, so if I were you I would not worry too much

How's the Glucosamine working for you?

I don't know if I should try foil. Maybe I'll do a Bay Cup this year in foil.

The glucosamine's too early to tell yet. All I know is I'm achin' all over. My foot hurt so much yesterday I really couldn't walk. Probably was the basketball we had after the run.

Advice from a polish guy....hmmm....there's gotta be a joke there, somewhere.

mifencer · 09-06-2002, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by edew
Now, my foot hurts like it has a fracture in it. I'm just bleepin' old. My frickin' body's falling apart. Where's the damned warrantee?

I can find my warrantee at the bar, usually behind the 18 year old scotches. I also try to find the warrantee under every skirt I can get a look at, but it's easier to get to the scotches.

Good luck finding yours!

edew · 09-06-2002, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mifencer
I can find my warrantee at the bar, usually behind the 18 year old scotches. I also try to find the warrantee under every skirt I can get a look at, but it's easier to get to the scotches.

Good luck finding yours!

That's my problem: my elbow hurts so much I can't bend it to use the scotch warrantee, and my knees hurts so much I can't bend down to look up skirts for my other warrantee.

D'Artagnan1673 · 09-06-2002, 03:40 PM

You all are horrible!!!

I have considered keeping such a log. However, I simply do not compete enough to bother.

edew · 09-06-2002, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by D'Artagnan1673
You all are horrible!!!

I have considered keeping such a log. However, I simply do not compete enough to bother.

To paraphrase John Blutarsky's suggestion: start the scotch warrantee now, as well as the skirt warrantee. Might as well exercise the warrantees before they become outdated!

Is that a horny toad icon or what?