The Voting Process

[jjefferies]

Just wanted to make sure I understand the important details about the USFA election.
1. I believe the important dates are :
May 15,2008 for ballots to be mailed out
June 25, 2008 for ballots to be returned. And that is postmarked not arrival.
2. Where do the Ballots go to? USFA Offices? (stmnt: not that it matters. just curious.)
3. Who does the tabulating/counting?
4. The vote is by secret ballot. But is there anyway to tell anything about the voting, i.e. Division, Section? Whatever. The results by geographic region might be very interesting perhaps even useful.

Are there any other details that warrant mentioning, Caveats, gotchas?
Mostly I'm just curious but, arbitration aside, think it behooves everyone involved, including those of us who are on the sidelines arguing, debating, poking and prodding that there are no questions, loose ends left unresolved. After the election is over I for one really don't want to have any doubts that the election was anything but correct.

[pacer]

Well, the family got their ballots today - and I can answer the questions:

1. -must be returned no later than June 25
2. - the enclosed envelope is addressed to USFA "attn 2008 election"
3. - doesn't say who tabulates
4. - the outside of the return envelope states;"for this ballot to be valid,you must sign, date, indicate your USFA member number below..." The ballot itself says that to preserve the secrecy of your vote,ballots will be separated from the envelopes in which they are received after the information provided by the member on the envelope is used to validate his or her eligibility to vote in this election." If handled that way, it should be secret.

[jjefferies]

Well, the family got their ballots today - and I can answer the questions:

Great, new question though. I have heard that the USFFC is having a web seminar and it's on the ballot. Is that for this sunday?

J.

[T]

Yes, we have a live webinar with the USFFC candidates on Sunday, May 18 at 7pm Eastern. The ballots were supposed to go out last week -- allowing plenty of time for everyone to receive the information about the webinar. Unfortunately, the USFA delayed the mailings so our message may be received belatedly.

Last time, when we recorded the webinar, we had audio problems but we have resolved the technical problem so we will be recording and posting the webinar to our website on Monday.

If you want to attend the webinar, you need to register at
https://www2.gotomeeting.com/register/598811492

and to find out more, you can visit our website

[bigdawg2121]

How does the webinar work? Why do I need long distance in addition to the web? Enlighten me. Seriously. I need to know whether or not I want to do this or if it's going to be cumbersome and possibly cut into my karaoke time



Edit: only the part about the karaoke was meant to be tongue in cheek.

[Inquartata]

Perhaps we can get Jimmy Carter to observe the vote counting, just to forestall the otherwise inevitable charges of ballot fraud by the "existing power structure" should the FFC slate lose?

[mfp]

The ballots ask for voters to indicate their first, second and third preference for Vice Presidents ... Is this election using some sort of preferential voting system?

If so, what system? And why didn't the Election Committee bother to tell the voters in the ballot mailer?

[T]

The ballots ask for voters to indicate their first, second and third preference for Vice Presidents ... Is this election using some sort of preferential voting system?

If so, what system? And why didn't the Election Committee bother to tell the voters in the ballot mailer?

there are 3 VP spots for the USFA. The top 3 vote-getters are the new VPs.

[T]

How does the webinar work? Why do I need long distance in addition to the web? Enlighten me. Seriously. I need to know whether or not I want to do this or if it's going to be cumbersome and possibly cut into my karaoke time



Edit: only the part about the karaoke was meant to be tongue in cheek.

You need a telephone to hear the audio. You can login and see the video portion - which are powerpoint slides but you won't be able to hear the audio portion unless you call in. This is a common format for online meetings and Go-To-Meetings is a leader in the industry.

[mfp]

there are 3 VP spots for the USFA. The top 3 vote-getters are the new VPs.

Duh and duh.

The question is how does the election committee define the top 3 vote getters.

Are all votes considered equal? If so, then why does the ballot explicity ask for numbered preferences?

Or are the preferences used in a ranked voting system? And if so, which system?

[HDG]

Duh and duh.

The question is how does the election committee define the top 3 vote getters.

Are all votes considered equal? If so, then why does the ballot explicity ask for numbered preferences?

Or are the preferences used in a ranked voting system? And if so, which system?

And will my ballot be excluded for not bothering to read that part and just marking three candidates?

[arc]

3. Who does the tabulating/counting?
4. The vote is by secret ballot. But is there anyway to tell anything about the voting, i.e. Division, Section? Whatever. The results by geographic region might be very interesting perhaps even useful.

The ballots ask for voters to indicate their first, second and third preference for Vice Presidents ... Is this election using some sort of preferential voting system?

If so, what system? And why didn't the Election Committee bother to tell the voters in the ballot mailer?

Y'know, I think I could vent at length here about the fact that I and others have noted that people could probably answer most of these types of questions themselves if they would bother to ready the Bylaws. Since it seems no one can be bothered with that, though ...

Art. XIII, Sec. 5(e) expressly provides that the Election Committee is responsible for tabulating ballots.

Art. XIII, Sec. 7(b) states that preferential balloting shall be used in any election for which more than three candidates have qualified. The precise details of such a system is not specified, but is up to the Election Committee to design.

[mfp]

Art. XIII, Sec. 7(b) states that preferential balloting shall be used in any election for which more than three candidates have qualified. The precise details of such a system is not specified, but is up to the Election Committee to design.

Part of the design might include telling the voters (and candidates) what that system is.

Borda count? Borda-like? Bucklin? Something completely different that starts with a B? The Baumgart?

Preferential / ranked voting systems have interesting properties. Some can be susceptible to gaming by blocks of voters.

And will my ballot be excluded for not bothering to read that part and just marking three candidates?

Simply marking three candidates doesn't work for preferential voting so any such ballots would need to be excluded for the VP part it would seem.

I wonder how many ballots will end up "spoiled" that way.

[HDG]

Simply marking three candidates doesn't work for preferential voting so any such ballots would need to be excluded for the VP part it would seem.

I wonder how many ballots will end up "spoiled" that way.

Depends how many other dumbasses like me are out there...

[cbcarey]

Should I have already received this in the mail? I have three comp memebers in my house, and have received nothing. I am going to ask at BFC tonight and see if others have received.

[dberke]

Should I have already received this in the mail? I have three comp memebers in my house, and have received nothing. I am going to ask at BFC tonight and see if others have received.

Ashley told me the ballots were sent out last Thursday, so I guess it just is a matter of how long the postal service takes to move mail from Colorado Springs to your house.

I would think that everyone should have their ballots by the end of this week.

Dan

[gorgie101]

I got my ballot Saturday as did my husband. I know that at least two of our club members also got their ballots on Saturday becuase they called wanting to know what it was all about.

[Capt. Slo-mo]

Hmmm...I've got a ballot, but can't find my USFA card for the required membership number. Is it listed somewhere on-line , or do I have to send an e-mail to the NO?

It was on my desk until just a couple of weeks ago. I suspect skullduggery!

[jjefferies]

Y'know, I think I could vent at length here about the fact that I and others have noted that people could probably answer most of these types of questions themselves if they would bother to ready the Bylaws. Since it seems no one can be bothered with that, though ...

HEY! If you don't feel like answering then don't. No one says that just because you are/were the chairman of the nominating committee that you have to. As regards the Bylaws, the section you cited:

Art. XIII, Sec. 5(e) expressly provides that the Election Committee is responsible for tabulating ballots.

1. I believe you are citing the wrong Art. ArtXIII, Sec 5 deals with quorums in the USFA congress. I believe you are actually meaning Art XXV Elections.

2. Further the correct article does not agree with your statement. It says
"e) The Election Committee shall be responsible to fairly administer the
election of National officers and balloting on other issues brought before the membership."
The question originally asked is who tabulates the votes. The election committee has the responsibility to administer but I find nothing in the By-Laws (sacred as they may be) which specifies who will do the actual counting.

So it is entirely possible that the election committee will count up the votes (please no cracks about if they can count that high ) or they could have an outside party tabulate the results. One might wonder if they have thought that far ahead.

And say Arc, I understand that you may be new to this medium. But a suggestion, when you feel like venting it's always best to take a deep breath and think about it a while. And remember there are some of us here who are licensed to FLAME. But who have learned that it doesn't really help civil discourse. My most recent personal favorite bit of wit is that "The only stupid question is one you didn't ask"

[mfp]

Hmmm...I've got a ballot, but can't find my USFA card for the required membership number. Is it listed somewhere on-line , or do I have to send an e-mail to the NO?

USFA member numbers for the entire country are listed online in the CSV file here:

http://www.usfencing.org/usfa/compon...,select/id,56/