What Debate?

[jjefferies]

I came back from the PCC's to find all these threads titled DEBATE QUESTION. But I don't find any debate. Each one appears to me to be a loaded question by one of the Mass MAFIA or their minions directed at Tracy Hurley. I haven't read all of the posts but it appears that Mrs Hurley has tried to make a reasonable response to most of the questions, only to have the poster or ally attempt to discredit the response.

That's not the important debate which should be between the candidates. More importantly the questions appear to me to be directed soley at the USFFC. Where is Kalle Weeks? In Hiding?

Which raises a BIG issue for me, CHARACTER. THE USFA is at a critical juncture. I'm not at all pleased by the idea of another passive individual at the helm. I watched the ?interview?/video of Ms Weeks. She comes across to me as a very nice person. But not one who can stand up to confrontation.

If you want an honest debate then bring Ms Weeks into it and lets hear from both parties.

[KShan5[PrFC]]

Well to be fair you've heard from Roberto Sobalvarro, Mark Stasinos, Brad Baker and Greg Dilworth. Plus, many of their responses are formed together as a group. If you want to hear from the candidates, where is anyone from the USFFC slate besides Tracy Hurley??

[seak]

Also to be fair the first one (Women's Epee) wasn't posted by someone in Massachusetts. Basically they're just election questions people want answers too. Some of them are a little loaded () other's aren't, and answers have come from both sides.

Feel free to post your own

[tchwojko]

Originally Posted by jjefferies

I came back from the PCC's to find all these threads titled DEBATE QUESTION. But I don't find any debate. Each one appears to me to be a loaded question by one of the Mass MAFIA or their minions directed at Tracy Hurley.

With no vested interest in either side, I didn't find most of the questions loaded (not sure about the Flying Spaghetti Monster...).

And using the term MAFIA I'm sure isn't loaded with any other connotation at all...

Do you have different questions you'd like asked? I haven't tried in this subforum, but I'm pretty sure it's pretty straightforward to start a thread...

[jjefferies]

Originally Posted by KShan5[PrFC]

Well to be fair you've heard from Roberto Sobalvarro, Mark Stasinos, Brad Baker and Greg Dilworth. Plus, many of their responses are formed together as a group. If you want to hear from the candidates, where is anyone from the USFFC slate besides Tracy Hurley??

Excellent point. I would like to hear from them all.
But it's the Presidential candidates that I'm most interested in.

Minor Quibble: But it would be nice if they used their own names. I've started a little directory of who's who but it's not complete and I hate having to go back and look up who I'm hearing from. "T"s easy enough even for me to remember. Besides which I watched all of the Soprano's.

[KShan5[PrFC]]

Originally Posted by jjefferies

Excellent point. I would like to hear from them all.
But it's the Presidential candidates that I'm most interested in.

Minor Quibble: But it would be nice if they used their own names. I've started a little directory of who's who but it's not complete and I hate having to go back and look up who I'm hearing from. "T"s easy enough even for me to remember. Besides which I watched all of the Soprano's.

Which one is confusing besides Brad (oiuyt and he was on fnet well before the election)? Greg_D, mdstasinos. Those are all names.

[gorgie101]

Originally Posted by jjefferies

Snip-

I haven't read all of the posts but it appears that Mrs Hurley has tried to make a reasonable response to most of the questions, only to have the poster or ally attempt to discredit the response.

Snip-

I think that perhaps you should try to read ALL of the election posts. I realize that it might be time consuming to do so but it saves having the same questions asked over and over...

I would also suggest visiting BOTH slates websites. Much of what has been posted here is available there too.

Edit to add:

http://usfencersforchange.com/ and http://usfanominees.com/

[jjefferies]

Originally Posted by gorgie101

I think that perhaps you should try to read ALL of the election posts. I realize that it might be time consuming to do so but it saves having the same questions asked over and over...

Here we go again.
If you haven't read all the posts on f.net, memorized the USOC bylaws and minutes USFA bylaws and committee reports, the Operations Manual, The Division Manual,The Athlete's Handbook, attended all the BOD meetings for the past 20 years, the section and division meetings then you're really not fit to have an opinion. And it bothers some folks so much that with an alternate slate we can now vote as well. Some would say we should have continued as in all the past years and left it to the Nominating Committee.

Hmm, is there a sarcasm flag that I should attach to the above? I don't see one in the menu bar.

[KatyFencing]

I am sorry that I was not able to post here often before. I attempted many times before but my posts were not allowed until recently. I think that there was bug that Craig corrected. Tracy even had to post for me before on some of the ideas we had to increase fencing.

We still are getting tied up in personalities. What are the programs and platforms? How will each side deal with the fact that in many divisions some clubs are prevented from hosting tournaments, or in some divisions tournaments are limited?

Here is our plan for dealing with this. If there is not a specific event in that division that day then a USFA committee comprised of a person from each section will be petitioned. The sectional representative from that section will abstain. If the committee approves, then that tournament will sanctioned. There will be a timing issue for prior approval and the contact person and form.

Currently, clubs can't run the tournament if the local division does not sanction because of the insurance requirements.

Next, I will discuss how to put Fencing on TV.

[tchwojko]

Originally Posted by KatyFencing

Next, I will discuss how to put Fencing on TV.

Could you also please discuss the goals for having fencing televised? (i.e Why invest in that medium?)

[mtarascio]

Originally Posted by KatyFencing

Currently, clubs can't run the tournament if the local division does not sanction because of the insurance requirements.

This is incorrect. A USFA member club that has insurance through the USFA may conduct a tournament without being sanctioned by the Division and be covered by this insurance.

[KShan5[PrFC]]

Originally Posted by jjefferies

Excellent point. I would like to hear from them all.
But it's the Presidential candidates that I'm most interested in.

Minor Quibble: But it would be nice if they used their own names. I've started a little directory of who's who but it's not complete and I hate having to go back and look up who I'm hearing from. "T"s easy enough even for me to remember. Besides which I watched all of the Soprano's.

On second thought, I had no idea KatyFencing was August. That screenname is absurdly confusing.

[fencinginDC]

Please be careful about making statements like this. A club can hold a tournament, with no more than three clubs, and it would be classified as an "activity", like a practice tournament. It would be covered by liability insurance, but it would specifically not be USFA sanctioned and ratings could not be awarded. Those are important details.

Originally Posted by mtarascio

This is incorrect. A USFA member club that has insurance through the USFA may conduct a tournament without being sanctioned by the Division and be covered by this insurance.

[whtouche]

Originally Posted by jjefferies

--snip--
the Mass MAFIA or their minions
--snip--
Where is Kalle Weeks? In Hiding?
--snip--
Which raises a BIG issue for me, CHARACTER.
--snip--

Quoted for extreme irony.

Even tho your post is less than deserving of a serious response (I believe) I still feel the need to make a cursory attempt. Many good points have already been made by people who are not me (nor, to my knowledge, a part of The Family) so I only have a few comments.

The first is that if you feel that a certain section of the population here on fencing.net is unfairly dominating or steering the discourse, then by all means grab the wheel and right the ship. Honestly, to my knowledge none of the Massachusetts capos hold moderator status on this board - you are literally free to post your own topics directed at people of your choosing containing questions of your own phrasing.

But if you do so you should understand that the nature of this board is that it is a public forum, which means anybody with the inclination is free to post their thoughts. It is probably misleading to view any of these threads as a debate between candidates; rather they are public discussions to which the candidates are invited to respond, and we are all of us on every side lucky that they take the time to do so.

Think of it as the concept of open source applied to a political election. Obviously the fencing.net population is not representative of the fencing public at large (or at least can not be known to be) but the fact that we all have access to these discussions and now to the candidates, we are able to shape the discussions and move them in directions which are important to us. That means you too.

As I have explained to another member of this board via PM, often what you perceive as piling on / ganging up etc of a group of this community on one of the candidates is actually mounting frustration over the avoidance of direct questions. It is certainly true that some people on this board have a pretty good idea about which of the candidates would be best for the job, but for the most part I don't think that makes the questions out of line. The kind of "play nice" mentality you seem to be advocating is in large part responsible for essentially the death or substantial degradation of the quality or even existence of actual journalism in this country. We are mostly adults here, and as a result I think we can have debates with actual substance, where difficult questions are asked, where disagreements are openly acknowledged and discussed without anyone's feelings being hurt. Nobody is here to impugn anybody on a personal level.

So by all means, don't feel stifled by what appears to be a majority side which has so far been dominating and directing most of the debate. Start your own threads, ask your own specific questions that are important to you, of the people who you want to hear from. I think everyone in this community and the fencing community in general will benefit from a broadening of horizons, because believe it or not we are not all mindless drones; the more facts we have, the better equipped we all are to make an informed decision. Please keep that in mind before making any more inflammatory posts.

No hard feelings.

[jjefferies]

Originally Posted by whtouche

Quoted for extreme irony.
:;
No hard feelings.

Paranoia is just good sense if people are actually out to get you.
No hard feelings.

__________________
No hard feelings Mr. Teapot. I'm sure they're out there for you.

[telkanuru]

I personally prefer to think of us less like a Mafia and more like an Illuminati.

[KD5MDK]

Out of 6 thread with "DEBATE" in their title (not counting this one)
2 are from people from Texas (and they're minions of nobody)
3 from Massachusetts
1 is from Virginia.

I watched the ?interview?/video of Ms Weeks. She comes across to me as a very nice person. But not one who can stand up to confrontation.

How many national bout committee chairs are you familiar with who were selected with an inability to stand up to confrontation? It's the primary portion of their job description.

[Mo]

Originally Posted by KD5MDK

How many national bout committee chairs are you familiar with who were selected with an inability to stand up to confrontation? It's the primary portion of their job description.

That is sooo true. Not only can Ms. Weeks stand up to people who are almost beside themselves with upsettedness, (I just made up that word) but she helps them in such a manner that most leave mollified.
I've seen her in action having served on the bout committee. The woman can handle a crowd or a single person. She knows her stuff.
She can also delegate, handle ten million things at once and knit. What more can do you want?

The Momster

[mdstasinos]

Kalle is extremely detailed, knowledgeable and respectful in dealing with either a single individual or a large group.
Mark Stasinos
http://www.usfanominees.com