How this is came about is in the Armory section, I was asked about the legality of a '97 FIE Ulhmann mask. Even '85 Uhlmann mask are FIE legal, If they have been rebibed with 1600 Newton bib.
I still believe that 1997 was when they changed the rule from 800 to 1600, but I am not sure. So I told them to check for a 1600 Newton label.
Thank you again and if any one else has any others it would be appreciated.
Be careful what you wish for Donald - I'm afraid that I may have just swamped your in box.
I doubt it. I have e-mails for over 3 years of e-mails and even with your versions sent I have used only 35%
Originally Posted by oiuyt
I think we need to create a repository, including scanned versions of older books.
-B
That is a very good idea. If Craig wants to I could get a small flash drive and put what I have on it. It is organized by organization, date, etc. I have kept the naming consitent.
Originally Posted by Goldgar
I have two different versions of the 2002 rules -- Rev A and Rev C. I'll send you Rev C now -- let me know if you want Rev A.
I know there is very little change, but I would still like the A version. Thank you all for your fast responses.
Any response from the other side of the pond for any language of the FIE rulebook. It seems Mr. Gault has gotten me some British & FIE rulebook. I haven't opened every e-mail, but it seems like Christmas in September.
I did find an unofficial text document for the 2002 British rule book put out by LP.
I will inventory everything tonight and tomorrow make a list of everything.
Craig, think about what oiuyt suggested. If you can host this, I will organize them and send a flash drive to you. I think e-mail would not work.
How this is came about is in the Armory section, I was asked about the legality of a '97 FIE Ulhmann mask. Even '85 Uhlmann mask are FIE legal, If they have been rebibed with 1600 Newton bib.
I still believe that 1997 was when they changed the rule from 800 to 1600, but I am not sure. So I told them to check for a 1600 Newton label.
Thank you again and if any one else has any others it would be appreciated.
How can they be FIE legal if they are not the design that was homologated?
Originally Posted by JEC
I have a 1930s AFLA rulebook (non-electronic paper version).
I have a 1950s AFLA rulebook, with provisions for electric foil. It mentions that the reels and such for electric foil must be in the absolutely best condition due to the nature of the circuit. It scares me what intermittent problems their epee fencers must have faced.
How can they be FIE legal if they are not the design that was homologated?
Items that are made of cloth do not need to homologated, only the cloth it was made from. The mask was homologated, not the bib.
I know that is crazy, but that is how the FIE operates. By the list put out from SEMI all masks from 1985 on made by Uhlmann are legal, even though we know for the first 11 years the bibs were 800 Newtons.
I have to check with Fencerbill (as he does a lot of rebibs), but I believe if the rebib is done by the manufacturer, it would be legal as it would have matching FIE logos.
I believe if Bill were to rebib, it would not be legal.
I have inventoried my rulebooks and have enclosed a list. I am going to double-check these as sometimes they change the rulebook, but not the date at the bottom of the page.
For example the most current BFA rulebook are from last month, but they all say 2006.
I have a translation of the "Rules of Toulouse" - sword prize-fight rules from 1696 (includes: no use of the unarmed hand, defined target, multiple points to win, no changing of hands in the middle of a bout, exclusion for brutality, etc.).
There's no mention of equipment (*) requirements though, so these rules are probably older than what you're asking for.
* If the question regards the requirement that one wear a mask, these rules specify that if you hit your opponent in the face you must instantly apologize.
But if it is determined that you hit your opponent in the face intentionally, you will be immediately ejected from the tournament.
This suggests that the requirement that fencers wear masks in sword skill contests came after 1696.
(History-oriented people!, you can - and I hope you do - talk about La Boessiere, the wire mesh mask, etc. I'm aware of these topics, but haven't studied them - I'm too busy/lazy to do my own research. I do know that our current monkeying with masks is just part of a historical continuum going back more than 200 years.)
I DEFINITELY think that should go in the repository as well.
Do you have it electronically?
-B
I looked in the attic and found it. I apologized but is dated 1940 (not 1930). The Fencing rules were privately printed by AFLA and the Rules committe, which was chaired by Miguel A. De Capriles. The rules were in effect for 1939-1940. The booklet measures 8.5" x 4.5" and has 124 pages. I will scan a few pages. I also have a couple of AFLA newsletters from 11/1948 and 2/1949. Interestingly, one of the topics was what about "Lessons from the Olympics". The discussion centered on the faster tempo of the Europeans, the need to improve directing to reflect the international game, and the criticism heard from the Europeans about the American Foil team: "too much epee fencing with the foil".
Through my university ILL, i can get copies of the 1957, 1951-2, 1970 and 1940 AFLA rulebooks. If you like, I can request them and then scan them into pdfs.
I'll ask around at the club on thurs, and see our resident old timer has copies of the 60s and 70s manuals.
Through my university ILL, i can get copies of the 1957, 1951-2, 1970 and 1940 AFLA rulebooks. If you like, I can request them and then scan them into pdfs.
I'll ask around at the club on thurs, and see our resident old timer has copies of the 60s and 70s manuals.
Hmm, judging by the second link, it would appear that epee used to have right-of-way.
Originally Posted by DHCJr 
