coach being inappropriate

[cup123]

what can I do or whom can I talk to if my coach is being inappropriate towards me? This coach seems to be attracted to me and it makes me want to quit fencing.

[Katman]

Quit the coach.

[noodle]

what can I do or whom can I talk to if my coach is being inappropriate towards me? This coach seems to be attracted to me and it makes me want to quit fencing.

if you want help finding another club to fence with, drop me a PM. i'll protect privacy, and such.

[cup123]

Quit the coach.

well yeah but coaches have ethical standards, what about those? Doesn´t he have to answer to anyone?

[Pescados666]

Depends on if he owns the club or not. There's a lot of variables in the problem. Age and what exactly he's doing being two of them. If he makes you uncomfortable though, look for another club.

[noodle]

well yeah but coaches have ethical standards, what about those? Doesn´t he have to answer to anyone?

most coaches do have ethical standards, but just like anything else, there are bad coaches.

if this coach isn't the owner of the club, talk to the owner. if the coach is the owner or the owner doesn't do anything, you can try taking it up with the USFA if this club is a USFA club. other than that, you don't have much recourse outside of leaving this club.

[MyrddinsPrecint]

what can I do or whom can I talk to if my coach is being inappropriate towards me? This coach seems to be attracted to me and it makes me want to quit fencing.

In order to give you the best advice, I would need more information, but since you may not feel comfortable giving that kind of information, I'll just give you a bunch of if-thens.

What's the age gap between you and your coach??? If you're very close in age, I recommend being straightforward, and telling your coach that there are certain things that they do that's making you feel uncomfortable, and moving on from there. If you're close in age, the coach might not know you're uncomfortable with the situation. Or even that their actions are coming off as you're interpreting them. A simple conversation might stop the behavior entirely.

If you're under 18 and there's a reasonable age gap, think very strongly about telling your parents. Or an aunt, or older sibling, or someone else you trust. Reaching out for help here is great, but you should be able to get support from someone you see... in real life.

Is it just weird awkward comments? Preferential treatment? Is it touching (even if it's just correcting your body position, and not supposed to be creepy)? Depending on how serious the behavior, you need to be serious back.

Is this an assistant coach? If so, you should let the head coach know, or have your parents let the head coach know. Or the rec center that hosts the class, or the school or camp that hosts the class.... If someone is hiring this person, they should know about your complaint.


In the end, you may want to find a class with another coach at the same place, or switch fencing clubs altogether. This person might just be a creep, and that might be tolerated by the institution. Sadly, there are just as many horrible people involved with fencing, and some of them are coaches.

But do not let this slide. I'm still mad at myself for letting a coach harass me one time without repercussion.

If you want more advice but don't want the knowledge to be public, feel free to private message me. .... Not that you have any particular reason to trust me over other people, but having been there, I know that sometimes just the offer is reassuring.

[cup123]

Thanks MyrddinsP.

This whole thing pisses me off; for having joined this club and having to deal with this because Mr. Inappropriate happens to work there. I´m sure this is not the first nor the last time he´ll show this behavior so I want to do something. This is sexism in my view and something should be done just as it would be with racism etc.. This guy has no respect for me as a student, only sees me as a piece of meat or someone for whom fencing isn´t important.

[BrianH]

This is sexism in my view and something should be done just as it would be with racism etc..

It sounds like it might go farther than sexism into the realm of sexual harassment. Please do more than merely remove yourself from the situation; protect future students from the same treatment by reporting it the club management.

[Phrogger]

You have my support as well. No matter what he/she is doing, don't let anyone convince you "it's no big deal." 99.9% of the time your internal "creep-meter" is going to be correct. I have personal experience with this kind of thing (NEVER with my coach, but with a prior employer and on occasion with other fencing personnel). I didn't handle the incidents properly at the time, but here's what I wished I had done, now that I'm older and wiser:

1. Told the person to their face to stop.
2. If it didn't stop tell their boss (or another senior member).
3. If it still didn't stop, leave the organization.

#3 is the least desirable (after all, it's not your fault!) but often the only recourse unless you're under 18 or your coach works for a school with whom you can file a complaint. That doesn't make them any less wrong. Be as assertive as you can possibly muster. It's a good chance if you challenge them they will back off.

[the ancient one]

Sometimes the pen IS mightier than the sword.
If you are not comfortable speaking up write a note and keep a copy.
A paper trail is a powerful thing.

[cup123]

thanks everyone.

Well if I face him he could turn it all on me, even if I would say something to someone above him that one could be his buddy and say it isn´t a big deal or that it´s all in my head.
Actually I have something that he would have a difficult time explaining to someone else. I´ll see what I´ll do, maybe talk to the regional board.

[Peach]

If you feel someone is being inappropriate toward you, as others have suggested, you need to first of all make it clear that you do not welcome the attention. Just say, "I don't like being talked to that way. It's disrespectful." If you need to, ask a clubmate to be with you to say so. Second, you need to document. Just writing down some notes about behavior and dating the notes is a good idea.

When I was harassment counselor at my place of work, I can't tell you how many people wanted to tell me about bad situations but refused to speak to the person involved, refused to write anything down, and refused to let me do anything--that left me no way to address the situation, made the place where I worked vulnerable to lawsuit, and meant that someone else was likely to be victimized. Many wanted to tell everyone about the situation BUT the person who is doing the harassing, which doesn't work either. If the coach is the owner of the club, that makes things complicated, but you can still speak to him, though I would strongly recommend doing so in the presence of other club members.

The reason I say you should speak to him that is that in 99% of the cases I handled, going directly to the person responsible for the inappropriate behavior and firmly asking him or her to stop brought the behavior to an abrupt halt. For one thing, harassers tend to succeed because their victims are afraid of repercussions--but harassers are just as vulnerable to repercussions. A coach who is accused of creating a hostile environment can lose considerable business. For another, harassers, to my continuing surprise, often are only dimly aware that being a jerk is not acceptable or that they are being jerks.

[tbryan]

what can I do or whom can I talk to if my coach is being inappropriate towards me? This coach seems to be attracted to me and it makes me want to quit fencing.

I have no experience with this kind of issue and no real advice to offer, but the NC division sent this notice to its membership a year or two ago:

The USFA and the NC Division do not condone sexual harassment of any sort. If you feel that you need to seek resources regarding sexual harassment in our sport, or report an incidence of misconduct, please call this number at the USFA National Office: 719-866-4860. Attached is the USFA Policy Document on Sexual harassment for your review.

I thought that you might find the policy document helpful. I'll paste it here since I cannot find any reference to this document on usfencing.org.


USFA SEXUAL HARASSMENT POLICY

POLICY STATEMENT

It is the policy of the USFA to promote a cooperative work and sports environment in which there exists mutual respect for all athletes, coaches, officials, volunteers and staff. Sexual harassment is inconsistent with this objective and contrary to the USFA policy of equal employment and sports opportunity without regard to age, sex, sexual orientation, alienage, citizenship, religion, race, color, national origin, ethnic origin, disability, or any other personal status. Sexual harassment is illegal under Federal and State laws, and will not be tolerated within the USFA.

PROHIBITED CONDUCT:

It is a violation of USFA policy for any employee or member of the USFA to engage in sexual harassment or to retaliate against any member of the USFA for raising an allegation of sexual harassment or for filing a complaint alleging sexual harassment.

Definition of Sexual Harassment

For purposes of this policy, sexual harassment is defined as unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other oral and written communications or physical conduct of a sexual nature when:

1. Submission to such conduct is made either explicitly or implicitly a term or condition of any individual's employment, USFA appointment, selection to a USFA team or participation in any USFA activity.
2. Submission to or rejection of such conduct by an individual is used as a basis for any decision affecting the employment, USFA appointment, or USFA selection or participation in any USFA activity by such individual.
3. Such conduct has the purpose or effect of interfering with an individual's work, sport performance or participation in USFA activities or creates an intimidating, hostile or abusive work or sport environment.

EXAMPLES OF SEXUAL HARASSMENT

Examples of sexual harassment include but are not limited to the following:

• Requesting or demanding sexual favors in exchange for employment or sport opportunity such as hiring, firing, USFA appointments, USFA selections or participation in a USFA sponsored activity
• Submitting unfair or inaccurate job or sport evaluations or denying training, promotion or access to other employment, sport or organizational opportunities because sexual advances have been rejected
• Sexual comments, teasing or jokes Sexual slurs, demeaning epithets, derogatory statements about an individual's attire or body
• Inquiries or discussions about sexual activities
• Pressure to accept sexual invitations, to meet privately, to date, or to have sexual relations.
• Sexually suggestive letters or other written materials
• Sexual touching, brushing up against another in a sexual manner, graphic or sexually suggestive gestures, cornering, pinching, grabbing, kissing, or fondling.
• Sexual assault or non consensual sexual relations

CONSENTUAL RELATI0NSHIPS

Amorous dating or sexual relationships that might be appropriate in other circumstances have inherent dangers when they occur between supervisors or other members of the USFA in positions of authority and any person for whom there is a professional responsibility. These dangers can include:

• Athletes, volunteers or employees may feel coerced into an unwanted relationship because they fear that refusal to enter into the relationship will adversely affect their employment, sport opportunity or ability to participate in USFA activities
• Conflicts of interest may arise when supervisors or officials are required to evaluate performance or make personal decisions with respect to an individual with whom they are having a romantic relationship
• The perception that employees, volunteers, coaches or athletes who are involved in a romantic relationship with a person having professional, supervisory or promotional responsibility for them might receive an unfair advantage
• That if the relationship ends in a way that is not amicable, it may have an undesirable effect on either or both of the parties, and the USFA.

Supervisors or other members of the USFA in positions of authority who have professional, supervisory or promotional responsibility for other individuals should realize that any romantic or sexual involvement with other employees, volunteers, coaches or athletes may raise questions as to the mutuality of the relationship and may lead to charges of sexual harassment. For the reasons stated above, such relationships are discouraged.

FALSE AND MALICIOUS ACCUSATIONS

Members of the USFA who make false and malicious complaints of sexual harassment, as opposed to complaints which, even if erroneous, are made in good faith, will be subject to disciplinary action.

PROCEDURES:

The USFA has developed procedures to implement this policy. The President and Executive Director have the ultimate responsibility for overseeing compliance with this policy. In addition, each Officer, Committee Chair, Team Captain, Team Manager and activity supervisor is required to report any complaint of sexual harassment to the President and Executive Director. All employees and members of the USFA are required to cooperate in any investigation. If they fail to report any incident of sexual harassment, or refuse to cooperate in any investigation they may effectively waive or forfeit any available remedies at law and may themselves be subjected to disciplinary action for failure to comply with this USFA Sexual Harassment Policy.

INVESTIGATION

A designated USFA representative shall schedule a confidential meeting with the person making the complaint. Thereafter, that representative shall thoroughly investigate the complaint, which investigation will include an interview with the alleged harasser and any potential witnesses. Upon completion of the investigation, the person making the complaint shall be contacted and advised of the outcome of the investigation. The USFA will conduct the investigation as expeditiously as possible and will act upon its results as appropriate.

USFA CONTACT PERSONS

A person wishing to file a complaint may do so by contacting any of the following:

Executive Director

Any USFA Officer

USFA Counsel or Associate Counsel

FOC Chair

Tournament Committee Chair

Division or Section Chair

On USFA Team Trips: the Team Captain, Team Manager, and Chief of Delegation

At USFA competitions and activities: the person in charge of the competition or activity

[fencerbill]

Listen to Peach, good luck.

This kind of behavior is not restricted to just fencing. I am sure others will agree that this is something almost everyone, not just women, encounter in life.

What you do in, as I understand you to be saying, minor problem so far will just make you more or less of a victim as you go on to live your life.

[jkdjeff]

For another, harassers, to my continuing surprise, often are only dimly aware that being a jerk is not acceptable or that they are being jerks.

At the risk of seeming unsympathetic (which I'm not, believe me) I think this merits highlighting; some people are just really oblivious to societal norms and don't realize they're making other people uncomfortable until you point it out to them.

I've addressed situations in the past (although they didn't rise quite to the level of what it sounds like you're dealing with, they were still seriously uncomfortable) and the person was not only not aware of how their actions were being perceived, but they were utterly mortified when they realized their mistake, and immediately modified the behavior.

In any case, I really like the suggestion of confronting the person with other people to "back you up". Regardless of which type of person you're dealing with, having other people there to be support (and witnesses if necessary) is always a good idea.

And really, unless this behavior has really, really crossed the line (in other words, to the point where you should be pursuing this through law enforcment), the coach should be given a chance to modify their behavior.

[MyrddinsPrecint]

thanks everyone.

Well if I face him he could turn it all on me, even if I would say something to someone above him that one could be his buddy and say it isn´t a big deal or that it´s all in my head.
Actually I have something that he would have a difficult time explaining to someone else. I´ll see what I´ll do, maybe talk to the regional board.

If you can't offer him specific things he does to make you uncomfortable, then he may try to push blame on you. If you do, then all he can *reasonably* do is perhaps come up with specific things you have done that you can change---- because you might be doing something that makes him think his actions are appropriate. If he just tries to push blame on you unreasonably, Ignore it. So what. He's wrong.


His superior might be his friend, and might ignore you. But here's the thing--- If that person is really his friend, they will listen to you, and try to solve the problem. Because everyone's life is better if you don't feel uncomfortable. Even if everything is entirely in your head (which I don't believe), your coach could end up sued, the club could end up sued, or there could just be bad press. So even if you were CRAZY and making it up, it would be in the best interest of someone higher up than him to make sure it gets resolved.

And even ignoring that part, it is possible to be someone's friend and think that something that they have done is wrong.

And if the superior does ignore?? Then there's a bigger problem.


In this case, assuming we're still in "harassment" rather than "assault", I agree with everyone else. Talk to the person, talk to the supervisor, and only then start talking to higher up authorities. Especially since you lose credibility if you don't first talk to the people more directly involved.

Take notes. Have witnesses.

[yazzywazzy]

At the risk of seeming unsympathetic (which I'm not, believe me) I think this merits highlighting; some people are just really oblivious to societal norms and don't realize they're making other people uncomfortable until you point it out to them.

It's quite true especially if your coach is not a local. I know of some friends who had an Italian classmate and he wouldn't mind getting touchy with even an acquaintance.

The best thing to do is still is to tell him in the face. Then again even if the problem is resolved it might still feel awkward.

[hello?]

It's quite true especially if your coach is not a local. I know of some friends who had an Italian classmate and he wouldn't mind getting touchy with even an acquaintance.

The best thing to do is still is to tell him in the face. Then again even if the problem is resolved it might still feel awkward.

I was going to suggest that one of the nice things about fencing is that it brings people together from different nationalities, different ages, different backgrounds...but this can also create problems. I agree with what everyone has suggested: talk to the coach first (with a friendly witness). Otherwise you might be getting someone in trouble for something he might have been brought up to regard as natural (I am not saying this is the case -- obviously, only you have all the facts).

[D+F+P=Hadouken!]

If you're over 18, and your coach is being flirty, just leave. Be a grown-up.

Don't be a whiny *****.

If you're under 18, then talk to your parents.