Media Attention

[Fencergrl]

Fencing in Canada has suddenly become a hot topic... and not necessarily in a good way.

It seems that everyone is discussing Sherraine pointing her weapon at her Hungarian opponent and saying F-you after her bout, while her opponent celebrated her win.* It was quiet enough that her coach didn't hear it (and possibly not the ref), however the mics did and it went out on the live feed... to the world.

At first, no one knew what happened. They woke up the other morning hearing about a fencer's "violent outburst". CBC sanitized the footage, so there were no clues there. Her interview, I think confused people further, all they could gather was that for some reason she owed Hungarians and apology.

The media has been on this for a couple days. Sherraine wrote an entry in her blog explaining herself. http://www.cbc.ca/olympics/blog/athl...cted_badl.html

Comments are mixed. Some think she's a disgrace, others commend her for at least being angry about losing.

As a fencer, I know many of us swear, particularity after a bout where we have a strong investment in winning. I personally wouldn't want a mic near me when I fenced. So I see the human side, but I can't help but feel she should have sucked it up (as many of us do).

How would you feel if say an American fencer did the same. What the complicated relationship between Zagunis & Ward had a bout end this way and NBC ran with the story?

*Sherraine as she later explained, she has a "complicated" relationship with the Hungarians. She's been training with their National team for years, then before the Olympics she was told she wasn't welcome.

Personally, I think she should have expected it, didn't the French do the same just before the last Olympics? I wonder which country would take her in, or if she start training at home?

Comments, opinions?

[the ancient one]

I think her blog covers the issue quite well.

Collectively I don't think anyone should be throwing stones--yeah, yeah, we are "ambassadors" for our sport but we are also human.

I hope she does not wind up endlessly repeating the apology to every sanctimonious self-appointed public defender of morals who want to grab some spotlight with this non-issue.

But we know how these things go and she has my sympathy.

[Purple Fencer]

Given how understated it probably was on site, it's a hell of a lot better than Touya machine-gunning the US men's sabre team after beating them in Athens....THAT was tacky beyond words.

But both kinda pale compared to THIS guy

http://sports.yahoo.com/olympics/new...ters&type=lgns

All I can say is....loser....don't care if you're an Olympian....loser.

I've won 2nd at a world championship that even the WINNER thought we had in the bag...and by the closest margin under the rules of the time...but I didn't act like a spoiled child about it on a public stage. I cried, certainly, but I ALSO congratulated the guys that won as they returned to their busses after their encore performance....hardest thing I've ever done.

Suddenly Sada's sulleness over not winning the golds she was extected to win don't seem so bad.

[epeemike81]

Originally Posted by Purple Fencer

Given how understated it probably was on site, it's a hell of a lot better than Touya machine-gunning the US men's sabre team after beating them in Athens....THAT was tacky beyond words.

But both kinda pale compared to THIS guy

http://sports.yahoo.com/olympics/new...ters&type=lgns

All I can say is....loser....don't care if you're an Olympian....loser.

I don't agree. If he truly believes (which he and his coach seem to) that the decision was political and not based on the merit of the bout, it is, in fact, a principled stance to reject the medal. It draws attention to politically driven judging in the sport in an effort to hopefully improve the situation in the future.

Note: I know NOTHING about wrestling judging and am not claiming anything one way or another about the veracity of the claims.

-m

[rchung]

Yes it does, but it also makes the athlete himself look bad. I don't know what of his quotes may have been left out of the article, but calling the decision "politics" and throwing down the medal feels like a very distasteful and overly emotional thing to do.

Bronze should not be taken lightly by anyone. There are plenty of people who would die and/or kill for an Olympic bronze medal.

[Purple Fencer]

Originally Posted by epeemike81

I don't agree. If he truly believes (which he and his coach seem to) that the decision was political and not based on the merit of the bout, it is, in fact, a principled stance to reject the medal. It draws attention to politically driven judging in the sport in an effort to hopefully improve the situation in the future.

-m

No....it makes him, his country, and his sport look bad....no one likes a screaming infant.

It's one thing to protest a call...but if you 1) have to be PHYSICALLY RESTRAINED from going at an official and 2) thrown down hardware many people work their asses off just for the chance to compete for AT THE MEDAL CEREMONY IN FRONT OF THE CROWD, you lose any respect you may have had, and rightfully so.

Sada looked upset all 3 times she didn't get a gold...but she didn't act like someone you want to slap in the face.

This is not Brando refusing to acceot his Oscar to make a political point....this is a world class athlete carrying over his emotional pain to and beyond the medal ceremony.

He's still the official bronze medallist...just a piss poor one.

[sionnach]

Originally Posted by rchung

Bronze should not be taken lightly by anyone.

Perhaps, but we definitely can't say it should satisfy everyone.

[epeemike81]

Originally Posted by Purple Fencer

Sada looked upset all 3 times she didn't get a gold...but she didn't act like someone you want to slap in the face.

Neither, though, did Sada believe that she had been screwed by a crooked official due to politics.

-m

[sionnach]

Originally Posted by Purple Fencer

This is not Brando refusing to acceot his Oscar to make a political point....this is a world class athlete carrying over his emotional pain to and beyond the medal ceremony.

So it's ok to make a political points but not others? He felt he was screwed over by corrupt officiating and he's entitled to make a point. Or are we only allowed disrupt medal ceremonies if we're making a civil rights protest?

[Purple Fencer]

Originally Posted by sionnach

So it's ok to make a political points but not others? He felt he was screwed over by corrupt officiating and he's entitled to make a point. Or are we only allowed disrupt medal ceremonies if we're making a civil rights protest?

Simply refusing to accept is far different than throwing the award to the ground and storming off, screaming politics, wouldn't you say?

Brando wasn;t representing his country when he refused the Oscar....that was for him and him alone. An Olympian represents his or her country...do you remember how embarassing the US hockey team behaved after getting knocked out in Nagano (I think it was Nagano)?? Embarassing for the US and the sport doesn't begin to cover it...they behaved like a PACK of 5 year olds.

If you wanna ***** piss and moan, fine....but don't do it on the medal stand...even if your complaints are valid, you won't be taken seriously

[the ancient one]

From:
http://www.cbc.ca/olympics/fencing/s...m.html?ref=rss


"...Schalm was devastated by the loss, especially since she was defeated by a Hungarian. She had trained with the Hungarian national team for four years, but shortly before her final Olympic camp, she was told by her coach that she was no longer welcome to train with them.

"It's like I imagine being a man. It's like being kicked in the nuts repeatedly, that's how bad it feels. You feel like you want to curl up and die," Schalm, competing in her third Olympics, said after the loss.

"I'm trying to put it all in perspective. Immediately, it's not so easy. It's just really tough. You train so long and I feel like I disappointed myself, my coach, my family, my country, everybody.

"I wish none of you ever have to go through this feeling of loss and feeling of disappointment, and the only thing that I can say is it's definitely not going to kill me, so it will have to make me stronger."..."

Now lets watch this thread drift from Greco-Roman Wrestling to "Nuts".

[Zilverzmurfen]

Originally Posted by Purple Fencer

But both kinda pale compared to THIS guy

http://sports.yahoo.com/olympics/new...ters&type=lgns

All I can say is....loser....don't care if you're an Olympian....loser.

This has, naturally, been a big story on the news here today. While I don't approve of his behaviour (it's very "un-swedish" behaviour, then again, the guy is originally from Armenia) apparantly there was some facts that will give a small explanation for this.

The ref was italian (from Switzerland). The vice president of FILA is also the president of the Italian wrestling association -- him and the ref are cousins (supposedly).

When Sweden filed a complaint about the refs action, they refused to look at the recording of the italians actions -- they simply walked out of the room.

Neutral reffing..?

So yeah, his behaviour was not very sportsmanlike, but he had a pretty valid reason for reacting the way he did.

[PeterGustafsson]

Hi!

Originally Posted by the ancient one

From:
http://www.cbc.ca/olympics/fencing/s...m.html?ref=rss


"...Schalm was devastated by the loss, especially since she was defeated by a Hungarian. She had trained with the Hungarian national team for four years, but shortly before her final Olympic camp, she was told by her coach that she was no longer welcome to train with them.

"It's like I imagine being a man. It's like being kicked in the nuts repeatedly, that's how bad it feels. You feel like you want to curl up and die," Schalm, competing in her third Olympics, said after the loss.

As a Y-chromosome enabled person, I would have preferred if she would have stuck to experiences that she has had, or could have had. What if some guy would have compared his pain to childbirth? Would not everyone else think that he is being mighty silly?

On Ara the wrestler: I have wrestled as a teenager myself, for several years. Wrestling has been changing its rules - in order to appease perceived IOC wishes - far more than fencing. Yes, that is right, more than fencing. Also, wrestling at higher levels has had much more unfairness in decisions than fencing has had, even under the steam sabre time.

There was a ref top-level ref who would always ref against a Swede, no matter what. Only chance a Swede had to win in those bouts was to win by a mat throw.

To make matters worse, Greco-Roman wrestling has become much more defensively oriented in the last few years. To those who know both epee and GRW, it is clear that offence pays off less in GRW than it does in epee. The consequence is that many more bouts go to the end of regulation time, with score tied. This gives the opportunity for may bouts in which the wrestler who is declared loser did not feel that he was dominated during the bout, and is more likely to feel that he is robbed.

For some reason that I do not know, wrestling federations also tend to have a lot of political infighting, making the recent USFA situation seem serene by comparison.

Just thought that I would like to add some background and perspective.

Purple: I do not think that he makes me, as a fellow Swede, any worse in a moral way.


Have a nice time!

Peter Gustafsson

[erooMynohtnA]

I have to ask, what is up with all the poltical correctness?

I applaud Sharrone for dropping the F bomb. Good for her.

Despite my often prickly online personality, I think most people who have seen me fence or fenced me would agree that I'm a good sport. The only reason I mention that is that even though I fancy myself a good sport, it is my opinion that sometimes someone needs to be cursed at. I've never done it, but I reserve the right to use my own judgement.

I don't know if it was warranted in this situation, didn't see it. However, I think that anyone freaking out about this needs to take a long look in a mirror, because she only did what every other person has done. She just did it on camera.

In conclusion, congratulations to Sherraine for breaking the live broadcast ****ing glass ceiling.

[Dan H]

I think a lot of people in the world get this sort of situation completely wrong. First, cursing out your opponent after a bout is unsportsmanlike, shouldn't be part of fencing, and in many circumstances (such as if it's directed at your opponent, rather than just a "****, I lost") should draw a black card. Second, people guilty of such an offense shouldn't be lynched in the media. There are much worse things going on all the time in fencing and in the world, and letting an f-bomb go after getting bumped out of the Olympics by your rival doesn't make you a horrible person.

[Fencergrl]

Originally Posted by Dan H

First, cursing out your opponent after a bout is unsportsmanlike, shouldn't be part of fencing, and in many circumstances (such as if it's directed at your opponent, rather than just a "****, I lost") should draw a black card.

Her coach, who was near the piste didn't hear it. It's possible, the ref and perhaps her opponent didn't hear it either. The sound equipment picked it up.

I agree it's poor sportsmanship. It's also human. I just wished our country and the CBC supported their athletes better.

On the flip side, it got Canada talking about fencing. Even if it's controversial it's still publicity for our sport.

[BrianH]

FG,

If you see Sherraine, please tell her that I forgive her outburst. It happened, it's regretted, it's in the past.

Thanks,

Brian

[Redblade]

Originally Posted by the ancient one

Now lets watch this thread drift from Greco-Roman Wrestling to "Nuts".

I like pecans.