Fencing Tactics

[Einin]

Every now and then I hear someone mention that someone does or doesn't have a grasp of fencing tactics. (Sadly, I think I'm one of the latter...)

What kind of tactics are there in fencing? Would this just refer to, for example, consciously using a 1-2 against someone who always parrys quarte, i.e. basically using your opponent's weaknesses against them? Or is there more to it than that?

[KD5MDK]

There's a lot more to it than that. Have you ever heard of the tactical wheel, for example?* What does your coach say?


* It may be accused of being overly simplistic, but it is a basic example of fencing tactics.

[MyrddinsPrecint]

In chess, you can think one move ahead. This works well against beginners, and is a skill you learns as a beginner. But there are some people who play games where they're both thinking 8 moves ahead. That's harder to do, and doesn't work as well against the kid that is only thinking one move ahead.

Throw in poker--- body language, deceit, luck, etc.

Then throw in the fact that our game is very physical.........

You've got the beginings of the idea. It's about figuring out the dumb things your opponent is doing, and using it against them. But it gets more complicated.

[Allen Evans]

I would very much recommend reading anything by Prof Zbigniew Czajkowski as a firm grounding in fencing tactics. Some of his papers are available on the Canadian Fencing web site, and serve as a good start to his books.

Allen Evans

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

Every now and then I hear someone mention that someone does or doesn't have a grasp of fencing tactics. (Sadly, I think I'm one of the latter...)

What kind of tactics are there in fencing? Would this just refer to, for example, consciously using a 1-2 against someone who always parrys quarte, i.e. basically using your opponent's weaknesses against them? Or is there more to it than that?

They say I don't grasp fencing tactics either.

Screw em. Just get out there and fence.

[Lady Quindecim]

I actually use fencing tactics when filling in as assistant coach for a beginner class. I will take specific actions to draw out their skill set. I also watch them for signs of fatigue by watching for a decrease in the frequency of appropriate reactions and for signs of distraction. Then I make note of who needs work on what.
We do it whether consciously or not. But when I look at them as concious actions and not instinctive or intuitive reactions, then I can improve.
[edit: I need sleep]

[KD5MDK]

I think this conversation is being seriously limited by an absense of a definition of terms.

[noodle]

I think this conversation is being seriously limited by an absense of a definition of terms.

what does he fence? epee? only terms he needs to know are extend and fleche.

[MyrddinsPrecint]

what does he fence? epee? only terms he needs to know are extend and fleche.

Also "stabil"

[KD5MDK]

No bounce?

[Lady Quindecim]

No bounce?

It just happens... no need to define it.

[oiuyt]

It just happens... no need to define it.

You've obviously never seen how poorly some epeeists define "bouncing."

-B

[gladius]

Every now and then I hear someone mention that someone does or doesn't have a grasp of fencing tactics. (Sadly, I think I'm one of the latter...)

What kind of tactics are there in fencing? Would this just refer to, for example, consciously using a 1-2 against someone who always parrys quarte, i.e. basically using your opponent's weaknesses against them? Or is there more to it than that?

Fencing tactics you asked? Here is the definition by Maestro Giancarlo Toràn:

Tactics is deceit, but in an open sport this deception is not cheating because it takes place within an agreed set of rules known and shared by all participants. In other words it is possible, actually it is part of the game to influence, determine, and program the opponent’s decisions: this is tactics.

You may read this presentation which covers tactics, strategy, technique, and sport psychology

http://www.schermaonline.com/scherma...ticle&sid=1857

Enjoy!

[Hauptman]

The definitions of tactics basically revolve around anything used to gain success or an advantage.

So you could say that a tactic is any planned action, as opposed to merely reflexive actions.

[HDG]

You've obviously never seen how poorly some epeeists define "bouncing."

-B

Define or execute?

[Lady Quindecim]

Define or execute?

Have you SEEN the cleavage thread? :blush:
Some ideas on bouncing are very different and it has very little to do with epee.

[MyrddinsPrecint]

Have you SEEN the cleavage thread? :blush:
Some ideas on bouncing are very different and it has very little to do with epee.

And everything to do with epeeists.

[MdA]

Simple Tactics from the USFCA study guide

Lines of attack and defense

Direct

Indirect

Simple

Compound

Short Tactical Wheel

Foreseen actions

Partially foreseen actions

Unforeseen actions

Preparation

[Jason]

Simple Tactics from the USFCA study guide

How wonderfully helpful!



No, wait, I'm lying.

[theLuz]

Every now and then I hear someone mention that someone does or doesn't have a grasp of fencing tactics. (Sadly, I think I'm one of the latter...)

What kind of tactics are there in fencing? Would this just refer to, for example, consciously using a 1-2 against someone who always parrys quarte, i.e. basically using your opponent's weaknesses against them? Or is there more to it than that?

Consider three stages of the bout:
Beginning game
Middle game
end game

In the beginning, you are finding what their reactions are and how to draw a specific reaction when you want.

Middle game you are getting points but not using your "magic bullet" that you learned in your beginning campaign.

End game, you use the "magic bullet" and get the final touch.

This works in 5 touch bouts as well as DE (10 or 15 touches)