who are the best épée coach in the USA?

[jjrenaud]

ok, just to know, who are the best épée coach or fencing master in the USA, and where do they come from (country...) and in wich fencing club do they teach?
i know i'm very very curious...........

[KD5MDK]

For women's epee I think Paul Pesthy has a reasonable claim, but how do you separate fencers from coaches?

[piste off]

Here are some names that should be considered...

Gago Demirchian (Armenia) LAIFC
Aladar Kogler (Hungary) NYAC
Yefim Litvan (Ukraine) NYAC
Abdel Salem (Egypt)
Paul Soter (USA) GGFC
Kornel Udvarhelyi (Hungary) Empire United

I have heard good things about Aleksy Cheremsky (Ukraine/Isreal) FAW, and have seen him give a lesson or two that was quite impressive. Someone that was a former national champion, who is associated with one of the above names, told me he thought he was the best out there.

R-

[KD5MDK]

The problem is what criteria are you using to decide "best"? For example, if the question is "Who is most likely to get a call overturned for their fencer", I suspect it is Michael Marx.

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

Here are some names that should be considered...

Gago Demirchian (Armenia) LAIFC
Aladar Kogler (Hungary) NYAC
Yefim Litvan (Ukraine) NYAC
Abdel Salem (Egypt)
Paul Soter (USA) GGFC
Kornel Udvarhelyi (Hungary) Empire United

I have heard good things about Aleksy Cheremsky (Ukraine/Isreal) FAW, and have seen him give a lesson or two that was quite impressive. Someone that was a former national champion, who is associated with one of the above names, told me he thought he was the best out there.

R-

How you don't have Marx on there I don't know.

I suspect there will be a polish addition to this list within 2-3 years.

[piste off]

The problem is what criteria are you using to decide "best"? For example, if the question is "Who is most likely to get a call overturned for their fencer", I suspect it is Michael Marx.

Michael should also be on the list, but I am curious as to your comment - unless your point is niceness counts more than the fear factor.

To me, there is no one "best", it all depends on fit and what you are in need of. Best is relative to the fencer and in some cases relative to where they are in their career.

For example, I have never seen anybody as good as Kogler in working with a fencer over a long period of time - and for someone that needs a more technique based game. Yefim is a great coach for working with a fencer that already has an established game, and for bringing out your best in an interactive way. Kornel is great for a lot of things, especially if you have the athletic basis to handle it. But I think "best" is relative.

-R

[Allen Evans]

Gary Copeland of Northern CO. Fencers Club should also be on the list.

AE

[piste off]

How you don't have Marx on there I don't know.

I suspect there will be a polish addition to this list within 2-3 years.

The list was a starter and not meant to be exhaustive (I now see that the lead-in "should be considered" was poorly worded). After I submitted it, another name immediately came to mind as a DUH! momment (M.M.).

But I am sure there are a lot of others - example you may be referencing Janusz and there would be no argument there based on the group he is producing.

R-

[JEC]

Paul Pesthy

[arc]

Abdel Salem (Egypt)

You don't have Coach Salem's affiliation in there -- USAFA

[MdA]

To me, there is no one "best", it all depends on fit and what you are in need of. Best is relative to the fencer and in some cases relative to where they are in their career.

For example, I have never seen anybody as good as Kogler in working with a fencer over a long period of time - and for someone that needs a more technique based game. Yefim is a great coach for working with a fencer that already has an established game, and for bringing out your best in an interactive way. Kornel is great for a lot of things, especially if you have the athletic basis to handle it. But I think "best" is relative.

-R

I agree that best is relative. If you are an intermediate level fencer there are a lot of coaches out there that might be the best for you.

I agree with all the coaches that have been mentioned for elite fencers but let's see....let's use my example...who would you recommend for a struggling intermediate fencer who is trying to break into the elite ranks?

[jjrenaud]

When i wrote coach i mean a trainer who have been educated to teach fencing, not only a fencer who had 5 years of fencing behind him; here in France it's not possible to be a coach without an education in the fencing master school, if you want to be a coach(fencing master) you must be educated, i don't think someone can be a good coach if he hadn't been educated to train and teach to the others.You must learn a lot if you want to teach fencing.

Come back to the subject of the thread, for the me the good(or best coaches) should have some good students who go often on world cup and so on, these good coaches must also make a promotion of fencing, i mean that's ok to have a fencing club with the 3 best fencers but if you have no one else.... and the coach must be also an human (someone with who it's possible to speak). The results of the students aren't the only thing, you could also take in consideration how many students, did he succeed to put fencing in a very place in his place.....well that's my opinion i think that's possible to add a lot of things

[Allen Evans]

You've set the bar pretty high...a coach who is "human"...? With standards like that, it's no wonder why France does so well. (laughing)

AE

[MdA]

When i wrote coach i mean a trainer who have been educated to teach fencing, not only a fencer who had 5 years of fencing behind him; here in France it's not possible to be a coach without an education in the fencing master school, if you want to be a coach(fencing master) you must be educated, i don't think someone can be a good coach if he hadn't been educated to train and teach to the others.You must learn a lot if you want to teach fencing.

I completely agree with you. Thanks for your comments. See other threads on the Coaching Corner.

Coaching Certification

Referee exam vs Coach exam

Anyone can be a Fencing Coach ...or Pirate

[piste off]

I agree with all the coaches that have been mentioned for elite fencers but let's see....let's use my example...who would you recommend for a struggling intermediate fencer who is trying to break into the elite ranks?

If you want to be the best, it helps to fence where the best are and take the necessary steps to ensure success - which includes the coach question but more. If I had to do it over, and was young (intermediate as you described) - I would do the following:

1. Move to NY (obviously we have some great fencers in CO, but NYC offers depth and variety).
2. Fence at the NYAC and Empire United at least 4 times a week (2 each).
3. Hit as many tournaments on the weekends as possible (DC up to Boston).
4. Find Attila Lukacs and have him develop a rigorous conditioning program specific to me and fencing.
5. Bake into my long term plan to move to Hungary for 1 year or two (Honvad).
6. Beg to have either Aladar or Kornel coach me. The choice would depend on the fencer. More cerebral types whose style is more technique-based and can commit to a several year stint would do well with Aladar. Kornel would be my choice for a fencer that is more physical and has good basic technique to build on.

That said, the biggest mistake I ever made in my fencing career was not asking Aladar to be my coach when I was young. Quite frankly, the little bugger scared me. I’ve learned that he is a really nice and approachable person. Ironically, my style is/was more physical, so you would think that conflicts with the advice above (OK, it does). But I have seen him turn out time and time again the most technically proficient fencers and boy I could use some of that.

R-

[piste off]

... i don't think someone can be a good coach if he hadn't been educated to train and teach to the others...

Wasn't Emil Beck a barber? Does education as a barber count?

R-

[MdA]

If you want to be the best, it helps to fence where the best are and take the necessary steps to ensure success - which includes the coach question but more. If I had to do it over, and was young (intermediate as you described) - I would do the following:

Anyone attempting to follow this plan...make sure you have at least $70K per year to spend on fencing...

[piste off]

Anyone attempting to follow this plan...make sure you have at least $70K per year to spend on fencing...

We'll maybe not that initially, MdA... as I did not even get into the World Cup scene as you mentioned intermediate-level (that would come later). But yeah, let's get one thing straight:

BECOMMING AN ELITE FENCER IS SUPER EXPENSIVE!!!

R-

[jjrenaud]

when i say human, i think about the emotionnal side, of course you've understand it. When i was in high level fencing( i was cadet and junior, so a long time ago) i remember 2 coaches, one was very good but never sympathic with us, we've learn a lot from him but none of the fencers from the fencing center will have done more for him. The second coach was very good too (he's still) but very sympathic with us, he gave us his trust and we were proud of that and we will have did the impossible for him . Now when i go in the part of France where the second coach live i'm doing everything to visit him, i know where the first one live (close to my second house) and i'll never visit him.

But it's true that a coach can be the best for an intermediate fencer and not for a beginner or an elite one. So for each group could you say who are the good coaches.
By the way a coach who got a worldchampion and to do this had destroyed physically and mentaly 50 fencers, isn't a so good coach in my mind.......don't be anxious we've also this kind of fencing master in France

[MdA]

Wasn't Emil Beck a barber? Does education as a barber count?

R-

Emil Beck was obviously German not French, but he was a member of the German Academy for awhile...I know because I am a member of the German Academy. German fencing was dismantled for a few years after WWII. He developed himself as a coach during a very difficult period.